How Will They Confiscate Your Guns?

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CT There is alway the final option, not very pc but you gotta include it, though it probably goes along with your last as that is the probable outcome of employing it.

"Those that sew the seeds of tyranny will reap the whirlwind of its germination."

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The beauty of the second Amendment is that it is not needed until they try to take it. T JEFFERSON

Do you really think that we want those laws to be observed? We want them broken. We're after power and we mean it. There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breakings laws. Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What's there in that for anyone? But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced nor objectively interpreted-and you create a nation of law breakers--and then you cash in on guilt.

A RAND
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>We already have to ask permission or pay taxes to do just about everything under the sun except take a crap[/quote]

Can you say low flow toilets?

dZ
 
The edges will be nibbled until there is nothing else. By raising the cost and inconvenience of gun ownership, our numbers will be slowly worn away. More importantly, each step in that direction will revise what is normal and acceptable. For instance, to our children, who will never know a magazine holding more than 10 rounds, a 5 or 6 round restriction will be as thinkable the 10 rounders were to us. We will fight registration, our children will wonder what the fuss was about.
 
Simply put, They won't ;)
I think as stupid as these morons are they are smart enough as not to push far enough to open Pendoras Box ;)

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We preserve our freedoms by using four boxes: soap,ballot,jury, and cartridge.
Anonymous
 
I think it's our job to ensure that the situation never gets that far.
Also, I was thinking in the reverse of the current government... if they are worried about saving lives, then why start knocking on doors and tempting fate? They don't care one whit about a life, be it a child or an adult - the administration, that is.
LaPierre hit the nail when the said that Clinton was willing to accept the deaths to achieve his own ends. My opinion.
 
Mr donath is right.

They won't penalize ownership so much as illegal use. If you're caught using a gun without "ze proper credentialz," you're toasted. THEN they'll take your other guns, the same way they take ALL your property if they find some dope in your attic.

Here's what I see happening, realistically:

1. Permits (w/ background check of course) to buy.

2. Licenses to own, for each gun.

3. Licenses to carry specific guns (if they still permit carry)

4. "Authorized Hunting/Target Weapon" license for any gun you want to hunt or match shoot with. With the accompanying penalties for ranges, hunting clubs, gun clubs, etc., of course. See, that way, they make the private citizens responsible for policing their fellow citizens, since a surprise inspection that turns up unlicensed guns on the property results in property forfeiture to the feds. That way, the range owner, etc., has a vested interested in screening folks himself.

This way, they won't have to endure the bureaucratic nightmare of unrealistic door to door searches. They'll just grab you when you make a mistake, break an obscure gun law, etc.

Many of us will be so paranoid and afraid that we'll be cowering in our homes, afraid to use our gun for anything but home defense (which they'll most likely let us do), hoping we don't draw any attention to ourselves.

That is, if we allow it to get that far. If we do, we have no one to blame but ourselves.
 
The greatest problem is that the RKBA cause doesn't have a coherent strategy plan to convice the general public that the right must be protected.

The NRA spends much time trying to raise money from the believers, that's nice but it must try to increase the believer base and expand from a perceived enclave of conservative, white males and their mates.

Laws suits based on the 2nd Amend are fine if we don't lose the big one.

CCW laws are great as they make more folk to take an active decision to own firearms for protection. That is ideologically way different from ducky hunting.

This will insult some but messages based on the UN is coming, protection from foreign invasion just don't cut it. Preaching armed revolution is not going to happen. Also if it came to that - all of you own this board who have exposed that statement are busted very quickly.

Unless you win the minds of the general public, all else is fantasy.

You may hide your guns but you will be like some dude hiding his or her drugs or kiddie porn. Despised by the public and a criminal when discovered.

Good article, thanks for posting it.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR> [/B][/quote]

ax: Very few of them KNOW they want to ban all guns; Most of them just want to keep tightening
the vise until gun control finally works... Which is sort of like bleeding someone until you cure their
anemia! So it amounts to the same thing in the end, the explicit banners are just ahead of the curve.
 
Very insightful article, dz. That's exactly how its going to happen:

1. Media, government pushes the right "buttons" to make the largely non gun-owning public think that guns are a "health" and "safety" issue, not a constitutional right.

2. Government, through the Dept. of Education, portrays guns as instrument of evil and gun owners as uneducated hate-mongers. Children are taught to fear guns, and more importantly, gun owners. A whole generation of anti-gun Americans is created. "Now, Johnny, your Dad doesn't have any guns, does he?"

3. The general public, barraged with daily stories of gun violence due to no enforcement of existing gun laws, re-education by the federal government, and no exposure to the shooting sports, agrees with congress and the president that gun ownership should be illegal. Unfortunately, the supreme court has shifted to an interpreted point of view on the second amendment to include only "the national guard" should have the right to bear arms, and the bill is upheld despite the NRA, GOA, and assorted legal defenses.

