is it unlawful?

I did take the class and passed to the highest possibility and was tied for first in completing the test, though that doesn't mean much considering the class is VERY basic. And yes they did cover the use of deadly force. They stated that deadly force can only be used as a last resort and if life is at threat and/or threat of being maimed then deadly force is justified. But as you've read in the OP, I asked a question that can be considered a kinda grey area. Maybe I didn't describe the sanario that I had in mind in enough detail to express the impression a CC would have under the given sanario. I have a very elaborate imagination and do play out a lot of senarios for mental training purposes and as well entertainment purposes, and no, I'm not a psyco that plan out negetive crap, just when negative crap arrises my imagination goes wild in reaction of what happen and how I would have reacted if I was there. I even see in my mind's eye placement of trees, sidewalk, color of brick the building(s) were.

And as you must have read from other repliers, they've seem to at least catch my drift. I deff wouldn't wanna have a grassy arse with the BGs mother holding a weedwacker?

I was just wondering if it would be justified if someone approatched you in intent to cause physical harm and you expressed you did not want to engage in any contact and you stepped backwards giving away alittle bit of ground(and yes, giving ground can be viewed as cowardly, but it does give the perp time to process and to cut the crap) and still the BG is advancing agressivly in evident of causing harm to you, would it be unlawful to draw upon the guy.

And the response I got was pepper spray. Very good response by the way. But by all means your response is valid, it would be a VERY long and expesive day in court if the trigger did have to be pulled and the guy was unarmed. Yay to pepper spray!


Thanks MyXD40 for the more descriptive version of your story. Evidently if I'm the one starting this thread, then obviously I'm no LEO, but from the story you've told I see you justified in drawing. She came at you agressivly under her own will without you promoting her actions in anyway and suggested verbaly you did not want contact and she still advanced, with hand(s) in pocket no less. I'm for one am glad you didn't have to find out what was in her pocket or not.
 
I'm sure I'll have a few haters here on this fourm too becasue of this and my actions!
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The woman should have called the cops and had you arrested.

Based on your posts, you shouldnt be carrying a gun.

WildtimebombAlaska TM
 
I was just wondering if it would be justified if someone approatched you in intent to cause physical harm and you expressed you did not want to engage in any contact and you stepped backwards giving away alittle bit of ground(and yes, giving ground can be viewed as cowardly, but it does give the perp time to process and to cut the crap) and still the BG is advancing agressivly in evident of causing harm to you, would it be unlawful to draw upon the guy.
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Thats exactly what situation I was in. I've been in many serious situations, and only had to draw once (the story I posted). If you feel your life is in danger, do what you gotta do. I didn't shoot the whack job, so everything be fine, but had I shot her, depending if she had anything in her pocket (gun and knife, to go along with her actions)..well the court system and I would have a hay day figuring things out.
 
I've already put myself close to the top of that list on other threads. I wonder if some antigun DA wanting to make a name for himself couldn't go to court to the get the names and addresses of the guys who are clearly to immature to have a CCW permit and get their permits revoked? Then it dawned on me that they probably don't really have a CCW permit because they are 16-19 years old and are just thinking ahead to the day they will get one and how they will act then.
 
XD40 if I understand your description you were on the street not in your yard in a "bad part" of town. I guess my question is how forcefully did you order her to stop or stay away. In all reality it doesn't matter what I or WA or anyone else thinks. But if I LEO was to be approached by someone doing the same thing and they just shot them they would be in hot water and they generally have more lattitude about use of deadly force than civilians.
 
Actually LEO have less latitude in the use of lethal force than the average CCW, at least in most states. Departmental policy even comes into play.
 
XD40 if I understand your description you were on the street not in your yard in a "bad part" of town. I guess my question is how forcefully did you order her to stop or stay away. In all reality it doesn't matter what I or WA or anyone else thinks. But if I LEO was to be approached by someone doing the same thing and they just shot them they would be in hot water and they generally have more lattitude about use of deadly force than civilians.
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I told her countless times to keep moving on, I cant help her, very polite, and nice. As she kept advancing to me, thats when I raised my voice in order to show her I'm not playing around. She was like a 3yr old, kept repeating herself, asking questions "why why why why why". I never once yelled at her, but I did have a forcefull tone.

And I'm sure a few people coughwildalaskacough will be against me, but hey, they wen't there so don't preach what you don't know;) BUT I was put into a position where I couldn't back away. Was either let my dog bite her, then deal with loosing my animal, being sued, whatever it might be, or lower the tailgate on my truck, turn my back on this woman, and as I get my dog out the back, she comes up behinds me and shoots/stab (whatever she had in her pocket, if anything), or did what I did, and hope for the best, whcih is what I got.

