Help with a dated 1759 powder horn please

Thank you for posting that;) the guy had a old gun that he has with it. But I have no idea what it is. I have a pic of it. I’ll have to see if Randal can upload that for me. I’m supposed to get the gun tonight. Cause someone else said it should have a gun. Lol. Let me see if I can get it uploaded and tell me what you guys think. thank you for the help.
 
The "PV" before 1759 -- feels like french...

Now I see the English crest.


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The Lion is on the right side of the horn in this pic.
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The unicorn is seen here:
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“honi Sai Mal y Pense” is right off the english crest.
 
Don't mind me:

Here's a tie between the 1759 date and the crest:

This link goes to another horn:
https://hhscollections.wordpress.com/2015/05/29/the-powder-horn-an-object-that-tells-its-own-story/

"This phrase, “Honi soit qui mal y pense,” was also later the motto of the 35th Royal Sussex Regiment of Foot (an infantry regiment of the British army) which was established in 1701. The purpose of raising this particular regiment was to meet the rising threat of war with France, and the unit was sent to America to fight in the French and Indian War in 1756 (two years after it began). The unit served as one of the garrisoned troops at Fort William Henry in Lake George, NY and is remembered most for the events that happened there. In August of 1757 the 35th Foot, under command of Lieutenant-Colonel George Monro, was overwhelmed by French Forces and forced to surrender to General Montcalm. The unit was permitted to evacuate the fort with their weapons, but the Native American allies of the French were sent after them quickly. Native Americans attacked the retreating unit and their once organized march soon dissolved into chaos as many men fled into the woods and remained lost for a number of days. As a result of this fateful day at Fort Henry, 185 soldiers in the 35th Foot were killed and many more were wounded. This somewhat traumatic event was later depicted in James Fenimore Cooper’s book Last of the Mohicans (1826), and recreated on the silver screen in the 1992 film of the same name.

Luckily, the 35th Foot had its opportunity for revenge against General Montcalm when, in1759, they fought as part of General Wolfe’s army at the Battle of Quebec. With their steady fire, the 35th was able to break the Régiment Royal Roussillon (a French infantry unit) and run the French out of the same Fort that had been taken from them just two years earlier.

After understanding the story of the 35th Foot and its important role in the events surrounding Fort Henry, James Graham’s powder horn begins to make much more sense. Although we cannot say for certain, it is highly likely that much of the design on the powder horn was inspired by Graham’s own experience with the 35th regiment. It is highly likely that Graham was a soldier in the 35th and could have easily been a part of the unit during the surrender of Fort Henry, the Battle of Quebec, and several other military conquests that were carried out by the British during the French & Indian War. This powder horn, whether it was made during the War or right after, continues to serve as a visual diary of specific places and events that were important to its owner. Regardless of his level of involvement, it is clear that James Graham took the 35th Regiment’s motto to heart; his detailed, delicate, and carefully designed engravings are physical reminders of this soldiers’ journey, and more importantly, his devotion to his brothers in arms."


Is the number 35 anywhere on the horn?

"PV" might stand for "present"

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/pv
 
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Yes and the guy seemed to be illiterate cause he made spelling errors. In the Pense.

When you say it’s obvious what do you mean by that? To me I think it’s really old. But I’m not an expert what so ever. Thank you for taking the time in the help.
 
Now that is a wealth of information. I really appreciate that. I knew there was a story and it makes more sense. Thank you again!
 
It's obvious that you need to buy a Flintlock rifle, load it with black powder from that horn and enjoy / experience history 1st hand.

Shooting black powder is lots of fun.

What is written below the motto and what is the full name under the date?

I see "Drit" below the motto and "Henry" below the date.

"Drit" could be "Droit" meaning "Right" or "Due"

27757295_5.jpg

http://www.icollector.com/1761-Fren...ent-of-Foot-Engraved-Horn-Container_i27757295
 
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I’m not seeing any Roman numerals. I do see “drit” and in the box next to Henri_chitA? The last letter looks like a A to me. And there’s faint lines that look like Chita after Henry. ???
 
That's a stylized version of the Royal Cipher. I know because I put the same thing on my second horn.

The top features the crown and on the left the British Lion. On the right is the fettered unicorn that represents Scotland (that's why it's fettered). "Honi Soit Q Mal Y Pense" is Latin for "Evil to he who thinks it." That was pretty common on carved horns of the era.

Suggest you take the horn to the Honourable Company of Horners for their examination. Art deCamp or Roland Cadle would be good people to examine it. If you're in Virginia, take it to the De Witt Museum (but make an appointment first)

Dieu et mon Droit is also a saying from the era and is French for God and my Right. That was also on the cipher.

Here is a modernized version:

iu


James Dresslar's book on The Engraved Powder Horn is a good book to reference for the F&I era powder horn. May I ask how you came about it?
 
Oh very nice. thanks for straightening that up. I’m in Illinois. There’s a auction house in Chicago I’m going to try to take it too this weekend. I spoke with him before I sent the pics he would like to examine it.

I collect bicycles. And when I answered a add on CL i asked the people if they had anything else. And then they went into the story that they are cleaning out there grandpas house because he had passed. And I said well shoot me over pics of what your willing to sell and this happened to be something they found and sent me a pic and had asked me
If I knew what it was. And I said no but I want it. And as soon as I got it I started the research. :) so this is how I ended up with it.
 
You might want to go to Conner Prairie Museum (Fishers, Indiana) and take Art De Camp's hornmaking classes. It's not to make the horn but to tap into Art for his insights into old horns.
 
I totally would if I had a little passion for this sorta thing. It’s very interesting but I’m way to busy to take on another hobby. I was just hoping there was a collector out there that could help me identifying how old this particular horn is. I’m going to take it to heritage auctions and see what they have to say. :)
 
It doesn't help much, but I agree that the person who did the carving was, at best, semi-literate, and was copying, as best he could, the royal crest from something else.

For that reason, I am inclined to think it is genuinely old (though heavily cleaned by "scraping", removing a lot of detail).

Jim
 
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