Here is something that worries me from time to time...

I searched the buffalo news for a story from the early 1990's but couldn't find it.

My recollection of it is as follows:

Two men in two cars wanted one parking spot at the walden mall. Heated words, one man pushed another man, shots fired. A man is killed in front of his pregnant wife over a freaking parking spot...

The original poster's statement/ question was: " Every one of us has done something to anger someone in our goings about in daily life. It happens. You bump into someone, you take the parking spot they wanted, you smile at their girlfriend, whatever. Sometimes these people give you a dirty look, say some words, or just walk away. What happens when they don't."

Plain and simple: Apologize and Apologize some more. Make it sincere and get loved ones out of there asap. Samurai was right on with his post.
 
Wildalaska said:
Quote:We're not required to run away, screaming like a little girl. (nor would I).O yes you are...in some circumstances.[/quote]

For the purposes of this debate we are considering an aggressor who will not back down.

I try to evaluate just how much my involvement is required/allowed in confrontations. After all, there will be investigations and at least one trial.

There comes a tipping point where safety, the protection of those in your care, reality and common sense dictate that the brain-donor needs to be sliced up into sushi.

Like I've said, we're the good guys here. If there was an opening to back-track, we willl take it. This discussion touches on just what our options are if that choice has been denied.
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For the purposes of this debate we are considering an aggressor who will not back down.
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You shouldnt get to that point. As soon as somebody gets hinky you should be gone.

Some of these threads border on the search for justifications to be trigger happy.

Run. Hide, Beg, Cry. Pick up your kids and drag your wife by the hand screaming and crying while running away. Holler fire fire fire help help help

You pull that trigger when you are confronted with the imminent use of deadly physical force and have no other alternative. Your state law may allow a different result. Discretion is the better part of valour. Your pocketbook will thank you.

WildidontwanttoshootanyoneAlaska TM
 
Okay, since I asked in the first place I'll say that if I can just walk away, I will. If there is a need to run, I'm already facing a danger that justifies SOME use of force, whether lethal or not. But, I'm assuming here that I can't run, and that I've exhausted all modes of resolving the situation. So the question then becomes, what do you do when you can't run and talking won't work?
 
Hypotheticals and assumtions are basically useless when determining what you should or could do, in a real life situation. A lot of good advice has been given here.Making the assumption that all recourse has been exhausted is dangerous, acting on it, even more so.
It seems some won't be satisfied until they get the answer they want to hear. Shoot him, take him out, eliminate the threat, empty the gun on him and your totally justified. Hope the Jury buys your "assumptions"!
 
Before some people turn this into a real p'ing match over running vs. standing your ground, let's remember the original intent of the thread.

We're not talking about someone armed coming at you, but an unarmed person who is p***ed off in the spring-loaded position. It is unknown whether he will resort to a personal assault on you or just stand there shouting at you.

Someone who's intention is to just yell and scream will not "pursue" you if you start backing away, say back into a store or around your car. Someone you tell to "stay back!" who keeps coming is a potential threat. Repeated commands to them which are ignored as you back away are prima facie cause to test your OC spray if they try to close the distance. The desire is that the OC spray will blur their vision and distract them long enough for you to disengage and find an area of safety and/or call 911.

You shouldnt get to that point. As soon as somebody gets hinky you should be gone.
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WA - I'll politely disagree with you here. There are some places and circumstances where I must do business where "hinky" characters are within visual distance.
 
WildAlaska said:
The Tourist said:
For the purposes of this debate we are considering an aggressor who will not back down.
Click to expand...

You shouldnt get to that point. As soon as somebody gets hinky you should be gone.
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Your ability to get "gone" is directly related to the determination of the hinky adversary. If your adversary is too insistant you may be forced to deal with the situation.

So it very well can get to that point with out you're liking it.
 
I thought myself and the bodyguard in Way of the Gun were the only people who said hinky.

Carrying makes many situations more complicated (another thread) but in this particular it is difficult to know what to do. The hypothetical scenario I described was in fact an actual one. One that happened just a few days ago. This may be another thread as well.

Back on topic, you have an unarmed aggressor. Unless I have a very high-level retention holster or I have the drop on him, I would never get into touching distance while I am armed. Seeing as I carry in a comfy, easily hidden IWB and in a self-defense situation you never have the drop I can never tussle while armed.

I can't shoot the guy and hope to avoid legal trouble. Drawing will probably make the situation worse. He may be armed and now things are escalated. Or he just might not be afraid, perhaps he sees I am brandishing a Kahr and knows it will probably jam.:D

The truth is there is no good answer. A possible indirect, long term solution would be to promote and raise awareness about responsible carrying of weapons. The more responsible, armed citizens there are the less a bored or desperate criminal will make unplanned or unprovoked attacks. At least in my humble opinion.
 
For a one-on-one situation where you are armed with a handgun, don't back down and don't run away.
And don't apologize unless you really are the one who was stirring up trouble.
Such actions only embolden thugs who prey upon the weak and timid.

Stand up and place your hand on your weapon and calmly state something to this effect "I don't want to fight you, but I'm not going to let you hurt me either".
Don't say anything else.
Don't advance toward him or retreat from him.
Even if he rants and curses and does all manner of "chest thumping", just quietly stand your ground, hand on weapon, prepared to draw and shoot.
Just quietly stand your ground until he makes the choice to either fight or walk away.

And if he chooses to fight, then deal with him...even if it means shooting him.
 
Wildalaska said:
Some of these threads border on the search for justifications to be trigger happy.
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I agree. However at my age, backing down isn't the ego blow it was thirty years ago.

That's why this debate is needed and why I defined the parameters so tightly.
 
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