Is a silencer worth the having?

Let's pretend, for a moment, that there are no legal restrictions on silencers (sound suppressors), and they are not cost prohibitive (theoretically being legal, the prices would be reasonable, as they are in countries where silencers ARE unrestricted). Additonally, let's assume that firearms engineering has resulted in suppressors being built right into the design of a handgun, or rifle, and the size and weight of a suppressd gun is not much more than an unsuppressed one. Now, what would be the reasons for having a suppressed firearm? Simple logic. 1) reduced noise. Less hearing damage to shooter, less disturbing the neighbors, less disturbing game and farm animals, increasing time for the hunt by not scaring the game animals hunted, etc. 2) enhanced performance. Less recoil, less muzzle blast & flash, less flinch, better accuracy (from less flinching), less muzzle rise/faster repeat shots. 3) able to shoot longer hours, and in more places (I once was able to shoot suppressed after midnight until I decided to shoot steel targets, and the impact on the steel ticked off the neighbors (not the gunshot). Had to cool down on that one for awhile:D. Logic seems to tell us that suppressors are quite practical. Only our bias (mostly based on others telling us they are bad, illegal, dangerous, or likely to cause crime ) keeps them from being practical.
 
gyvel, by the Real World, you mean in most US states. It's not too hard to find shooting ranges in most US states.

In a lot of other countries, suppressors are required for range use. Noise complaints from the neighbors, don't you know?

Also, your comment about hearing protection... true, shooters should use it. But the people down the road might actually appreciate suppressors.

I know my Jack Russell would. She hates gunfire and thunderstorms.
 
Logic seems to tell us that suppressors are quite practical.
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They are if you start with these assumptions that you listed:
  • "no legal restrictions"
  • "not cost prohibitive"
  • "firearms engineering has resulted in suppressors being built right into the design"
In reality it's precisely the fact that these assumptions are merely pretend assumptions that reduces their practicality to essentially zero for many people.
Only our bias (mostly based on others telling us they are bad, illegal, dangerous, or likely to cause crime ) keeps them from being practical.
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Bias may keep some people from purchasing suppressors, but bias doesn't make suppressors impractical. What makes them impractical in many people's minds is the things you listed up front in your post as things you were going to pretend didn't exist.

Those things DO exist and that's what keeps them from being practical in many people's minds.
 
Is a silencer worth it? Not for me. I have no practical use for one. If I got one, it would be a novelty more than anything else. Silencers are a personal decision, and it will make more sense to some, but not to me.

If you want one, get one.
 
If there were no restrictions on silencers and suppressed handguns/rifles, then I'd expect that you would see a number of integrally suppressed options out there. It might add a little weight, but it wouldn't throw off the balance as much as a pipe full of washers on the end of your barrel.
 
From what an earlier poster indicated, it sounds like a lot of paperwork, a lot of hassle, and a good chunk of change. I've never shot a suppressed gun before but there's no way I'd use one for HD. The whole point of a pistol over a long gun is the size.

A suppressor for my AR-15 though? That might be fun.... expensive, but fun. Might be hard to get the permit where I live though, because deer poachers often get caught around here with suppressed rifles out of season. The CLEO would probably assume that was what I had in mind if I applied for one. :p
 
Your second example bears out the validity of my observation once the math is corrected.
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The numbers I calulated were percentages of the silencer compared to toal length.

Ranb
 
People can buy whatever they want, thats their business. But last time I checked mufflers are required by law. Suppressor are prohibited by law, unless you get special exceptions.
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Silencer are not prohibited by federal law. There are no special exemptions. All legal silencers are registered. While federal law says a person will not possess a silencer unless authorized by the ATF, authorization is never denied (AFAIK) as long as the forms are filled out correctly.

Obtaining ATF authorization to buy or make a silencer is a routine matter and easier (but more time consuming) than getting your first driver's license. If you have any info concerning a special exemption, let us know, it might be cheaper than paying the $200 tax?

Ranb
 
From what an earlier poster indicated, it sounds like a lot of paperwork, a lot of hassle, and a good chunk of change.
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ATF form 1 or ATF form 4 (2), form 5330.20 (1), finger print cards (2), check or money order for $200. That is not a lot of paperwork. It takes about ten minutes to fill it all out (not incuding the sheriff signature). Piece of cake.

Ranb
 
ATF form 1 or ATF form 4 (2), form 5330.20 (1), finger print cards (2), check or money order for $200. That is not a lot of paperwork. It takes about ten minutes to fill it all out (not incuding the sheriff signature). Piece of cake.
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Don't forget the Trust, if you can't get a CLEO sign-off. And, even if you can, they may have their own investigation for you to go through.
 
Have one on hold till ATF gives me my stamp to pick it up from my dealer.

