Giving my country away
- Thread starter mete
- Start date
Border bandit
Inactive
yeah, and just imagine.....Robert Redford and Alec Baldwin said they would leave this country and go somewhere else if Bush were elected....and to think there are people literally dying everyday to get into this great nation..I say to Robert and Alec..."don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out," stupid idiots !!!!!!
OrangeSkies
New member
GRRRRRRRR!!!!! 
Man, that makes me mad!
At least Congress isn't buying into this crap - yet...
Man, that makes me mad!At least Congress isn't buying into this crap - yet...
Read the whole article here: http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20041110-123424-5467r.htm
Border bandit
Inactive
That Sorry Bastard !!!!
Bush simply recognizes that immigrants are doing the heavy lifting in our economy since the native-born refuse to work.KSFreeman,
Agreed, alot of the American youth plan to do nothing with there lives, and most don't even want to work. So let the immagrants do the work if everyone remembers this country was founded by immagrants.
The New Colossus
Emma Lazarus (1849-1887)
"Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame..."
Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
"Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
with silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
Agreed, alot of the American youth plan to do nothing with there lives, and most don't even want to work. So let the immagrants do the work if everyone remembers this country was founded by immagrants.
The New Colossus
Emma Lazarus (1849-1887)
"Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame..."
Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
"Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
with silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
I am all for immigration - legally. A work visa system needs to be implemented. Along with that the 'guest workers' (as they call it in the article) need to be under the same minimum wage system.
However, legitimizing the actions of somebody who broke the law seems wrong. I know many just want to be here for honest work and opportunity, but they came here the wrong way.
I guess in my mind any solution is flawed. Arresting and deporting a person who is willing to do an honest job that an American won't do is also wrong. Like much of life there is some grey area.
However, legitimizing the actions of somebody who broke the law seems wrong. I know many just want to be here for honest work and opportunity, but they came here the wrong way.
I guess in my mind any solution is flawed. Arresting and deporting a person who is willing to do an honest job that an American won't do is also wrong. Like much of life there is some grey area.
mete, . . . unless your family tree is awash with names like Jumping Bear, Ruptured Possum, Princess White Birch, or Running Horse: you need to calm your ancestral self down a notch.
Not knowing your pedigree, . . . I doubt that it is Shawnee, Iriquoi, Souix, and Navajo. Probably more like German, Polish, English, French, Dutch, Danish, Swede, Scot, Irish, etc. or some combination thereof.
That having been said, . . . you have no more right to jump up and down about Latinos or Asians or African Americans, . . . or anyone else. The only difference between you and them, . . . your ancestors might have had a legal piece of paper, . . . but they probably did not (the vast majority of all immigrants has historically been illegal), . . . and you really are not any more than a squatter yourself.
Ownership of this planet was not platted and ceded to any particular race, ethnic group, or skin color. Matter of fact: ownership belongs not to anyone on the face of this earth. Stewardship is the very best we can hope to ever attain, . . . and truthfully: we have all been pretty sorry even at stewardship.
Now don't think I'm ranting at you, . . . because I am not. I am a white, anglo-saxon, protestant (WASP for short) myself, . . . but I know that I too am only an interloper on the 10 acres I habitate for the time being. It is up to me to continue to nurture, sustain, and steward my land to be productive, and if it means sharing it with someone who says "Heil" or "Shalom" or "Como Esta", . . . that's cool too. They have every single bit the same right to be here as I have. I just may have gotten here a bit sooner.
Besides that, . . . I have been in some of the places they have come from. I have slept in their beds, . . . eaten their food, . . . (but I didn't drink the water
), . . . and "walked a mile in their mocassins". That is why as a 17 year veteran of our armed forces, . . . I have no qualms about opening the doors and letting them in. Come to think of it, . . . were you ever there???
May God bless,
Dwight
Not knowing your pedigree, . . . I doubt that it is Shawnee, Iriquoi, Souix, and Navajo. Probably more like German, Polish, English, French, Dutch, Danish, Swede, Scot, Irish, etc. or some combination thereof.
That having been said, . . . you have no more right to jump up and down about Latinos or Asians or African Americans, . . . or anyone else. The only difference between you and them, . . . your ancestors might have had a legal piece of paper, . . . but they probably did not (the vast majority of all immigrants has historically been illegal), . . . and you really are not any more than a squatter yourself.
