granny gets tasered. when will people learn?

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(PS We do not "Know" she assaulted anyone. We only know there is an allegation she did so. But we do know he popped an old woman with a Tazer, that was sitting on a bench. I don't think it can be justified to taze someone because of an allegation. You can only justify it if the person is a threat, in my opinion)
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We do know, she plead no contest to domestic assault (of her grand-daughter no less)

You did make a correct statement in that you cannot taze someone because of an allegation. She was not tazed because of an allegation, she was told she was under arrest because of an allegation. You can arrest someone for that. Then they go to trial. She was tazed because she was resisting arrest. Once again, here are the options in this case:
1. use physical force to affect the arrest (grab, hold, even up to strikes)
2. pepper spray
3. taser
4. baton
5. firearm

Which of these presents the least probability of the officer and the subject being injured? (let's take out 4 and 5 for the sake of sanity).

option 1- the officer might possibly be hurt (unlikely). the granny might be hurt (possible)
option 2- the officer might be hurt (enclosed area increases chance of officer and any others being contaminated by his own spray). granny might be hurt (maybe, due to the fact that she still must be forced to the ground after being sprayed)
option 3- officer is not in any real danger. granny has a .00162% chance of being killed by the taser and also a chance of injury caused by the fall.
 
Quick Poll

I've been busy and just caught this thread. I'll stay out because I've already made my opinion known, but out of curiosity:

Who here has taken a TASER ride?

Me x 3 (all full five-seconds)

Who else? Just wondering.
 
I'll try to explain

Quote: "And one other thing I don't understand. According to law, what does the fact that a person resisting arrest is 68 and female?"

First, according to law, the person has to be resisting arrest. She was already under arrest, in a holding area, and she was not resisting arrest.

What she was doing, was pulling her hand back from him after he suddenly grabbed her wrist which is a normal human reaction, especially for an elderly person. That is not an excuse to start popping someone with 50,000 volts of electricity, simply because they suddenly back up, or turn their head, if startled.

Nobody has said anything about a 68 year old female being exempt from the law. (At least not me) I believe what everyone is trying to tell you, is that the law should be followed by everyone, including Lt. Electro.

Rember, the woman was alleged to have committed a crime, not convicted and sentenced to electric shock therapy.


She entered a plea of no lo contendre, or non contesting, and it is not an admission of guilt. It is a choice to not fight the legal system so as to safe time, money, and the possiblity of a harsher sentence.
As far as it being her "grandaughter no less" that she was alleged to have committed the crime of domestic violence against, we also do not know how old the grandaughter is, or if there truly was any violence committed against her.

But we do see her sitting down, and then see her get tazed.
 
Who here has taken a TASER ride?
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Don't go there, SC. If you do, I'll have to ask what it has to do with the topic and point out that "The Training Ride" is quickly disappearing from fashion in light of a recent series of suits filed by Police Officers who've taken "The Ride" and suffered serious injury....or are we to doubt the words of those Police Officers?

Again, The Taser is a great tool in the toolbox. But it remains a tool of Serious Violence.

Rich
 
For those of you viewers who aren't familiar with physics, 50,000 volts sounds downright terrifying.

Personally, I've taken well over two million volts (2,000,000) with no ill effects bar my hair slowly standing on end - voltage is not the issue. Voltage is merely Potential Difference and is intrinisally harmless - amperage and pulse rate are the harming factors.

I just feel that it's important, in discussions such as these, to take Big Scary Numbers and put them in perspective.

For the record, five volts at a sufficient amperage will kill you deader'n hell. But a hand unit can't drive that kind of amperage.
 
and what about how the 68 year old woman felt?suppose she was scared too? Suppose the lt. was shouting at her because maybe he was also scared or just impatient and the "granny" was just being stubborn? I guess we'll never know...because in spite of what "procedure" says, there is still a bit of discretion that can be used along with other tools that dont elevate the situation to the point this one apparantly ended with.

there is no winner in this one.
 
Who here has taken a TASER ride?

Well, it is my intent to not saddle up for one.

But a cop pulled one on my son recently for driving down a county road with a rifle in his gun rack. (Keep in mind, in my state it is legal to ride down the road with a rifle in a gun rack)

Fortunately, he did not shoot him with it, just held him at Tazer Point, while he "asked for his identification/papers" and an explanation of "what he was intending to do, why was he in the area", etc.

