Houston I think we have a problem

jhinalabama said:
Wow, so much negativity in that post. taylorce1

There was nothing negative in that post at all. You stated you couldn't see the marks unless magnified, so I'm guessing you had to magnify it as well for the picture. You can't tell if the crown is good or bad, because of the angle of it to take the picture. Plus having rough bore might not affect the accuracy as much as you think.

You didn't mention what groups you are shooting, and what groups you are expecting to get out of the rifle. Plus you haven't mentioned what you've done already to determine that the barrel is your only problem with the rifle. I know very few people who will shoot 600 rounds out of a rifle that won't group. I know I'd either have traded it off or had it at a gunsmith long before I put 600 rounds down range, if it wasn't showing any kind of potential early on.
 
Interesting. I don't know their process for crowning, but there's certainly no reason a cutting tool should have been any further inside the bore than the depth of the crown. And logistically, spinning at a couple thousand rpm on a CNC- it would be impossible for an errant tool to gouge a single land without tearing up the rest of the bore at that depth unless it got jabbed in there somehow before cutting began.

I tend to think this was something that happened when the barrel blank was cut to length before crowning and it was never noticed; it'll be interesting to see what Rem says. Along with Taylorce I'm not so sure this would affect accuracy to a large degree even though it's ugly as hell. It's a low spot and the bullet should glide right past it- and the crown itself (looks like a recessed flat target crown) is not affected suggesting to me that the base of the bullet will exit cleanly as will the gases without being pushed off-center.

If I'm seeing this correctly, looks like they use a 60 degree counterbore where the crown intersects the bore rather than a sharp 90 degree edge. I often do this as well though it seems to be a hotly debated subject sometimes.
 
Thanks for all the replies and input. I have been in contact with Remington they have opened a work order and ups is stopping by to pick it up tomorrow. I'll let you guys know what they say / do.
 
Thanks for the update. Still have to wonder how the defect got there in the first place. If it was from the manufacturer (which I can only assume it was), there were probably more than a few barrels with the same defect rolled out that day. :eek: :(
 
Well I got home from work and pulled the rifle out of the box hoping to see great things. The barrel looked like they shot a bucket of rounds through it. So after I cleaned it I was not happy with what I saw. I thought they would have changed the barrel but it looks like they took a grinder to it.:eek::mad:
 

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Now that you know what they will do you have options.

1. Sell it.
2. Send it back.
3. Send it to a Gunsmith to backbore or cut off and crown the area.
4. Shoot it and see what happens.

Sucks that you got the defect but it happens.
 
You're complaining over microscopic defects.

I guess I am. Because I figured those defects are why the rifle would not group well. I have not shot it since I got it back. I just figured having one land ground off at the muzzle would not work out. I'm going to shot it tomorrow. Fingers crossed.
 
I recall buying an older Redfield collimator off youtube.Never usd one.Figured I could use it for something.
I got it out,tried to use it.
Understand,I know how to use a plug gage in a precision hole.Its pretty near a thumb and forefinger grip on the gage.I expected the same from the spuds provided with the boresighter.
What I tried was too tight.I stopped and put it away.No harm done.

When you bought your rifle,did the shop install the sight and bore sight it for you?

I do not know what did that to your barrel,but to my eye,it does not look like it was caused by any barrel making process I recognize.

It COULD be caused by a counter clerk who got a boresight spud stuck and twisted it to get it out. I'll look closer.

I won't even say it did not happen at Remington.But I'm skeptical it did.

Rem patched it for you.Not the best.But others had custody of that rifle after it left Remington.

Update,I looked again. Somehow,there is another part to this story.Initial pic,before going to Rem,the other lands look washed out.

The edge chamfer looks machine done,concentric,and undamaged.

The damage is not spaced uniform,like power feed.The track of the damage is not in line with the linear traver of any tool rifling or boring.

The damage only crosses one land.It did not travel around the bore,as any broken machine cutter would.

It almost looks like a renegade dremel skittered...but not really.Those usually get traction and would have deflected.I don't think that's it.It also looks more like deformation than cut.

It looks like something freak,like someone working on a ladder over the rifle rack dropped his drill motor,or someone put a screw through a crate in the wrong place.It looks like the muzzle got hung on the head of a drywall screw.
If a borescope says the rest of the barrelis good,I'd cut it an inch or inch and a half

The more I look at it,the more it looks like the muzzle was pressed against a board and someone drove a screw into it. A small screw.The threads tracked down that land.You can see puckered up displaced metal at the edge of each mark,like a crater rim.
How or why that happens? No clue.

I had a horrible experience pulling the rear main seal out of a5.0 liter Ford V-8
Its done by driving a sheet metal screw into the seal and using the screw to pull the seal.I left a mark like that in my crankshaft.I put aJiffy -Sleeve over it.Still running.
 
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Thank you for your analysis HIBC its funny we have a similar thought process about what happen. The store did not bore site or mount a scope for me. That's not to say something didn't happen to it at the store. I'm going to shoot it. I'll post results. Thanks for everyone's input.
 
I guess I am. Because I figured those defects are why the rifle would not group well. I have not shot it since I got it back. I just figured having one land ground off at the muzzle would not work out. I'm going to shot it tomorrow. Fingers crossed.

I highly doubt they will have any effect on accuracy.
There are too many other variables involved in "grouping well".

A few tiny marks in the barrel that require magnification to be seen aren't one of those variables.
 
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You're complaining over microscopic defects.
Quote:
I guess I am.

Well, I guess you're not. C'mon, it's a rifle purchased brand new! Why in the world would anyone think the defect in question is in any way acceptable; and I don't care if it's accurate with the ragged crown or not. Maybe I'm just expecting too much; maybe we all should just accept shoddy workmanship and blame ourselves for not being diligent enough to go over a new rifle with a magnifying glass before we pay our hard-earned money. Or maybe the lack of quality control and poor customer service is why some companies are having a hard time surviving...
 
I had a new Remington 700 in .375 H&H. I got mine with a horribly out of round barrel. It took Remington over 6 months to remedy the situation. They sent me a new Rifle. It took 6 months to do that? They said send it back and we'll rebarrel. Well, they didn't. Never again.
 
When I saw your earlier response (before seeing the last one) saying you got it back and Rem said they "honed" the barrel and "fixed" it, I was incredulous.

Based on your original pic, that damage to the land was NOT REPAIRABLE.
No how. No way. Not without shortening the barrel to cut away the affected section.

It is irrelevant whether it affects accuracy (and I guarantee it does...), it is a major manufacturing defect.

New gun, Demand a new barrel :mad: You could accept at your discretion a cut back/recrown- but that's the only acceptable repair.

I am not just surprised, but dismayed that they would take the position that they "fixed" a defect that cannot be fixed.
 
Well I got to the range and shot it. The rifle groups much to my surprise. It shot sub moa @ 100yd, my best group was .45" with three shots. I shot 10 three shot groups, the worst was 1.25" I am not happy with the way the muzzle looks but at least it will shoot.
 
tobnpr I agree with you 100% and I am going to contact them. I just don't have any faith that they will do anything to right there defect/my problem.
 
Well I got to the range and shot it. The rifle groups much to my surprise. It shot sub moa @ 100yd, my best group was .45" with three shots. I shot 10 three shot groups, the worst was 1.25"
I am not happy with the way the muzzle looks but at least it will shoot.

Send it back and demand a new barrel, but don't be upset if it looks better but doesn't shoot as well with a prettier barrel.

Sub-moa with a new rifle is a great start even if your magnifying glass shows some minor defect that may or may not have happened at the factory.
 
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