4. The government gives gun owners the opportunity to turn in their guns within the deadline. Later, cash is offered to collectors of firearms to help offset the loss financially of their collection. Inquiries are made based on FBI records of NICS approvals, and guns are searched for without the owners notice according to the Hatch Bill...

5. A few armed terrorists, led by a leader known as "Paul Revere", are successfully put down by federal forces. The demands of the terrorists are not known, but they were in possession of illegal firearms. Anyone with firearms is a potential terrorist, and should be turned in. "Johnny, is your dad a terrorist? Tell us, we'll take care of you. You've been abused, haven't you?"

6. People suspected of terrorist activity are put on a watch list. This list is available to every employer in the country. Employment is barred to any person on the list. The terrorists head to Montana to raise cattle and farm the land for food. The children of the slain terrorists are rescued by the federal government. They are taught that just because their daddies were bad men, there's no reason for them to be bad. "Just tell us where those evil guns are, and everything will be OK."

--Chilling, and possible...
 
7. Word spreads of "Paul Revere's" brave but unsuccessful revolt. He becomes a martyr and embodiment of America's founding principles.

8. Taking a lesson from Paul's martyrdom, citizen soldiers pick their targets more carefully, resorting to guerilla tactics and concentrating on influential politicians behind the gun confiscations, high ranking federal employees, and select media big wigs.
Their raids and sniper attacks, while criticized by the media and elected officials, inspire others of like mind, as well as silent cheers by those unwilling to fight.

9. Federal LEOs are routinely attacked as they go about their business all over America. Most of the ATF is killed, the rest resign, and a few are even rumored to have joined the rebels. Enforcing the laws becomes difficult as more and more wind up dead or missing. The president declares martial law and activates the National Guard, 60% of which refuses to take any aggressive actions whatsoever. Regular combat forces are surveyed, and those willing to enforce the law are deployed.

10. In their attempt to take out a large meeting of rebels in a remote mountain cabin, the US government unwittingly kills an entire boy scout troop working on their merit badges. Turns out the rebels had used it the week before. The government claims "full responsibility."

11. Despite propoganda efforts by the government, popular sentiment begins to turn in favor of a peaceful settlement. The rebels refuse to cease fire unless amnesty is granted. Several US states act as mediators in peace talk negotiations. Included is a demand for enforcement of weapons violations to revert to state control. The US balks.

12. Several states refuse to comply with federal laws that infringe upon their autonomy. National Guard armories and personnel are mobilized to defend against federal attacks. The states declare federal revenue raising measures null and void and refuse to participate so long as the threat of force exists.

13. Due to lack of morale, much of the professional army is rendered inoperable. Washington attempts to persuade several states to mobilize against their neighbors. Those states, while maintaining their support for the union, decline to advance upon neighboring states and declare neutrality.

14. The standoff lasts 10 months, during which time very little fighting takes place. Having lost much of their infrastructure due to attrition, a weakened federal government is forced to compromise with the state-backed rebels.

Time marches on.
 
Franklin, I hope you're right, but I fear this story will not have a happy ending...


Once the public debate is over, and the government has brainwashed a generation, no one will have a copy of the constitution, much less the bill of rights...


Doesn't leave too many to join our side, does it?

How many are going to be willing to make their kids orphans and their wives widows? Lose everything they have to fight this fight?

When push comes to shove, what will happen?
 
Westtexas

"Franklin, I hope you're right, but I fear this story will not have a happy ending..."

Of course it won't be a happy ending. Anytime countrymen fight each other, it's dammed ugly. Cases in point, 1775-1781/3; 1861-1865; Battle of Blair Mountain (WV), Kent State, Selma, Birmingham, Oklahoma City, Waco, Ruby Ridge, to name a few.


"Once the public debate is over, and the government has brainwashed a generation, no one will have a copy of the constitution, much less the bill of rights..."

Oh They'll have them, they just won't know what it means. Some will, though. My kids will. They already do.

"Doesn't leave too many to join our side, does it?"

I don't know, how many hypothetical people that aren't on our side are we talking about?

"How many are going to be willing to make their kids orphans and their wives widows? Lose everything they have to fight this fight?"

Damn good question. I just don't know.

For how long, though, will they be willing to sell their children's essential liberty down the river in order to provide a little temporary safety? There's one for the history books!

"When push comes to shove, what will happen?"

Good question. Your guess is as good as mine. I don't even know what I'm having for supper tonight.
 
Franklin W. Dixon,

When it comes to push and shove there are quite a few I think that would stand up and do something, maybe not all at once, but it would happen. The problem is that MOST of the American people do NOT know whats going on, what the government is doing to their rights at all. Most of them only know whats broadcast on TV, and when was the lasttime that was unbiased in anyway??? NEVER! They only cover "Hot" issues, nothing of any real importantance, unless you live in the Middle-East. Never really heard anything about what Congress is doing, prob never will. So unless that changes people will be happy in their own little worlds. Blah!

