How do you define "Hoarding ammo"?

We've all seen the price of a box of shells rise from $3 to $12, and now $35 for the same box. Primers from $15-$20 to $40, and powder and brass climbing the same slopes.

The politicians are clamoring for high ammo taxes, ammo purchase registrations, outright bans, you name it.

Anyone who isn't putting a couple of cases away for the long term is being, frankly, a chowderhead.
 
Look, buy whatever you can use, expect to use, etc. I don't care.

Just keep in mind that as long as a few people buy everything they can, every time it's available, the 'shortage' will continue and prices will continue to rise.

Now if you're buying it all up to resell it at scalper prices? I have no use for you.
 
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Yes, it's all subjective to a point.
But, I like the term "reasonable"- not as Obama defines it, but as most normal minds would.

Is it "reasonable" to have 6 months, or even a year's worth of ammo or components? Probably...

But a recent picture posted of 35,000 rifle primers, well,.... that's the reason why many suppliers have now instituted limits on powder and primer purchases. I only wish they'd had the foresight to to do it sooner.

It doesn't benefit them, to have nothing to sell.

It's almost funny, some of the ads I see running- for stuff most people don't need...but when all you have to sell is pomegranates, you try to sell pomegranates...

And then, there's good ol CTD, killing trees and sending out flyers with no prices at all in it. Well, the USPS needs the money...
 
Hoarding is one thing and flipping is another. I suppose flipping is rapidly becoming a felony in a few states. Unless of course you do a 4473 in the parking lot.
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How can flipping ammo be a felony? I don't fill out a 4473 when I buy ammo now, so, why would I have to involve one if I wanted to sell some ammo?
 
I think he's talking about "flipping" firearms, and making reference to the various proposals that would require FFL involvement in all transfers, even between private sellers.
 
I think he's talking about "flipping" firearms, and making reference to the various proposals that would require FFL involvement in all transfers, even between private sellers.
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Well, in a thread about ammo, you can understand my confusion.:D
 
Well, in a thread about ammo, you can understand my confusion.
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Good point. I kind of "blooped over" the word "ammo" in the thread title, so his post didn't seem as out-of-place to me.

In my mind, "hoarding" has an inherent element of having more than you'll ever need. Smaug the dragon from "The Hobbit" had a hoard of gold, but why the hell does a dragon even need gold in the first place?

You sometimes see the "extreme" couponers buying dozens of gallon jars of mayonnaise, just because they have a coupon that makes them essentially free. I know that some of them donate the excess to shelters and churches, or trade amongst themselves, but I suspect a lot of the "mass-purchased" food simply goes to waste.
 
Hoarding: Having ammunition I want, but I can't buy, and I can't get you to sell to me.

Its all about me!

1. If I like it, it’s mine..
2. If it’s in my hand, it’s mine..
3. If I can take it from you, it’s mine..
4. If I had it a little while ago, it’s mine..
5. If it’s mine, it must never appear to be yours in any way..
6. If I’m doing or building something, all the pieces are mine..
7. If it looks just like mine, it’s mine..
8. If I think it’s mine, it’s mine..
 
I think he's talking about "flipping" firearms, and making reference to the various proposals that would require FFL involvement in all transfers, even between private sellers.
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The problem arises when "flipping" becomes "dealing without a license." If you sell some guns out of your own collection, that's one thing. If you buy a whole bunch of guns with the sole intention of reselling them at a profit, that could get very ugly.

I'm not sure how I'd define "hoarder," since it's something of a pejorative, but distinguishing them from flippers is important for those of us in the business. The former wants the stuff for himself. That presents some challenges, as we've got to set limits on high-demand items in order to keep one guy from exhausting our stock. While they're sometimes disappointed to encounter those limits, they're usually understanding.

Not the flipper, though. He's angry. He's got a window in which to make a profit in his little gray business, and he expects the retailer to be his own little wholesaler. When we say no, open the barn gate because here comes the drama llama. Yeesh.

Thing is, we don't need the flipper. We'll never see him again after the whole mess dies down, and since the items he wants are in such short supply, we have the prerogative of selling them to folks who'll actually be using them.

What's more, Mr. Flipper is selling guns indiscriminately to anyone who waves enough cash at him. That could end up with guns getting lost or misused, at which point they get traced to us. That's a hassle.
 
I think this is a good time for gun owners who have ammunition to start being aware of their fellows ammo situation and help them out if they need it. Simply sell them a little ammo at the price you paid for it so they can have something to defend themselves or hunt with.

I would hate to think that a first time gun owners first experience with fellow gun owners would be having to pay an outrageous amount of money for a box of ammo that one day (They will figure out you burned them eventually) will become available at a much cheaper price.

If we can't work together over something as insignificant as a panic ammo shortage, how can we expect to work together and trust each other when things really go south?
 
I am willing to help out someone, but I am not going to supply the scout troop for an afternoon shooting. That requires planning.

As far as fair market price.... most that buy ammo have some idea what it normally costs. You can be very up front with them on pricing if you are selling. But with 22 ammo, I would simply give a friend some ammo and that would be that. A stranger would not likely ask.
 
I was talking to a guy at church today who told me his dad has 100,000 rounds of .22LR and maybe 10,000 each of several other calibers. He bought them when there was plenty of supply and didn't prevent anyone else from buying. Hoarding? Nope, but maybe a bit over the top and certainly in a tax bracket or three higher then mine.

