how much can you bench?

True, but while BP'ing, you're also working your triceps. Those ARE the most important muscles for punching.

(Welcome to TFL, btw!)
 
There is no one "important muscle for punching". A good punch involves synchronizing various muscle groups and has more to do with balance and control than "raw strength". Your triceps are just as involved in a good punch as your shoulders, biceps, chest, forearms, shoulders, abs, hips and legs.

Big guys have more momentum and strength behind their punches but that does not translate to a "powerful" punch. More often then not, a bodybuilders punch is just a big shove. The excessive upperbody weight adds momentum to your punches making it more difficult to recoil, and the muscles tightness doesn't allow you any "pop" or follow through. You are left slower and more open, I know all this from experience. Excessive upper body mass makes movement difficult and slow, it's like trying to corner in a Cadillac, akward to say the least.

Also, one punch knockouts are rarer than people think, regardless of size. Most knockouts are accomplished by a succession of blows. Big guys who don't know how to punch, usually just wind up with a hay maker, telegraphing their punch and leaving themselves open in the process. Doesn't matter if you weigh 120 lbs, or 220, a three or four punch combo to his ribs and face and the body builder won't want no more.

So what is it ? The single shot 10 guage may look fearsome, but in the hands of an unskilled practitioner is no match for the expert with his Ruger 10/22 ;).
 
it's funny how some people assume that if they are a bodybuilder, then they don't know how to fight or are slow as hell. a stereotype? maybe.
 
The chest has almost nothing to do with punching power. While the triceps are important, they rank behind the shoulder. Most important is the combination of the legs and hips working in unison. That is where power comes from, not the chest. I fought a lot of big guys (not that I am small -- 6'2", 245) and most of them were slow and actually didn't hit that hard. Remember: speed times mass equals power. Mass stays fairly constant, while speed can be increased dramatically. Why do you think boxers do so many speed drills. Use your legs and hips for power and your arms, through your hands (fist, palm, sword, etc.), for speed.

I'm not down on the bench, I like to work out and look good, but chest is for aesthetics.

Coley
 
Eyeball, just what I was thinking.

Its not neccesarily that I'm worried about getting punched by somebody like that, it is when they grab your leg with one hand and your arm with the other and pull you in half. :)
 
There are different punching styles. In the art I train in, for instance, the shoulder is really not utilized much in the punch (though the hips and obliques are).

Every punching style of which I am aware, incorporates the tricep muscles.
 
eyeball and Correia: where you referring to me? I wasn't talking about a boxing match. I made a reference to the way that boxer's train to make a point: that speed is more important than size. If you want to comment on something I said, go right ahead, but how about addressing me.

Spectre: I don't see how you couldn't use your shoulder when you punch. Could you explain?

Coley
 
In the Japanese styles that Spectre and I study, most punches have the body moving behind the punch,i.e, you are stepping through the punch. Of course, the shoulder is used-after all that's where your arm attaches to your body-just not in the same manner as other styles use.

I think what Spectre meant to say was that the force of the strike is not dependent on the shoulder muscles in our styles.
 
Yup. Unlike some other styles that "throw" the shoulder into the punch. I believe part of the difference is between using a vertical and a horizontal punch.

With the typical boxing punch, the palm is facing down. With a vertical punch, the fist is held with palms facing inward.

Anyway, my whole point was that there are different punching styles, but they all use the triceps heavily. Not all derive their power from the shoulder muscles. Even in boxing: look at the jab; all tricep. Look at the Wing Chung "chain" punch: all tricep.
 
CR, no insult intended. Nor was I thinking of anything in particular that anybody said. I was just thinking that even though pecs are not the most important muscle for punching, there are lots of other ways that somebody who weight trains can inflict damage upon you. Guys with 300+ bench presses usually are strong in lots of other ways as well.
 
Lifting weights means you amass a lot of fast twitch muscle fiber and that your muscles fatigue easily. They may be explosive, but anaerobic conditioning combined with no breathing technique=...ever see "Tough Man" ? Riiiight. And that's why you won't see serious fighters doing a body builders workout at the gym. Those guys who can bench 600 lbs won't last more than 10 seconds.
 
Tyson is a body builder yet he is one of the quickest people out there. Shamrock, a serious fighter, could pass as a pro bodybuilder and yet he is successful at fighting. how do you explain this? simple. you have to realize that muscle mass doesn't automatically equal slowness.

CRreynolds, i wasn't addressing you specifically I just noticed there are a lots of people who hold the same ideas you have in this thread.
 
Lately I've been benching 200 grains, five reps per set, about five sets. This is just for accuracy work during load development. On my "max" days I will bench 240 grainers, same rep and set quantity. Of course all of this is followed by speed work to maintain proficiency. :D

Oh, were you guys talking about weightlifting?
 
I've never really concerned myself with the benchpress. Proper breathing, staying loose until impact and learning to use your whole body are way more important in hitting hard.

Mostly I do internal Chinese exercises for strength. Combining these exercises (that develop the muscles from the inside out) and external exercises such as bench press( develop outside in) is the best bet.

Of course, being able to hit hard doesn't help you if you hit the wrong spot.
 
I don't know how many folks think that bodybuilders are slow--I don't. But I don't think that they're any faster or better fighters than anyone else, which I believe a lot of people do think.

Size does matter, though, as does power.

But in truth, I'm not really looking out for the built guy--I'm looking out for the scrawny guy with his shirt untucked.
 
I highly doubt it...

"I read in the paper this week that Larry Allen of the Cowboys was benching somewhere between 650 and 700 lbs. Un-effin-real."

They also said Allen was 11% bodyfat. If he's 11%, then I'm about a negative 5. He's 25% at least. If you believe the media, every football player in the NFL and college can bench 500 or more. They just like to throw out round numbers. Benching 700 pounds is something that very few powerlifters in the world can do, even with the aid of bench shirts, and that's what they train to do. I call BS on Allen's 700 bench claim.

Plus, have you ever seen most footballers bench? Bounce city.
 
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