G19 accuracy at 25 yards - just dinner plate accurate? Or is it me?

Yes, if accuracy was the goal, the after market barrels (on the whole) were likely to make the Glock shoot worse rather than better. The factory barrels shot well enough that there was not a lot of room for improvement but unlimited potential to shoot worse.

At least they were all "drop in" reliable. Some may have been more cast bullet friendly or offered better chamber support as well.
 
Bargain basement ammunition?
Combat sights?
Standing two hand isosceles hold?
Dark indoor pistol range?
Yeah I'd be lucky to hit all 15 rounds from a G19 in 6 inches.
Not that I'm the best shooting guy but all the above works against accurate bull's eye scoring.
 
In my experience, decent quality guns that will NOT hold 4" or better at 25 yards are more rare than those that will.
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Yep, that's what I've found as well.

The elements of good shooting are: consistent grip, focus on the front sight, smooth manipulation of the trigger so as to not disturb sight alignment, and follow through. Any one of these can cause wild shooting....or....you've got a lemon...rare as that might be with a Glock. JMHO, Rod
 
sigarms228 said:
While the Glock 19 is a decently accurate pistol I don't expect mechanical accuracy to be what full size metal frame pistols are.
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I'm not sure that a metal frame makes all that much difference in accuracy with aimed fire. Many gunsmiths and experts suggest -- for aimed fire -- that accuracy is most dependent upon a consistent lockup between the barrel and the sights with each shot. That part of the gun (i.e., how the barrel and sights align consistently with each shot) is pretty much the same whether the frame is metal or not -- in some cases the upper assembly (slide, barrel and sights) are almost identical.

For Ransom Rest testing, a metal frame gives better results, because that is "unaimed" fire, and a polymer frame may not return to the exact same position with each shot. But, if you to adjust the sights with each shot, I doubt you'd see a lot of difference in accuacy. Frame mounted optics work well on metal-framed guns, if the slide is well fit to the frame, but its less often done done with polymer framed guns.

I've got several polymer-framed guns that are marvelously accurate if I do my job well and use the sights.

sigarm228 said:
Glock 19 accuracy could be possibly less due to shorter barrel.
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Everything I've read or heard suggests that barrel length and accuracy are generally not that closely related.

A longer sight picture will make it easier for the shooter to be do his or her part, but as noted above, accuracy is more a function of a consistent sight/barrel relationship than anything else. The difference between a 19, 17,or 17L shouldn't account for a great difference in accuracy.

A longer barrel generally gives better round performance (i.e., it goes faster and possibly farther [because it's going faster], but the gun or a given round isn't generally more accurate.
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sigarms228
While the Glock 19 is a decently accurate pistol I don't expect mechanical accuracy to be what full size metal frame pistols are.
I'm not sure that a metal frame makes all that much difference in accuracy with aimed fire. Many gunsmiths and experts suggest -- for aimed fire -- that accuracy is most dependent upon a consistent lockup between the barrel and the sights with each shot. That part of the gun (i.e., how the barrel and sights align consistently with each shot) is pretty much the same whether the frame is metal or not -- in some cases the upper assembly (slide, barrel and sights) are almost identical.

For Ransom Rest testing, a metal frame gives better results, because that is "unaimed" fire, and a polymer frame may not return to the exact same position with each shot. But, if you to adjust the sights with each shot, I doubt you'd see a lot of difference in accuacy. Frame mounted optics work well on metal-framed guns, if the slide is well fit to the frame, but its less often done done with polymer framed guns.

I've got several polymer-framed guns that are marvelously accurate if I do my job well and use the sights.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sigarm228
Glock 19 accuracy could be possibly less due to shorter barrel.
Everything I've read or heard suggests that barrel length and accuracy are generally not that closely related.

A longer sight picture will make it easier for the shooter to be do his or her part, but as noted above, accuracy is more a function of a consistent sight/barrel relationship than anything else. The difference between a 19, 17,or 17L shouldn't account for a great difference in accuracy.

A longer barrel generally gives better round performance (i.e., it goes faster and possibly farther [because it's going faster], but the gun or a given round isn't generally more accurate.
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I find no fault in any of our answers... You pass!
 
I am no expert, far from it. However, every time that I go to my range, I always shoot one magazine at 25 yards. It took awhile but now I hit all 15 in a 4" group.
Sure, I take my time about 1 round / 3 seconds. So, I'm trying to say practice,practice, practice. Either that or pay a few $$ and have a pro show you a better technique.
 
My Sig 226 shot rings around my G19 at 25 yards, so did my Sigma. Now the G20 is a great shooter at that distance, but maybe the beefier frame makes it more accurate.
 
Probably more the difference between individual guns. I owned 2 Beretta's once upon a time. One shot great, the other not so much. I currently have 3 G19's. (Had 2, one was stolen. Bought a replacement then the stolen gun was recovered) All 3 shoot acceptably well, but 2 are much better than the other. My brother and I both own G20's. His has always been more accurate than mine regardless of which of us is pulling the trigger. My Sig 226 is no more accurate than the G19's. No worse either.