Ownership of this planet was not platted and ceded to any particular race, ethnic group, or skin color. Matter of fact: ownership belongs not to anyone on the face of this earth. Stewardship is the very best we can hope to ever attain, . . . and truthfully: we have all been pretty sorry even at stewardship.
Now don't think I'm ranting at you, . . . because I am not. I am a white, anglo-saxon, protestant (WASP for short) myself, . . . but I know that I too am only an interloper on the 10 acres I habitate for the time being. It is up to me to continue to nurture, sustain, and steward my land to be productive, and if it means sharing it with someone who says "Heil" or "Shalom" or "Como Esta", . . . that's cool too. They have every single bit the same right to be here as I have. I just may have gotten here a bit sooner.
Besides that, . . . I have been in some of the places they have come from. I have slept in their beds, . . . eaten their food, . . . (but I didn't drink the water
), . . . and "walked a mile in their mocassins". That is why as a 17 year veteran of our armed forces, . . . I have no qualms about opening the doors and letting them in. Come to think of it, . . . were you ever there???May God bless,
Dwight
KSFreeman,
More importantly, the Baby Boomer bolus is nearing the distal end of the Social Security python. If we don't get some fresh ticket-punchers into the system but fast, the whole Ponzi scheme may collapse, and then where would that leave the Republicans and the Democrats? Fighting off hordes of cat food-fed, cane-swinging Gray Panthers, that's where...
More importantly, the Baby Boomer bolus is nearing the distal end of the Social Security python. If we don't get some fresh ticket-punchers into the system but fast, the whole Ponzi scheme may collapse, and then where would that leave the Republicans and the Democrats? Fighting off hordes of cat food-fed, cane-swinging Gray Panthers, that's where...
I'm pretty sure my great grandparents were illegals, and everything worked out for us.
However, the term is illegal immigrants, not "uninvited guests". I can understand how legitimizing those who have been breaking our laws for their benefit might make Mete a little unhappy. It certainly doesn't sound like this program is designed to be a good deal for those who've spent years desperately trying to legally enter this country - they're not receiving amnesty, entry visas or work cards. Those deals are for those that have broken our laws.
But I can appreciate that a problem you can't stop is better dealt with than wished against. Maybe such practical thinking could be applied to the "war" on drugs.
However, the term is illegal immigrants, not "uninvited guests". I can understand how legitimizing those who have been breaking our laws for their benefit might make Mete a little unhappy. It certainly doesn't sound like this program is designed to be a good deal for those who've spent years desperately trying to legally enter this country - they're not receiving amnesty, entry visas or work cards. Those deals are for those that have broken our laws.
But I can appreciate that a problem you can't stop is better dealt with than wished against. Maybe such practical thinking could be applied to the "war" on drugs.
I never mentioned race ,ethnic group etc.My family came here legally 100 years ago. But in those days if you wanted to stay you had to work. Today many come here illegally for the freebies!!! They come by the millions and are given drivers licences, medical care ,etc ,etc, some even college scholarships !!! And of course they include terrorists and criminals....A country has not only the right but the responsibility to control it's borders. You can't have a secure homeland with unsecure borders !...Dwight, as far as indians [yes they have stated they would prefer to be called american indians!!!! ] they also are immigrants but from an earlier time.You made many assumptions about me and my thoughts.That I dare criticize an ILLEGAL I must be some type of racist. No, I want people to come here legally, work hard , without freebies,learn to speak english [it should be our official language], become an american...Perhaps you should read Michelle Malkins book detailing the story of illegals.
Malkin has an interesting perspective on "working for a living" for someone that has time to make 8-20 blog entries EVERY SINGLE DAY.
http://www.michellemalkin.com/
Furthermore I am not going to take ANY advice concerning immigration for an honest to God proponent of INTERNMENT CAMPS. Both historical (WWII) and contemporary (War on Terror). Apparently she is very selective on just WHO she decides are worthy of "civil rights".
http://michellemalkin.com/books.htm
rolling thunder
New member
reconquista
Illegal hispanic immigrants gets a LOT of attention. Meanwhile, slowly, they are gaining ground in their legal numbers as citizens of the USA. There is no doubt, (it's too late to stop) that their reconquista will be successful. The reconquista is a movement to create a very strong voting block of hispanic citizens. In another ten years or so (that's just my WAG) they will create and overturn laws of immigartion from Mexico to the US. Once they become a large enough voting block in Cali, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas. (they would have a bigger presence in the wilds of southwest Colorado except for there is a lot very prevelant SPAINARD's who still to this day, take great exception to being called, or even lumped into the same ethnicity as Mexicans. But just as sure as the sun shines, they will someday take back what we took from then, and without a single shot being fired.