(He was on the way to the rifle range. So he was the subject of an illegal, unconstitutional traffic stop)

Luckily, my son is young, strong, and would probably survived, except I do worry about his asthma, as I don't know what it would do to him. Thank God he didn't move his hand, or turn his head and find out.

Maybe it will kill an asthma patient, I don't know, as I haven't looked up any studies on the exact amount of asthma patients killed yet. But thank god this particular Captain Electro held his trigger finger, because my son froze like a good little obedient subject!

(Thank God he didn't move his hand, or turn his head and find out)
 
Heart failure anyone?

Quote: "Voltage is merely Potential Difference and is intrinisally harmless - amperage and pulse rate are the harming factors."

If you are tooling around with a pacemaker, and your have a weak ticker, would you want to get tazed with 50K volts, regardless of the amps?

(Let us do put it in perspective, shan't we?)
 
If I had a pacemaker and a police officer told me to stand up and place my hands behind my back or be tased, I don't think I'd risk it by non-compliance.

Your son's analogy holds only to the point that he was not under arrest nor had he refused to be placed under arrest. (The stop does sound fishy based on how you described it though.)

Don't make the mistake of thinking that this woman was just sitting there and the officer tased her. Read the links to the stories again and see that she:

1. was being placed under arrest.
2. was told by the officer at least 3 times to stand up.
3. Refused stating it was "impossible" (anyone heard why it was impossible yet?)
4. was warned that if she did not comply, she would be tased.
5. pulled away when the officer attempted to grab her hand (instead of tasing her).
6. was tased and fell to the ground
7. was told to place hands behind her back
8. refused to do this also
9. was tased several more times (over 20 seconds?)

These statements were gathered from reading the accounts posted in this thread. Oh, and just for clarification, #s 3,5, and 8 all are included in "resisting arrest." So, Gary, what she was doing when she pulled her hand away was resisting arrest.
 
If I had a pacemaker and a police officer told me to stand up and place my hands behind my back or be tased, I don't think I'd risk it by non-compliance.
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Layman's Translation for that, Jcoiii:
If I were weak and the other guy showed overwhelming power, I think I'd bend over when asked.

Problem with the rationale is that the BEST will NEVER bend over under those circumstances, no matter the odds or cost (and, I suspect, neither will you). Shall we continue to punish that mindset in America and reward those who are, ummm, 'more compliant' to our will? Last I read, I thought we all called the latter "Sheeple".
Rich
 
I thought it might be hear, hear. Or also Hear here?

And Rich, I was simply giving a smart aleck answer to the idea that I should not use my taser (which I don't carry btw) because someone might have a *pacemaker. And I also do not advocate doing whatever some bully says, cop or no. What I do advocate is effecting an arrest with the minimal amount of force. If you are being charged with a crime and being placed under arrest, the officer has the right, responsibilty and authority to place you under arrest. Plain as I can describe how I think about this particular incident.

Suspect resisted lawful arrest. Officer used force (not the force I would have used at all) and looks really stupid.

Oh, do we know if the woman was injured at all? I know she was in the hospital, but I don't recall if there were any injuries described. Anyone know?
 
Fact: Granny was in the station, granny came there of her own accord.

Fact: The officer towered over the granny, size and strength.

Fact: The taser should not have been employed

Observation: Video clearly shows the officer reaching out for the granny, she pulled back (not uncommon with someone that is not understanding what is happening), officer immediatly goes for the taser.

Opinion: I am sure that the officer did not try to explain to the woman what was happening and why. Probably, "mam, you are under arrest please stand up" officer reaches for granny. Granny "what, why, what is happening" as she pulls back....ZZZZAAAPPPPP
 
Your lack of facts could fill a book!

She was at the Police station, correct. From there you offer biased speculation.

Keep up the good work
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+1 Rich

That's what this discussion is really all about: America's downward spiral into Authoritarianism.
Even if you subscribe to the notion that the first shot was justified (I don't), the follow-ups weren't. Merely his way of torturing her into obedience.
And people on this board (*this board!!!*) cheering it on and saying that she deserved it because she wasn't an obedient little sheeple.
I suspect you'll be singing a different tune when they come to collect your guns.
 
TBO-
A 72 year old man exiting a car at a traffic stop, firing a semi-auto rifle is a bit different from an unarmed 68 year old woman sitting in a Police Station.

Spurious comparison at best.

This thread is pretty much played out.
Rich
 
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