H110 light show?

Nick is right. I made a batch to test H110 for my 44 (8-3/8" barrel) and did not have the patience to wait until the next day to check the loads so I jumped in my truck and headed up in the hills to shoot em off in the dark. Approaching max load the flash simmered down. Good times! No flat primers but it sure kicked. That is the only gun that my old Speer manual gives heavier loads than the rest of the manuals.

The 454 Casul... now there's a flash!
 
Steve - if you want some flash, try a 375JDJ out of a magna-ported barrel. It's a 444 marlin case necked down to 375. Shot out a 14" Contender. Quite a show at dust...with the flames shooting out of the ports.
 
Muzzle flash....umm, yeah, some of us have gotten over that and would rather not have it. Even though some of us had fun with it for a while, I now regard it as undesirable. Therefore, I prefer IMR-4227 over H-110; and AA-9 over 2400. In fact, I'm done with H-110/W-296 for that reason, as well as the fact that it's got a very narrow range from starting loads to maximum loads. And, in my 45 Colt Vaquero, I got hangfires using it with WLP primers, while simply changing to CCI-350 magnum primers corrected that problem. No doubt it's a good powder when used within its sweet-spot, which is quite a bit hotter than I want to go in 45 Colt. It's better suited to the higher pressures of the 44 and 357 magnums. At maximum loads in a carbine or rifle it really shines.
 
Nick CS. Thats certainly interesting and definitely counterintuitive about amount of powder vs flash. Made worse because I dont want to turn it up anymore, namely for recoils sake. Even at my young...ish age arthritis is kicking in to the point I only want to shoot power house mags occasionally.

Gun is a 629-5 with a 5" barrel. My favorite handgun.
 
110 and 296 are not the same powder. In my experience, 296 performs much better in the 357 than 110 and 110 does much better in the 44 than 296
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Some reloading manuals still show different loads for 296 and H110 but I believe that is carryover data from the past when they actually were different powders.

If you call Hodgdon, they will tell you that these powders are exactly the same powder. No difference. At all. Zero. Comes from the same factory.

As to why there is a fireball with 296/H110, Quickload indicates that only about 80% of the powder is burning in my 6.5" Model 29. It will be less if you have a 4" gun.

That un-burned powder burns when it leaves the barrel.

Some of the other powders already mentioned will burn closer to 100% and thus have less muzzle flash. You will generally lose some velocity with those powders but if it's just range plinkers, who cares?
 
From a business standpoint, why have 2 identical powders in different containers? Answer: Shelf-space. From a marketing standpoint, you maximize your exposure by having more product. Unfortunately, with respect to pistol powders in this range - there is little competition. With production being a sporadic as it has been, and little competition, it makes no sense to run 2 identical lines. There would be absolutely no love-loss to simply make a public statement that the powders are identical [now], so we are eliminating 1. But, they haven't.

But, if you wanted to phase out 2 similar powders, what would be the easiest to do? Tell anyone who contacts you that it's the same powder and let the forums take care of squelching the noise.

As written, my data shows different results for the 110 and 296 in respective cartridges. Yes, my data goes back to the 80's. But, from a business perspective, it makes no sense to run 2 identical powders.

FYI - In the 90's I called Glock [Smyrna] several times. They swore there was no such thing as a "generation 1, 2, etc" Glock pistols. They were all Glocks...and you can't shoot reloads through them.
 
But, from a business perspective, it makes no sense to run 2 identical powders.
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They sell H110 as their own. They distribute Win296 by licensing agreement with Winchester. That is a logic for selling the same product under two names.

In March 2006, Hodgdon® Powder Company and Winchester Ammunition announced that Winchester branded reloading powders would be licensed to Hodgdon. Winchester Smokeless Propellants, the choice of loading professionals, are available to the handloader to duplicate the factory performance of loads from handgun to rifle and shotgun.
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History of Winchester Powder
 
Before Hodgdon bought Winchester powders in 06~~??
296 & H110 were two different powders I do believe. At the time I thought H-110 had a heavier coating of graphite. Which kinda inhibited the H-110's ignition. Today so I've heard the two powders are near identical in burn pressures generated.

