Is judo really any good?
- Thread starter Cowboy Preacher
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Para Bellum
New member
Ju-Jutsu
Judo is the competition-version of Ju-Jutsu. Ju-do means the soft way. Soft because all the nasty and very effective stuff has been left aside to make competition possibe (compete more than once in a lifetime). If you need a combat training go for jiu-jitsu, the modern ju-jutsu. It's the most complete system I know.
Judo is a great sport.
By the way: There is no "bad" system. Their's only a lot of weak fighthers.
Judo is the competition-version of Ju-Jutsu. Ju-do means the soft way. Soft because all the nasty and very effective stuff has been left aside to make competition possibe (compete more than once in a lifetime). If you need a combat training go for jiu-jitsu, the modern ju-jutsu. It's the most complete system I know.
Judo is a great sport.
By the way: There is no "bad" system. Their's only a lot of weak fighthers.
Blind Tree Frog
New member
That's the first time I've heard anyone say it that way.
-Do and -itsu are two common endings to japanese martial arts. -Do traditionally refers to styles that refine the self while -itsu are referring to styles with a focus on battle.
Judo was developed because the technique that was being used to teach jujitsu was "Send people into battle, if they come back alive, they get promoted" pretty much. Judo came about because it was changed just enough that they could actually teach it in classrooms. Granted, the black belt testing still consisted of sending students into the redlight district and having them pick fights, but overall it was much safer to teach in classes.
The sport aspect came many many years later.
Blind Tree Frog
New member
The last thread we had on similar matters:
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44825&highlight=judo+jujistu
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44825&highlight=judo+jujistu
Did he start with the same exact attack 3 times in a row, even though it didn't work the first two times or am I watching this wrong?
4RHeritage
Inactive
Best for self defense
The only thing I learned from judo of any value was how to fall down without getting hurt. If you want to learn real martial arts for self defense then the hands down winner is Wing Tsun, of the Leung Ting school, he is the deadliest man on the planet. However, this may not be available in your area, so Aikido is a useful alternative. If you want to learn how to survive on the street, without taking years of martials arts, you may want to consider a Jim Wagner course.
Wing Tsun
Jim Wagner
The only thing I learned from judo of any value was how to fall down without getting hurt. If you want to learn real martial arts for self defense then the hands down winner is Wing Tsun, of the Leung Ting school, he is the deadliest man on the planet. However, this may not be available in your area, so Aikido is a useful alternative. If you want to learn how to survive on the street, without taking years of martials arts, you may want to consider a Jim Wagner course.
Wing Tsun
Jim Wagner
Para Bellum
New member
Krav Mager Maor
If you have a ccw weapon and just want to get your hands free and 2 meters of distance again, and have no classical martial arts background, Krav Mager Maor might be right for you: Easy to learn and effective.
If you also want to be able to finish a fight and fight on the ground, jiu-jitsu is my recommendation. But this takes time to get good with. If you finally are, you cold be more effective on short ranges with your body than with a gun...
and here's just the standard boiler-plate from my website:
The martial arts can be divided into three fields: Self-Defence, Martial Sports and so-called "Soft" Martial Arts.
Self-Defence need not be graceful, fair or an appropriate subject of competition. It need only be effective and easy to recall. Focussing on real-life situations, self-defence systems need to provide for appropriate and reliable ways for a suprised defendant to protect him/herself without taking risks. Self-defence therefore rather be radical and simple. The best self-defence system I know is http://www.atk.at.
Martial Sports have a totally different aim. Though they mostly originated from real-life combat techniques, they have changed in order to give a forum for fair competition. Sometimes they are as far away from self-defence as olympic fencing is from an ancient swordfight. They give rise to tremendous athletic and acrobatic performance. Such Martial Sports are e.g. TaeKwonDo, Judo, Karate, Wrestling and (Kick-) Boxing.
"Soft" Martial Arts should not be misunderstood. Although they focus on the art as such, they can be very tough. Usually they take very long to be learned and don't provide a forum for competition. E.g. Aikido and Chinese Kung-Fu Styles are usually neither practiced for athletic nor self-defence purposes. However, they can be extremly demanding and effective once one has reached master's skills.