Illegal hispanic immigrants gets a LOT of attention. Meanwhile, slowly, they are gaining ground in their legal numbers as citizens of the USA. There is no doubt, (it's too late to stop) that their reconquista will be successful. The reconquista is a movement to create a very strong voting block of hispanic citizens. In another ten years or so (that's just my WAG) they will create and overturn laws of immigartion from Mexico to the US. Once they become a large enough voting block in Cali, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas. (they would have a bigger presence in the wilds of southwest Colorado except for there is a lot very prevelant SPAINARD's who still to this day, take great exception to being called, or even lumped into the same ethnicity as Mexicans. But just as sure as the sun shines, they will someday take back what we took from then, and without a single shot being fired.
Interesting first post.
As to the "hispanic voting block", I was listening to some analysis of the last election that didn't make it sound like hispanics tended to vote as a block, but voted more regionally (FL produced quite a few Rep. hispanic votes, for instance).
I imagine that, like the immigrants before them, the hispanics who've been in the country for awhile might lose touch with their origins and become protective of the prosperity they have here.
As a whole, the hispanic population seems to be one that values the benefits of hard work, rather than handouts. That attitude is more likely to produce conservative citizens who will wish to protect the prosperity of their adopted nation, IMO.
As to the "hispanic voting block", I was listening to some analysis of the last election that didn't make it sound like hispanics tended to vote as a block, but voted more regionally (FL produced quite a few Rep. hispanic votes, for instance).
I imagine that, like the immigrants before them, the hispanics who've been in the country for awhile might lose touch with their origins and become protective of the prosperity they have here.
As a whole, the hispanic population seems to be one that values the benefits of hard work, rather than handouts. That attitude is more likely to produce conservative citizens who will wish to protect the prosperity of their adopted nation, IMO.
Danindetroit
New member
Every human walking the united states is an immigrant. It just depends how far back you want to go. Asian peoples crossed into alaska 20,000 to 40,000 years ago and migrated down the pacific coast down to south america. My wife is mexican I never bothered to ask her grandmother how she got here. Her grandmother has lived in MI and Texas. She speaks perfect english and spanish. My father was the only person in his family, who started school(ST.Stanislaus?) who was able to speak english. I think his parents never learned english, so they lived in a polish part of the city until they died, so they could communicate. I have no idea how they arrived here. Never met them, never asked about it. In SE MI the DMV has things in about 6 languages, including polack, I THINK IT IS WRONG. The borders should be kept closed as tightly as possible to illeagals, and illeagal already here should be found, those on expired visas, or not. Allowing illegals to stay or get status should be case by case issue. People who are working, or have not had a violent criminal past, etc., should have the ability to be able to obtain legit status, on a case by case basis. This could be something that has a sunset provision to see if it is working or just garbage.
As for americans being born here not doing heavy lifting in the work place, how heavy do you want? I have done my fair share for 25% of my life or more.
As for americans being born here not doing heavy lifting in the work place, how heavy do you want? I have done my fair share for 25% of my life or more.
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What ones parents did has no bearing on what one thinks about immigration or control of a nations border. I say this as somebody whose ancestors came to America before she was a nation and helped in her creation and then came to Texas before she was a Republic and did the same. All of it legally (such as it was). I am rather sick and tired of these ridiculous “arguments” that “unless your family tree is awash with names like Jumping Bear, Ruptured Possum, Princess White Birch, or Running Horse: you need to calm your ancestral self down a notch.” What does somebody’s ancestors have to do with anything? If I were a descendant of John Wesley Hardin would that mean that I couldn’t condemn criminals or their actions? Would I be unable to voice an opinion on laws or seek greater law enforcement simply because there were criminals in my family tree? I’ll say it again, an individuals ancestral history has no bearing on the legitimacy of their current view on anything.