You usually hear hoarding accusations thrown around when necessities like food are in short supply, particularly when someone buys in such a manner, that others in need are prevented from buying and suffer as a result. Buying when prices are low and supply plentiful is not hoarding, no matter the quantities purchased.

If I bought a years supply of food or ammunition five years ago and supplies are tight now or five years from now does not make me a hoarder even when others have unfilled needs. Planning and buying ahead is not a crime either legally or morally. Even so, I may be called a hoarder simply by having something someone else wants. Those same people would call me selfish because I bought food or ammo when they spent their money on a cruise. Funny, I didn't think them selfish when they didn't take me on the cruise with them.:rolleyes:
 
If I won the lotto, I would buy probably 100 guns, maybe 2-3 houses, enough land for a deer lease and maybe 2-3 vehicles. Hoarding? Nope- my money I can buy what I want! Shoot, if you don't buy anything then people will say you're hoarding your money. Geez. Lol
 
Simply sell them a little ammo at the price you paid for it so they can have something to defend themselves or hunt with.
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Nice sentiment, but I don't think so. At least, not in my case. You see, I haven't bought more than a couple of boxes of ammo in the last 3-4 years. In fact, the sad truth is, I am not shooting much lately, simply because I cannot replace my ammo for anywhere near what I paid for it.

Now, I won't leave a friend defenseless, but sell it for what I paid? Not hardly. Because I bought back when prices were "normal", years ago. Selling it today for what I paid then? no. Perhaps, if I were in desperate need of cash, selling some of it at what I consider a fair market price (and not the hyper inflated panic prices today), MAYBE....

I didn't set out to be, nor am I equipped to be the Arsenal of Democracy. And I don't think many of the rest of us are, either.

let me give you an example, somewhere in the back room I have a case of 7.62mm NATO (still sealed), bought at the then going market price of $165.
Looking back now, I should have bought 5 (alas). If I had, then selling one might be an option. But do you seriously think I ought to sell some for what I paid for it? Just to be a nice guy? I try to be a nice guy, but I'm sorry, I'm just not that nice....

Makes me feel like the ant, surrounded by grasshoppers, whining "gimme, gimme, gimme, and gimme it CHEAP!!"

Heard a radio talk show host tonight, saying how he was going to take a CCW class, and buy a gun. He wants to be a gun owner, he wants to show solidarity with us. Beome one of us. While I almost laughed, I do wish him well. He can learn our pain, and suffer it with us now.

What I do wonder is why this well off middle aged gentleman is only NOW buying a gun?!!! That is part of the problem we have today. Lots and lots of people, for whom it was never any concern or interest suddenly have both. And their money has bought up everything in sight. Leaving very little for the rest of us. And THEY are complaining!

I'm rapidly growing deaf ears. I do have sympathy for the young folks just starting out in firearms, most of them with tight budgets. I was there myself once. What irks me is the well off folks, who spent years/decades ignoring the shooting sports/self defense now demanding their share, and claiming those of us who have spent decades building up a collection (and supplies to feed that collection) are HOARDERS!!!

You spent you money buying what you wanted. That's your right. I did the same. Good luck stopping the thief, or rapist with those stocks, bonds and gold bullion. Those are fine things, and money (in whatever form) is very useful. Virtually a necessity. But when you need bullets, nothing else will do.

The stuff is still out there, buy what you want, at what the market will bear. But insult me, imply I have done something bad (hoarder), and I really don't want to share my toys with a rude snot like you! Why don't you just get your pitchforks and torches and start chanting "Burn the witch!"

Sorry for being so snarky, but this really ticks me off.

Look at it this way, suppose I had a full tank of gas, and there was no more gas to be had. I'd drive you to the hospital if you needed to go. But I wouldn't siphon some out so you could drive your car to the lake to party. And I certainly wouldn't do it if you offered me $0.39 per gallon!

yes, I'm an old grump, especially on this issue. Hoarder!! pffft!:mad:
 
Lots and lots of people, for whom it was never any concern or interest suddenly have both.
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As a corollary, I'm pretty much over the idea that Joe Bob has to get his AR-15 and ammo before the ban, but he has no interest in doing anything to prevent the ban.

He'll waste all sorts of gas, money, time, and effort tracking down a couple of 30-round magazines, but he can't donate $50 to a 2nd Amendment organization. He'll regale me with his weird and often tasteless political theories, but he won't take the time to write his legislators. Heck, from what I've seen of the voter turnout numbers, he didn't even vote in the last few elections.

Once he's got the totem weapon he thinks he needs (and probably won't learn to use properly), his interest in the gun culture will wane to nearly zero. If the storm passes with no significant fallout, he'll grow tired of all that stuff he hoarded, and by late summer, it'll be a buyer's market for unfired military-pattern rifles and sealed cases of ammo.

We saw this in the 2008-2009 mess, and we're seeing it now, only on a larger scale.
 
By definition:

Pathological or compulsive hoarding is a specific type of behavior characterized by:
•acquiring and failing to throw out a large number of items that would appear to have little or no value to others (e.g., papers, notes, flyers, newspapers, clothes)
•severe cluttering of the person's home so that it is no longer able to function as a viable living space
•significant distress or impairment of work or social life​
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I'd say nobody's hoarding unless they have so much ammunition that they can't reasonably live in their house. That, or they lose their job because they're always shopping for more...
 
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