If you have a ccw weapon and just want to get your hands free and 2 meters of distance again, and have no classical martial arts background, Krav Mager Maor might be right for you: Easy to learn and effective.
If you also want to be able to finish a fight and fight on the ground, jiu-jitsu is my recommendation. But this takes time to get good with. If you finally are, you cold be more effective on short ranges with your body than with a gun...
and here's just the standard boiler-plate from my website:
The martial arts can be divided into three fields: Self-Defence, Martial Sports and so-called "Soft" Martial Arts.
Self-Defence need not be graceful, fair or an appropriate subject of competition. It need only be effective and easy to recall. Focussing on real-life situations, self-defence systems need to provide for appropriate and reliable ways for a suprised defendant to protect him/herself without taking risks. Self-defence therefore rather be radical and simple. The best self-defence system I know is http://www.atk.at.
Martial Sports have a totally different aim. Though they mostly originated from real-life combat techniques, they have changed in order to give a forum for fair competition. Sometimes they are as far away from self-defence as olympic fencing is from an ancient swordfight. They give rise to tremendous athletic and acrobatic performance. Such Martial Sports are e.g. TaeKwonDo, Judo, Karate, Wrestling and (Kick-) Boxing.
"Soft" Martial Arts should not be misunderstood. Although they focus on the art as such, they can be very tough. Usually they take very long to be learned and don't provide a forum for competition. E.g. Aikido and Chinese Kung-Fu Styles are usually neither practiced for athletic nor self-defence purposes. However, they can be extremly demanding and effective once one has reached master's skills.
As has been stated before, the instructor is extremely important factor.
However, IMHO Judo can be one of the more effective of the martial arts from the standpoint that you regularly practice against a stongly resisting opponent.
Judo, Wrestling, Brazilian Jui-Jitsu, Boxing, Muy-Tai and perhaps a few are examples of arts where your opponent is actually trying to either pin you, force you to submit, or knock you out. These are MUCH closer simulations for self defense than point sparring or saying "I could knee you in the groin if you did that" (whiney voice).
In Judo you are tested almost every time you practice to see if you TRUELY know how to make that throw, armlock, block, etc. work against someone who is trying to do the same to you. To me it is an excellent balance between practicing safely and developing EFFECTIVE self defense techniques.
Martin
PS The following is a good forum for martial arts related stuff:
http://www.fightingarts.com/
However, IMHO Judo can be one of the more effective of the martial arts from the standpoint that you regularly practice against a stongly resisting opponent.
Judo, Wrestling, Brazilian Jui-Jitsu, Boxing, Muy-Tai and perhaps a few are examples of arts where your opponent is actually trying to either pin you, force you to submit, or knock you out. These are MUCH closer simulations for self defense than point sparring or saying "I could knee you in the groin if you did that" (whiney voice).
In Judo you are tested almost every time you practice to see if you TRUELY know how to make that throw, armlock, block, etc. work against someone who is trying to do the same to you. To me it is an excellent balance between practicing safely and developing EFFECTIVE self defense techniques.
Martin
PS The following is a good forum for martial arts related stuff:
http://www.fightingarts.com/
Judo, like many other martial arts, can be used effectively.
As one or two others have said, there is no "deadliest martial art", striking or otherwise. There are generally effective arts, and there are deadly people.
I agree that it's good to have a wide range of tools in your armory, but I also tend to agree that it's better to have them come from a comprehensive school than a buffet of arts.
Maybe you could think of it like this: you could take a Hemi V8, which works great in a Chrysler, add to it a turbocharger that does wonders for an Eclipse, and toss in a fuel injector that does a bang-up job in Audi. Though these parts may work very well for their intended vehicles, there is no guarantee that they will perform well with each other. Just a thought.
John
As one or two others have said, there is no "deadliest martial art", striking or otherwise. There are generally effective arts, and there are deadly people.
I agree that it's good to have a wide range of tools in your armory, but I also tend to agree that it's better to have them come from a comprehensive school than a buffet of arts.