So yes, apparently I'm a "time bomb". Did I mention when I was out at starbucks the other day, and the girly made me a hot coffee with cream, instead of a cold coffee with cream, and I pulled out my gun and told her I ment business:rolleyes:

AdamwatchoutpeopleimnutsLayton
 
k squared

All of this talk about pepper spray defusing the situation worries me. I’d think it would have an excellent chance of escalating the situation, especially if you’re faced with a group of punks. If you spray one, you’re going to get the rest really fired up.

Does anyone have experience in a situation like this?
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I would not say that pepper spray always diffuses a situation, but it can help. I used mine one night to convince three geniuses that I did not want any trouble. Seeing one of their buddies writhing in pain made the other two reconsider. Problems would arise if one is armed though.
 
Could be you as well I don't know.....but avenger11 pm'ed me to say nearly exactly what he just posted.........

Anyways, back to the subject. Don't get me wrong, I am not looking forward in feeling I having to shoot anyone. Ok, lets make it alittle easier to asnswer. What would you guys do if someone came at you crazy seeming like they were coming to harm you and you were concealing and had no pepper spray?

Oh, and MyXD40, I must have mistaken something in your story. I thought you meant you were in your yard in front of your company bought house. None the less, if she was that close to you being agressive its not like you could have just jumped in your truck and left or like you mentioned, turn your back and walk away. For one if you turned and walked away you would have had to wrestle your dog to come with you from what it sounded and that would have given her time to advance in your direction(though I see no right minded person coming that close to a growling dog in the first place) And yeah, good idea not letting your dog loose.

Doug, you've got a point, if one of them did have a gun it would have gotten wild. But at least from what I understand, though you wouldn't want to get shot to prove it, but if they did shoot because you pepper sprayed their buddy they'ed get locked up wouldn't they? Considering you would back up while or soon after discharging the pepper spray meaning you were out of physical reach for others to consider you may punch, kick, ninja chop, etc the blind guy.
 
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What I meant about "LEO's have more latitude with deadly force" is that generally it is expected for a LEO to engage (either by talking, etc) a person whether they are acting "normal" or not. A normal joe blow, in the public's mind probably should retreat.

So you drew your gun so your dog wouldn't bite her and your dog might be taken away? To paraphrase you said I either had to let me dog bite her or turn my back on her to get the dog. You couldn't have said "Stay away my dog doesn't do well with strangers"? Listen you obviously think you did the right thing and I wasn't there. But as you said you got grief at XDTalk over the incident so why share it?
 
So you drew your gun so your dog wouldn't bite her and your dog might be taken away? To paraphrase you said I either had to let me dog bite her or turn my back on her to get the dog. You couldn't have said "Stay away my dog doesn't do well with strangers"? Listen you obviously think you did the right thing and I wasn't there.
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I drew my gun because what if she had a gun in her pocket? Remember the baggy white sweatpants? Who knows what she had, but I'd be ready for it. But perhaps she had a knife? Didn't need to tell her my dog doesn't like strangers, he's trying to get out of the back of the truck, growling at her, jerking me around so he can get to her. I mean, he wasn't going ape, but he was moving a bit trying to let me let him go. And by all means, if she had osmething less then a gun, that's what my dog is for. Let him take a bite! let him protect me. But if she had a gun, I wont risk my life against a 1000fps bullet. Takes a split second to pull a trigger, takes a second for my dog to jump out, run to her (few feet) and bit her somewhere.

But as you said you got grief at XDTalk over the incident so why share it?
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I share it because I did nothing wrong. And on this forum for awhile, I know theres not even 1/8th of the know-it-all idiots roaming on this fourm. at xdtalk.com, 1 of 10 people said I was in the right. Clearly people over there just don't think, or are a mirror image to the media, take something, and pick the worst of it to make it the hype.
 
If I understand the situation, why not run back into your house and slam the door?
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Dog in bed of pickup truck. Would have to turn my back on person in order to get dog out. If no dog, yes, walk slowly backwords to my door, no problem.
 
A person who approaches me aggressively with empty hands is a clear threat. Why would he behave that way in the first place should he be sane? He may have a weapon concealed, likely a switch blade knife in his pocket.

Say, "Stop there," and show stop with your hand.

If he is still approaching aggressively with unclear motives, I would back and draw, again saying, "Stop there." If he came inside my comfort zone I would shoot to kill. Once he has his hands around my throat it's too late to draw.

If he backs off as a result of me drawing, I would still call the police and give a description of the madman.
 
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