Although for my benefit. I've always preferred 296 use in my 44 verses H-110. Target loads or for cast shooting. IMR 4227 or AA-#7 get grabbed out of the drawer for the used.
 
As Dufus said:
H110/WW296 is not a good powder for use in 45 Colt shot in a Vaquero without or without magnum primers.
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That's only because it has to be loaded beyond my personal limitations. The Vaquero is as strong as the Blackhawk. I'm the weak link in the chain, not the gun. Perhaps if I had the long-barreled version it would be more comfortable with such hot loads, but mine is the 4-5/8" original Vaquero, not the New Vaquero. I can shoot a dozen rounds of the really hot stuff pretty well, but it stings my hands and continued shooting leads to flinching and not much fun. I like +P loads to a certain performance level that is not well served by H-110. 255 grain bullets at 1200 fps is about the limits of enjoyable shooting for me and most of what I shoot will be a little below 1000.
 
Disseminator - That simply describes Hogdon purchasing the rights to the powder. It does not explain the logic behind packaging 2 identical products in different packages for the past 12 years.

Again, it really makes no difference. But, on my bench, I'll follow my data and logic. At this point, after 30 years of reloading, I'm happy when there is any powder on the shelf.
 
When you shoot the 460 S&W mag loading 50 gr (yes I do mean 50 gr) of H110 powder you will experience a BOOM and a muzzle flash that really rocks your clock ! I load H110 for 357, 44 and 460 and it's the nature of the powder to present elevated db's and flash . If it's a concern there is the option of 2400 which is an excellent powder that can be downloaded to suit your needs.
 
Northof50 said:
Disseminator - That simply describes Hogdon purchasing the rights to the powder. It does not explain the logic behind packaging 2 identical products in different packages for the past 12 years.

Again, it really makes no difference. But, on my bench, I'll follow my data and logic. At this point, after 30 years of reloading, I'm happy when there is any powder on the shelf.
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You won't believe other folks on this forum that H110 and 296 are the same powder, so why don't you ask Hodgdon yourself?

Here is their contact page: http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/contact
 
74A95 - There is nobody on this forum [or any other forum] that is an expert at the inner workings of Hogdon. "Believe" is an inappropriate term. I simply don't agree, nor would I take information on a "forum" as gospel.

Respectfully.
 
North,

Your own thinking has blinded you. One obvious reason to market one powder under two different names is because some people believe 296 works better in their .357 and 110 works better in their 44, leading them to keep more of the same powder on hand.

And by the way, Hodgdon is not alone in the practice.
 
BBarn - Let me understand this correctly. I'm blinded by my own evidence because I doubt what I read on a forum. OK

The problem with your argument is that there is NO shortage of demand for powder. Hogdon does not have to coerce or trick people into buying their products. There is a shortage more often than not. There is NO logical reason to offer 2 identical product to a marketplace that suffers through product shortages on a regular basis.
 
I gave a logical reason, tied to your own practice, that allows them to sell more powder. You appear to have missed it or are ignoring it. Believe what you wish.
 
Don't confuse people with facts if their mind's made up. I'm just putting my money on what Hodgdon told me....and several others. It's the same. Anyone who got better groups with one, and thinks it's just the powder is ignoring all the other factors that make a group good on a particular day. Different batches or powder, different lots of primers, different brass, weather, etc. It's possible the person who doesn't believe they are the same isn't aware of all the different factors that contribute to "the best load". There really is no telling what their level of expertise is. It's just not worth arguing about. Believe the manufacturer, they know more than anyone else.
 
NOSecondBest - there has only been 1 fact presented by those who believe it is the same powder - Hogdon has the license to market the name and powder WW296. There have been no other facts - just opinions and and hearsay information about "phone calls" and verbal communication.

My experience? 30 years of reloading on single and progressive presses; wildcat, pistol, rifle cartridges; chronographing loads for 20+.
 
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