Not 25 yards, I rarely shoot there, but at 50', about 17 yards. I've found that once the trigger is mastered any Glock is about as accurate as a common out of the box 1911. The 1911's that have been set up as target pistols, either from the factory or aftermarket are a different story.

 
The fat front sight covers up a lot of the target as does the fat "ball".
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The cure for that would be using a six o'clock hold rather than a center hold.

Can a Glock 19 consistently shoot 8 inch groups at 25 yards, sure. With the right shooter 6 inch could be expected. Less than 6 inches? You may have to go with a different pistol, but I'm sure there's people out there that can.
 
Can a Glock 19 consistently shoot 8 inch groups at 25 yards, sure. With the right shooter 6 inch could be expected. Less than 6 inches? You may have to go with a different pistol, but I'm sure there's people out there that can.
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I think this thread has indicated there are a number of people that can.

On a good day I can do 4" at 25 yds standing, but typically 5" and less. And, excuse alert, given my astigmatism and its impact on my vision at distance (even with glasses) I'm pretty happy when I get that. The glasses get the target in focus, but blur the front sight slightly; without glasses it's the reverse (I find with rifles the front sight is enough far forward to be clear, but handguns are tricky). I can say the number of people that I've personally seen regularly return 3" and less while standing can be counted on one hand. And those are typically folks doing ~1000 rds a week. I did meet one guy a few years younger than me that was honestly one of the best natural handgun shooters I've ever seen and even shooting only a few times a year was able to hold impressive groups.

I did want to comment on this:
http://www.victorygunblog.com/blog/barrelrace17
I picked up a KKM Precision barrel for a Glock that had NiB-X straight from the distributor. For that particular Glock the barrel was slightly sloppy in terms of lockup with the slide (I remember the first run of NiB-X Glocks had some hangups so I have a running theory they took off some material to help alleviate that). For that one Glock and one barrel the KKM does get groups about 3/4" that of the stock barrel. This was a drop in barrel and the fit is noticeably tighter than the stock barrel. Now I also have two older Glocks whose stock barrels fit just as tightly as the drop-in KKM. I don't see much gain at all when I put the KKM in there.

While I think the test at the link is interesting, it's a sample of one barrel from each manufacturer and one loading for each bullet weight. Barrels are individuals. You can get QC to an impressive level and even still slight variances will appear between barrels and with regards to certain loads. I do think aftermarket barrels can be beneficial in some instances, but I'm betting making general statements about the degree of improvement isn't nearly as exact as some makers like to advertise.
 
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I have a problem because of my eyesight and glasses, so I ordered a pair of Bollé with the right (dominant eye) lens adjusted for 28" front sight distance, and the left for distance with a bifocal for reading. Mono-vision. Amber tint for contrast. I'll find out Monday the result.
 
cjsoccer3 do you own a laser sight you can affix on the rail?

I love lasers as a training tool. The laser will show every flinch and wooble YOU make.
#1. Try the laser while dry firing, see if you can hold it rock steady on target
#2. Try the laser while firing live round to see if that makes a difference
#3. Have a load mags inserting snap caps at random intervals, you can't know if you are pulling the trigger on a live round or snap cap. Any change in laser wiggle?

If the laser is dancing all over the target it is you. If the laser is pretty steady on target then I bet it is the gun, or a component thereof.
 
Being able to hit a plate at 75 feet in general is pretty good. I'd say that's combat accurate enough with a handgun, not a bullseye gun. Could you make a Glock 19 in a bullseye gun? Sure, better sights, trigger, barrel, maybe add counter weight. Or you can just buy a pistol that's good to go out of the box for that purpose. Metal framed guns tend to work better for this imo.
 
I'd say the dinner plate at 25 yards is fine using both paws. Nothing wrong with pistol or shooter. Practice and it should improve much.

I don't claim to be experienced with the 9mm by much. I just think it's not fulfilling going shooting without the 45auto. :o
 
Although this is my M&P40 and not a G19, there is no reason that a G19 cannot do just as well.
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Nice! Especially so offhand. Took my BIL out to shoot plates today but I did shoot one group on paper:

http://s107.photobucket.com/user/hvap90/media/Shooting/50 feet 155gr XTP.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0

First shot was out of the group but still 1 and 11/16 at 50 feet. I was a bit excited that the next 4 went into 11/16 though. This would extrapolate to roughly 1 inch at 25 yards. Up until now I've been chronographing and not shooting groups much. Including the first shot it would be 2.5" at 25 yards which is about what these pistols tend to do.

S&W M&P40 M2.0 5 inch barrel. Hornady 155 XTP, near max Power Pistol.
1283 fps, 567 ft/lb energy.
 
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