Maybe you could think of it like this: you could take a Hemi V8, which works great in a Chrysler, add to it a turbocharger that does wonders for an Eclipse, and toss in a fuel injector that does a bang-up job in Audi. Though these parts may work very well for their intended vehicles, there is no guarantee that they will perform well with each other. Just a thought.
John
SIGLOCKAUR
New member
My main art is Tang Soo Do in which I am a 5th Degree Black Belt. My instructor was also a Blact belt in Judo. I can tell you this. Twice I have used simple hip throw and it saved the bacon. One guy was charging me. Just rolled right with him. The other grabbed my coat in the winter and ended up on his back. As someone said cement is a good landingstriop for jets. The fight was pretty much over after the throws. The choke holds I've also found to be very useful. I do think you also need some basis in a striking art also. Check out some Jiu-Jitsu clubs. These usually include strikes as well as throws, locks, and chokes. Mr. Kano took techniques from Jiu-Jitsu to form the sport of Judo.
coolridelude
New member
i second tangsoodo. and boxing, and and ground fighting. 
Blind Tree Frog
New member
Yes, but modern jui jitsu was derived from judo. It shares little with traditional jui jitsu outside of the name.
Sorry that just irks me a bit.
SIGLOCKAUR
New member
Didn't mean to irk you BLINDTREEFROG. I see what your saying about modern JiuJitsu. I'm not an expert on grappling arts but I thought some traditional styles of JiuJitsu still existed. Their was a Mr. Ping up North who taught what he said was a traditional style of JiuJitsu that included kicks and handstrikes.He was pretty impressive. Anyways as I said the Judo I learned from my instuctor served me well in many situations. As you well know sometimes our opponents can get up on us fast. That's why knowledge of grappling is a must. I used the jointlocks some, the chokes more, and the throws, takedowns, and so on much more. Going back to the original question yes judo can be quite effective. Add a striking art and your good to go. The chokes also are a great way to change someones mind fast!
futureforcewarrior22
New member
I'm partial to Krav Maga, Karate and Pi Qua Quan.
Pi Qua Quan is hard though, but once you get it down pat, it can be quite effective in certain circumstances. To me, it's main focus seems to be keeping your opponent at bay as you back off or to drive them foreward. But, that's just my thinking.
Pi Qua Quan is hard though, but once you get it down pat, it can be quite effective in certain circumstances. To me, it's main focus seems to be keeping your opponent at bay as you back off or to drive them foreward. But, that's just my thinking.
Blind Tree Frog
New member
Sorry, I've been bitter in general as of late.
But to elaborate, my understanding of the history was Juijitsu was there, but the training was rather brutal. Judo was developed to be a bit more friendly training wise. Judo was selected for official pruposes and juijitsu pretty much died out. Probably a few schools of it still around, but what people refer to as JJ today (specifically BJJ) is derived from one of the judo schools.
Course, if you go to a TKD school they'll say it came from Korea and that they dominate the sport so what can you do. Everyone is an ******* (but mainly me).
And I've been to a Judo school that tought punches and kicks. Originally Judo had punches and kicks (infact, as I remember it, the original "black belt" qualificaiton was to go pick a fight in the red light district and drop your opponent with one strike). Just depends where you go and if it's a sport orient school or combat.
I know this was a really old post, but this quote bugs me...
Rick
In my experience, Aikido does not use Katas at all except for weapons training. It's almost exclusively "full contact" and randori since the techniques can be done without inflicting any injury. That's one of the reasons why it is such a good method of self defense if you're committed to training in it.
Rick
I know this is an old thread and probably has been addressed almost as many times as.."what is the most effective caliber" argument. I just wanted to state that there is no "Deadliest" martial art, or "Ultimate" etc. I agree with Blind Tree Frog, in that anyone who starts spouting such garbage is an amateur, even with years of experience behind them. Any true Martial Artist knows that any style can be effective, formidable and dangerous. I have been training Martial Arts for the better part of my whole life, I have trained diligently and daily for 30 years. I have partnered up and been involved with a number of different styles and have always found the subtle nuances about all the styles facinating.
