HK USPc vs. Walther P99
- Thread starter dsk
- Start date
Of the two, I chose the Hk, and I couldn't be happier. However, since you already have the Hk, get the Walther, but don't get rid of the Hk or you'll regret it later. Just save your pennies and get the Walther (or use plastic 
).
And whatever you do, DO NOT get a SW-99. :barf: They are not even close to the same quality as a Walther. I purchased one without researching it, and after many failures to feed and failures to eject, I traded it in on a Glock 19 which was flawless.
). And whatever you do, DO NOT get a SW-99. :barf: They are not even close to the same quality as a Walther. I purchased one without researching it, and after many failures to feed and failures to eject, I traded it in on a Glock 19 which was flawless.
chris93473
New member
i like H&K....so stick with it because i like it.
Also, see this site for the 411 on HKs and what the owners think. Go to the boards and post the same question. I plan to make the USP my first handgun. I haven't decided on the caliber yet, amongst other things.
having had the chance to shoot a friend's HK, i can say that it's a damn fine firearm, but persoanlly i wouldn't want to own one. i have the p-99 in 9mm and it's the best firearm that i've had. it's not for everyone, in fact there are a number of folks here that have had serious issues with them. i have not, i have not had any FTFs, FTEs, or slide lock, or any of the other issues mentioned. the only stovepipes i've had were from limpwristing it. i've lost count of how many rounds i've put through it of all makes and grains, but it's between 5 and 10k at this point. i suggest taking one out and run it around the block a few times.
if you already have the HK, save up for the p-99.
Adept
if you already have the HK, save up for the p-99.
Adept
in my opinion ,the P99 is a good gun for the buck. specially at its price
nowadays. but if you want a fine crafted weapon the the HK is my vote.
if given the chance i would buy back my upsc in 45. never had a compact with such accuracy as the USPC 40 or 45's. i like the P99 only in 9mm because that's
the original design and i don't like the idea of having a 40 with Smith's
bastardized version. it makes me feel like i bought a sw99 yuck!!!!!
nowadays. but if you want a fine crafted weapon the the HK is my vote.
if given the chance i would buy back my upsc in 45. never had a compact with such accuracy as the USPC 40 or 45's. i like the P99 only in 9mm because that's
the original design and i don't like the idea of having a 40 with Smith's
bastardized version. it makes me feel like i bought a sw99 yuck!!!!!
Everybody always brings this up. Exactly what is it about H&K USP's that is so great? My USP Tactical was a nice polymer pistol, but the fit/finish wasn't anything spectacular. The much exaulted "match trigger" was mediocre at best. The plastic decocker/safety was kinda cheesy feeling. Don't get me wrong the H&K USP is a damn fine weapon, but the P99 has a better trigger, and just as nice fit/finish.
Now the H&K P7 series are a true testament to fine pistol making, when you can get all steel parts to work together like they do in a P7, then that is true craftsmanship. Same as a Walther P88, and a Sig P210, making an all steel pistol, with the quality of those three, that takes work.
Making a mass produced, polymer combat weapon, ala USP, P99, Glock......c'mon there isn't any true craftmanship in any of them. There is a tremendous amount of engineering that goes into making a reliable, combat accurate, polymer pistol, but once the molds are made, and the CNC machines programmed, there just isn't any need for a craftsman.
Just IMHO of course.
NMGlocker,
If you seriously think that CNC machines are as easy to operate as you insinuate, you are fooling yourself. You can't just program the machine and hit the start button and go on your merry way. It really isn't that simple at all.
Maybe you should tell us why the H&K is a "damn fine weapon" and you'll answer your own question about exactly what it is that makes it so great?
Shake
If you seriously think that CNC machines are as easy to operate as you insinuate, you are fooling yourself. You can't just program the machine and hit the start button and go on your merry way. It really isn't that simple at all.
Maybe you should tell us why the H&K is a "damn fine weapon" and you'll answer your own question about exactly what it is that makes it so great?
Shake
David Berkowitz
New member
P99,
Regarding my slide locking back.
I'm going to hold off for awhile before I send it in. Since the slide is doing it less, I'm thinking that there may be something in there, a bit of dirt maybe, that is working itself out. Also, since I am also experiencing failures to feed, and they are also slightly less frequent, that I will wait until I hit the 2,000 round mark.
If I still have the problems, I can get both taken care of at the same time.
If I don't hit 2,000 before the end of a year, I will also send it in then. I think they only have a 12 month warranty.
Regarding my slide locking back.
I'm going to hold off for awhile before I send it in. Since the slide is doing it less, I'm thinking that there may be something in there, a bit of dirt maybe, that is working itself out. Also, since I am also experiencing failures to feed, and they are also slightly less frequent, that I will wait until I hit the 2,000 round mark.
If I still have the problems, I can get both taken care of at the same time.
If I don't hit 2,000 before the end of a year, I will also send it in then. I think they only have a 12 month warranty.
H&K USP's go bang the majority of the time, are combat accurate, and durable enough that they will outlast the shooter.
But my Glock, Sig , Walther, Beretta, etc. are all of that as well.
I just don't understand why people associate the USP series with fine craftsmanship. They are nice combat weapons, but I still contend that their is no "craftsmanship" involved in making one.
As to CNC, it takes an excellent programmer, machinist and engineering team to keep them humming along, making identical parts all day.