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-AoW[t]-Dead [Black Ops]

[This message has been edited by Dead (edited July 22, 2000).]
 
But then, in war hasn't it always been more effective to shoot the commanders than the troops?

Yes, it has. That is the best way to win this "war" as well. Make it too damned expensive for the perps on the other side, and make it known to them that they will never live to see the gunless society for which they are working.
 
Out forefathers were willing to leave their families and fight for their country. I for one would, with a heavy heart go and fight for our rights. I would rather my children know that I fought and died for the rights of the people than watch me sit there all disgusted knowing that I did nothing. I know many people who feel the same way as I do and I know they too will stand and fight if it came right down to it. Hopefully it never will. I quote loknload: "We preserve our freedoms by using four boxes: soap, ballot, jury, and cartridge." Words of wisdom! :)

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Menber in good standing of the "Utility Muffin Research Kitchen And Rake Shed."
 
Amen Fz, Whatever it takes ;) I for one still don't believe that they are stupid enough to push it that far ;)

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We preserve our freedoms by using four boxes: soap,ballot,jury, and cartridge.
Anonymous
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Paul Revere:
Think of the absolute arrogance it would take to ban something that is so clearly protected in the Bill of Rights.

That would sound the bell to lay down the rule book that we've so faithfully been abiding by, and prepare to kick some ass big time. I highly doubt that 80 million gunowners would dutifully turn over their privately owned firearms...some 280 million firearms mind you. There are not enough jails or detention camps to hold the amount of people that would become instantaneous criminals under such a ban. And neighbors and relatives are not going to sit idly by and watch their fellow Americans and loved ones be hauled away by black nomex clad government thugs. Naive...or confident?

I'd bet on patriotic Americans to come out of the woodwork with such a vengence, that the coup would last but a few hours.

Go ahead...ring that bell![/quote]
 
using Satellites and ground penetrating radar>>>
If they come out to my farm with this stuff I am going to have a great time. I am going to buy a few 6 paks and watch the fun. The Fellow who owned the place before me buried more scrap around than you could shake a stick at. Been digging it up for 25 years, we cart off a ton of scrap(I mean 2000 lbs of scrap steel here this is not a figure of speech) every few years that has recently surfaced since the last trip.

Set a corner post well heck this guy would bury the head of an engine as and anchor. (we are still finding these things)

need a new barn -- he would just bulldoze dirt over the reinforced concrete floor of the old one and build from there.

How about all the old steel water pipes, that were used in the long ago dry ponds that are still there.

Then there is the old cistern that held water so well that it was full in the wet season and dry in a drought. My dad and I pushed in a few years back, it will look like a large underground buried bunker on a ground penetrating radar scan, there is nothing there but gravel, bricks, concrete, and rebar.

Oh then there is the old well that we had to cap when they treated the house for termites 15 years or so ago. They pulled the top concrete ring out poured a plug and filled over. (looks like another buried concrete bunker to me)

how about that massive crawl space under the house have to excavate that (remember Al Capones vault) just as empty too.

how about the old septic tank (concrete and rebar again) that they cut off and by passed when they put in the new sewer system. Its still there buried 3 feet down.

How about the place where we dug a trench 8 feet wide and 16 feet long to throw the old wood shake roof in and burn it so we could bury the nails 4 feet down. That will look like a good place to dig too, lots of steel there.

opps, what about the reinforce concrete pads around the live stock watering tanks all that concrete and rebar looks good on a radar.

then lets look at all the missing horse shoes (no boys these aren’t those light flimsy things, we used to raise Tennessee walking horses and a plate shoe for one of them was over 5 lbs of steel), rusted off or buried steel fence posts, pieces of farm implements and tools(busted shear bolts off mowers and bailers probably thousands of those about ) that either broke off or fell off in the past and all the other hunks of scrape metal that tend to accumulate on a farm. Or the gravel drive where I usually weld, and the gravel is half steel welding slag and spatter.

All this on a farm that by anybody’s standards is very well kept up (we have been hauling junk off for the last 25 years not bringing it in). Its not an eye sore or junk heap (I have an uncle who collects junk and old cars and his place would be a real treat to watch them search)

Yea now lets modify this by several million farms and hey how about the adjacent railroad riteofway where they have all kinds of steel pieces that have been thrown off the tracks from spikes to hunks of rail for the last one hundred years, or even the abandon riteofways one 3/4 mile north or south of the current double set of tracks.

does that task size begin to unfold.

Heck I know of places in housing developments where they would bulldoze a ditch that was 10 feet across 10 feet deep and would cross half a dozen back yards, to throw all the building scrap into it to bury it. A lot of steel when into those holes too. So the problem isn’t isolated to the farms folks.


I also wonder how many grave yards have vaults with guns and not bodies in them?


[This message has been edited by Alan B (edited July 25, 2000).]
 
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