Fact, I love Judo, I did not study the sport Judo, when I trained, we did not have weight classes or age brackets...heck, it was matching up people according to the color of belt and letting em go at it. I love Tae Kwon Do, I did not study the sport Tae Kwon Do, my Teacher spent years instructing the Korean Military and used his knowledge in battle, we did not spend the all too familiar majority of time on Kicks vs. Hands, there were alot of grabbing, chopping, smashing, locks and dis-locations. Fact of the matter is, Tae Kwon Do is a very formidable style. It is this new sport stuff that has everyone thinking it is not effective. I also spent a few years adding some Hung Gar Kung Fu, Choi Li Fut, Aikido, Kendo, Muy Thai (I really like the leg kicks of this style), Hapkido (much like the TKD), Kyokushinkai Karate and most recently have played around with Mixed Martial Arts, I like this stuff because it incorporates sooo many posiblities, with the exception of getting it on with multiple attackers. As for the Video of Royce and the Kick boxer, nice!! I love to see different styles get it on. I had myself once "sparred" with a BJJ artist that claimed his 15 years of training had made him pretty much invincible (at that point I knew he was an amateur)...I let him close on me and as he went for my hips, i rolled with his grapple and hit him in his temple with Thumb Knuckle attack (Oya yubi), he was out! BJJ is a formidable style, just not this particular loudmouth. Yes, I have been blasted into the next dimension myself a time or two. There is NO ultimate style...PERIOD!!!
The moral of this rant...pick a style, any style...train with diligence and determination.
By the way...uh, yeah, Judo is a good style.
Fact, I love Judo, I did not study the sport Judo, when I trained, we did not have weight classes or age brackets...heck, it was matching up people according to the color of belt and letting em go at it. I love Tae Kwon Do, I did not study the sport Tae Kwon Do, my Teacher spent years instructing the Korean Military and used his knowledge in battle, we did not spend the all too familiar majority of time on Kicks vs. Hands, there were alot of grabbing, chopping, smashing, locks and dis-locations. Fact of the matter is, Tae Kwon Do is a very formidable style. It is this new sport stuff that has everyone thinking it is not effective. I also spent a few years adding some Hung Gar Kung Fu, Choi Li Fut, Aikido, Kendo, Muy Thai (I really like the leg kicks of this style), Hapkido (much like the TKD), Kyokushinkai Karate and most recently have played around with Mixed Martial Arts, I like this stuff because it incorporates sooo many posiblities, with the exception of getting it on with multiple attackers. As for the Video of Royce and the Kick boxer, nice!! I love to see different styles get it on. I had myself once "sparred" with a BJJ artist that claimed his 15 years of training had made him pretty much invincible (at that point I knew he was an amateur)...I let him close on me and as he went for my hips, i rolled with his grapple and hit him in his temple with Thumb Knuckle attack (Oya yubi), he was out! BJJ is a formidable style, just not this particular loudmouth. Yes, I have been blasted into the next dimension myself a time or two. There is NO ultimate style...PERIOD!!!
The moral of this rant...pick a style, any style...train with diligence and determination.
By the way...uh, yeah, Judo is a good style.
Judo
Judo is great! It's saved my bacon several times. It's beauty is in it's philosophy: Instead of asking, "How can I quickly kill/maim my opponent?" it asks "How can I end this quickly without killing or maiming my opponent?"
One interesting twist I've observed is that some judo techniques can be slightly modified to flip a foe squarely onto his head rather than flat on his back, resulting in almost certain spinal injury or death.
The bottom line is that any style can be effective, even deadly.
Judo is great! It's saved my bacon several times. It's beauty is in it's philosophy: Instead of asking, "How can I quickly kill/maim my opponent?" it asks "How can I end this quickly without killing or maiming my opponent?"
One interesting twist I've observed is that some judo techniques can be slightly modified to flip a foe squarely onto his head rather than flat on his back, resulting in almost certain spinal injury or death.
The bottom line is that any style can be effective, even deadly.
Blind Tree Frog
New member
heh, you do the throw right in the first place outside of a mat and they aren't going to be moving anytime soon. No need to worry about dropping them on their head.