A nation exists. Period. All nations have the right and obligation to establish borders and controls of those borders. At various times in a nations existence those controls might be more or less necessary than at other times. The fact that 200 years ago immigration wasn’t an issue has nothing to do with today. The fact that 100 years ago certain people were feared as a class of immigrants (“yellow horde”) has no bearing on today. The fact that has bearing today is that a large number of people are illegally crossing the border and an even larger number of people have already done so and show no sign of desiring to become Americans (for a variety of reasons). Moreover, a majority of those that are illegally crossing the border today are not the same type of illegal alien as even 10 years ago. More and more of them are criminals already and will continue to act criminally here in the United States. That is the issue we have today.
A nation exists. Period. All nations have the right and obligation to establish borders and controls of those borders. At various times in a nations existence those controls might be more or less necessary than at other times. The fact that 200 years ago immigration wasn’t an issue has nothing to do with today. The fact that 100 years ago certain people were feared as a class of immigrants (“yellow horde”) has no bearing on today. The fact that has bearing today is that a large number of people are illegally crossing the border and an even larger number of people have already done so and show no sign of desiring to become Americans (for a variety of reasons). Moreover, a majority of those that are illegally crossing the border today are not the same type of illegal alien as even 10 years ago. More and more of them are criminals already and will continue to act criminally here in the United States. That is the issue we have today.
Danindetroit
New member
So are you saying that a person's background does not color their opinions on issues?
How do you become an american? A person born in columbia is an american. Just a south american. A person can become a citizen, through various routes. You can legally cross the border, have a child in the US, that child is a citizen, the mother, and maybe father can petiton to become citizens.
Morepeople have been crossing the border in the last 10 years because as american workers were needed in better jobs, less skilled jobs opened up. Most MI farmers were complaining about the lack of legit migrant help to pick crops in the mid-90's. College kids instead of getting menial labor summerjobs were getting skilled paying internships. Migrants were working during the day as lanscapers, construction, etc, and then at night as dishwashers and busboys. Where is the jump in crime? The crime rate was down through the 90's. Not because of less immigrants, but because of more jobs. Companies were hiring prisoners to come and work at plastic molding plants in Macomb and neighboring counties.
How do you become an american? A person born in columbia is an american. Just a south american. A person can become a citizen, through various routes. You can legally cross the border, have a child in the US, that child is a citizen, the mother, and maybe father can petiton to become citizens.
Morepeople have been crossing the border in the last 10 years because as american workers were needed in better jobs, less skilled jobs opened up. Most MI farmers were complaining about the lack of legit migrant help to pick crops in the mid-90's. College kids instead of getting menial labor summerjobs were getting skilled paying internships. Migrants were working during the day as lanscapers, construction, etc, and then at night as dishwashers and busboys. Where is the jump in crime? The crime rate was down through the 90's. Not because of less immigrants, but because of more jobs. Companies were hiring prisoners to come and work at plastic molding plants in Macomb and neighboring counties.
Where is the crime?
Crime has gone down because we over 2 million people in prison and jail, and they are serving longer mandatory sentences. Something like 25% of all the people incarcerated are illegal aliens. We have 4 million more people on parole or probation, mostly for minor offenses.
And, we have 80,000 convicted illegal alien felons that INS is trying to track down with a measely 2,300 agents. INS had pretty much trying to track down the 320,000 illegal alien absconders who refuse to show up for a deportation hearing.
A question. How did all the hard work and heavy lifting get done in American before we got flooded with millions of illegal aliens? Americans did it and they had to fight for a decent wage and job conditions. Now the illegals come and will work for peanuts and employers fill their jobs with them.
Crime has gone down because we over 2 million people in prison and jail, and they are serving longer mandatory sentences. Something like 25% of all the people incarcerated are illegal aliens. We have 4 million more people on parole or probation, mostly for minor offenses.
And, we have 80,000 convicted illegal alien felons that INS is trying to track down with a measely 2,300 agents. INS had pretty much trying to track down the 320,000 illegal alien absconders who refuse to show up for a deportation hearing.
A question. How did all the hard work and heavy lifting get done in American before we got flooded with millions of illegal aliens? Americans did it and they had to fight for a decent wage and job conditions. Now the illegals come and will work for peanuts and employers fill their jobs with them.