Going to suppress this one to shoot varments off the porch (rural neighborhood) without drawing attention from the neighbors.

BM.jpg
 
ATF form 1 or ATF form 4 (2), form 5330.20 (1), finger print cards (2), check or money order for $200. That is not a lot of paperwork. It takes about ten minutes to fill it all out (not incuding the sheriff signature). Piece of cake.

Don't forget the Trust, if you can't get a CLEO sign-off. And, even if you can, they may have their own investigation for you to go through
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Yet another reason to move to Sweet Home Alabama. My local Sheriff signed off on mine on his lunch break and said..."have a nice day, ye heer".:D

Oh....and he even called over to the jail and said "I'm sending a fella over...get his finger print cards done." I just love friendly LEO.
 
The numbers I calulated were percentages of the silencer compared to toal length.
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I realized how you obtained your answers when I read them. The problem was that the numbers were not correct for the way they were quoted. You quoted the percentages as additions or increases but they were not additions or increases, they were percentages of the total package AFTER the silencer was added.

You said:
Length added; 5.5 inches (45%).
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Saying the silencer made up 45% of the total length of the package with the silencer installed would have been correct, but it would have just been another way of saying that installing a silencer on the handgun nearly doubled the length.

Saying that the length added by the silencer was 45% is inaccurate. The length added was not 45% it was 87%.

Similarly, the price increase was not 48%, it was essentially a 100% increase--it effectively doubled the price of the package.
... authorization is never denied (AFAIK) as long as the forms are filled out correctly.
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But you and I know that's not the whole story, and also that it's not at all uncommon for a CLEO to refuse to allow the purchase to proceed.

And that's still not the whole story, even after purchasing them, there are often restrictions on using them. You know this because you live in a state where, until only very recently you could own silencers but you couldn't legally use them at all. In my state they can't be used for most types of hunting.

Look, the laws are what they are and silencers are what they are. Can't you guys see that the shady math, poor analogies and partial explanations are NOT helping make the case for how easy silencers are to get or how practical they are. In fact, every time someone stretches, twists or omits some bit of information to try to make silencers look more practical than they are or to seem easier to get than they are it really makes the whole situation seem more and more fishy.
 
I did post a photo and the length in inches added. I also wrote what I paid for the silencers. That my percentages were not clear should not be an issue. I was not trying to hide anything.

Getting the CLEO signature is part filling out the forms. It is not required if a trust is used. Whether or not the purchase is made is not determined by the sheriff but by the ATF. The law says the CLEO only signs for individuals, not business entities. Any person who can own a firearm can also form a trust to own it for them. This is a simple matter.

It is a simple fact that putting a muffler on a gun is the best way to reduce noise and protect hearing as it reduces noise at the source.

Ranb
 
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I did post a photo and the length in inches added. I also wrote what I paid for the silencers. That my percentages were not clear should not be an issue. I was not trying to hide anything.
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Your intent is not important.

The math is wrong.

You computed the percentage as a part of the final product, but labeled it "increase."

For it to be labelled "increase" it needs to be the percentage of the original gun length, not the percentage of the resulting gun length.

If you increase your money by 50%, each dollar becomes $1.50
A 50% percent increase, with the increase being 33% of the final amount.

If you increased your money by 100%, each dollar becomes $2.
A 100% increase, with the increase being 50% of the final amount.
 
Some of you just don't WANT to accept sound suppressors, facts be damned. Let's see. If you live in an area where suppressors are not restricted beyond the federal requirement (and MANY states do not), then it takes about 20 minutes to fill out the paperwork, maybe 30-60 minutes to obtain suitable pictures to apply to the applications, about 60 minutes donated to the fingerprinting and LE signoff. Add 30 minutes to mail the application. This is assuming you have found a Class III dealer or Class II manufacturer to buy it from. Throw in $200 above the cost of a $300-$1000 suppressor, and wait the 4-7 months that the feds probably take now to process, and you have your formidable, terrible, time consuming and privacy intrusive transer application and clearance. Back in the 1930's, $200 was ownership-prohbitive. Nowadays, $200 might be dinner for mom, dad, and the kids at Outback or Longhorn, if they are hungry, or mom and dad are having a few cocktails. In otherwords, $200 ain't squat, and that is the REAL burden, outside of the device itself, to owning a suppressor in silencer-permissive areas. Granted, some people, unfortunately, live in restrictive or prohibitive areas. You people may NEVER get a suppressor the legal way. But, for most, there IS a LEGAL way, and it isn't that hard. Quit saying it is. Just say you don't want to, for whatever reason you have at hand.
 
But how do you really feel????????:D

I got my stamp for one coming....if want one....fine....if you don't ....God speed and party on.
 
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