Just IMO H&K's are a bit overpriced for what is actually involved in making one. The P99 was overpriced as well when I bought mine. But now that they are in the sub-$500 range they are competatively priced with Glock and SigPro, they are worth the money. I know when I had my H&K Tactical the "BMW" syndrome started to set in, you know what i'm talking about, "snob appeal", but after actually looking at the H&K, I realized that it was just another pistol.
What is it about an H&K USP, that makes it worth $150 more than a Glock or Walther P99? To me the extra $$$ is not for the actual product, but for "snob appeal", it cost more, thus it must be better. Just IMO of course.
BTW: I keep saving up for an H&K, but everytime I get the $700 or so together and head for the gunstore, I keep coming home with another Sig, or Walther, PLUS a few hi-cap magazines, PLUS a new holster/accessories. When I actually have the H&K in my grubby little paws, I just can't bring myself to pay that much for it.
Shake, I think NMG's point was that there is a difference between a machine made process, and a hand made process, and that between one machine made gun to another, all things being equal, machining is machining, and molds are molds.
I own a CNC machine myself, and you are right to a degree, it can sometimes take a LONG time to work out the kinks in a CAD/CAM designed part. Software can do some wierd stuff, and the machine operator can introduce errors. But NMG's point is also very correct. Once you go through the trial testing runs, it really is just a matter of hitting the start cycle.
Equating this to the knifemaking community, there is a far cry in prestige, and often in the workmanship, between a machine made and assembled knife like a KaBar or Swiss Army Knife, to a benchmade knife like a William Henry, and a third step to a hand made knife like a Terzuola, Centofante, or Koji Hara.
I think in the final analysis, that the word 'craftsmanship' refers more to the human element than it does to CNC.
I own a CNC machine myself, and you are right to a degree, it can sometimes take a LONG time to work out the kinks in a CAD/CAM designed part. Software can do some wierd stuff, and the machine operator can introduce errors. But NMG's point is also very correct. Once you go through the trial testing runs, it really is just a matter of hitting the start cycle.
Equating this to the knifemaking community, there is a far cry in prestige, and often in the workmanship, between a machine made and assembled knife like a KaBar or Swiss Army Knife, to a benchmade knife like a William Henry, and a third step to a hand made knife like a Terzuola, Centofante, or Koji Hara.
I think in the final analysis, that the word 'craftsmanship' refers more to the human element than it does to CNC.
jack_the_sailor
New member
UPS9C vrs WP99QA
Which has a lighter trigger pull HK USP9 compact in SA or Walther P99QA? Which is more accurate?
Which has a lighter trigger pull HK USP9 compact in SA or Walther P99QA? Which is more accurate?
The USP compact will have a lighter SA trigger pull at about 5lbs vs the Walther P99QA which has a SA trigger pull at about 8lbs. But the P99QA is SA only (Glock like, but with a crisper pull, compared to slightly mushy Glock pull). And I've never seen a gun test where the USP compact has bested the Walther P99, ever.
Regards,
James
Regards,
James
What's wrong with Gun Tests? They do just as good of an accuracy test on guns as Guns-And-Ammo, Handguns, Combat Handguns, Guns, etc.
Specifically, Handguns 98 from DB publications. I have the article at home. Tested USP Compact 9mm, USP Compact 40, Walther P99. Walther P99 was much more accurate.
I can scan the accuracy table tonight and post on my website.
I'll put the link up tonight so you can see it.
Regards,
James
Specifically, Handguns 98 from DB publications. I have the article at home. Tested USP Compact 9mm, USP Compact 40, Walther P99. Walther P99 was much more accurate.
I can scan the accuracy table tonight and post on my website.
I'll put the link up tonight so you can see it.
Regards,
James
Extremist,
I don't have the time or the energy to type my entire opinion (and experience) with Gun Tests.
I do have a problem with how they portray their results. Judging an entire model of firearm based on one example is bad science. From what I could tell from the Gun Tests magazines I read, that is exactly what they are doing.
If they want to truly come up with definitive results, they would select many examples of each model, in each caliber, and from different production runs. This, of course, would be cost prohibitive.
Bottom line is you can't take their results to the bank.
Beyond that, my own opinion is that (given quality firearms from quality manufacturers) individual examples of any brand of firearm might outshoot the another. For example, my USP might outshoot your P99 by a mile. On the other hand, someone else might have a P99 that will outshoot my friends USP by a mile. What does that really prove? Not much as far as USPs and P99s taken as a collective body of firearms.
YMMMV, IMHO, and all that. . .
Of course I'm still going to insist that you'll look a long time before you'll find a P99 that will outshoot either of my USPs (tic). How can you get better than one-hole groups??
Shake
I don't have the time or the energy to type my entire opinion (and experience) with Gun Tests.
I do have a problem with how they portray their results. Judging an entire model of firearm based on one example is bad science. From what I could tell from the Gun Tests magazines I read, that is exactly what they are doing.
If they want to truly come up with definitive results, they would select many examples of each model, in each caliber, and from different production runs. This, of course, would be cost prohibitive.
Bottom line is you can't take their results to the bank.
Beyond that, my own opinion is that (given quality firearms from quality manufacturers) individual examples of any brand of firearm might outshoot the another. For example, my USP might outshoot your P99 by a mile. On the other hand, someone else might have a P99 that will outshoot my friends USP by a mile. What does that really prove? Not much as far as USPs and P99s taken as a collective body of firearms.
YMMMV, IMHO, and all that. . .
Of course I'm still going to insist that you'll look a long time before you'll find a P99 that will outshoot either of my USPs (tic). How can you get better than one-hole groups??
Shake