zombieslayer
New member
I agree with kraigwy- I've shot and handled one and it was really nice. I'm saving, slowly, to buy one.
FN made model 70 Winchesters
- Thread starter 270
- Start date
It would not be fun just having one rifle caliber. Thats why I have centerfires from 22-250 to .300 WIN MAG with 30.06's and 7MM-08's in between. I thought the 30.06 was all I needed then suddenly I had a craving for a 7MM MAG XCR Remington. It will do what the the 30.06 does and then even better. Did I need the 7 MM MAG? Probably not, but like other things, I would never have been happy until I tried one. I didn't need the 300 WIN. MAG either, but I thought in the future I might go on a big game hunt where I might need a little more umph. If a man has the money and wants to buy a
.375 then more power to them.
.375 then more power to them.
RaySendero
New member
Well...Let's see - You've never own a 375 or anything bigger than your 30/06; You've never shot one; You've probably never even handled one. Yet, you are convined you know what's best for us.
pythagorean
Moderator
The reason to get a .375 HH (or .416 or .458) is inside the head of the one who wants one. Actually the .375 HH is probably the best choice in the entire world (with or without Alaska!) for a "one rifle man."
It is much more pleasant to fire than the .338 Winchester, it is more versatile, it is world known, it is always pleasing in the accuracy department.
In fact, the big rifles are extremely accurate and less likely to spray targets at 100 yards. Those big bullets are a LOT more consistent than most underneath them in accuracy and performance.
I started to say that perhaps no one living and staying in North America really needs needs needs a .375 HH or bigger but actually having one (or bigger) could mean owning less rifles!
It is much more pleasant to fire than the .338 Winchester, it is more versatile, it is world known, it is always pleasing in the accuracy department.
In fact, the big rifles are extremely accurate and less likely to spray targets at 100 yards. Those big bullets are a LOT more consistent than most underneath them in accuracy and performance.
I started to say that perhaps no one living and staying in North America really needs needs needs a .375 HH or bigger but actually having one (or bigger) could mean owning less rifles!
LanceOregon
Moderator
That is correct, I have never owned or shot anything bigger than a 338 Winchester Magnum. I quickly determined that the 338 Winchester could not do anything that my .30-06 could not also accomplish here in Oregon. My rifle battery is .30-06, .270 Winchester, and .243 Winchester.
I'm very doubtful that the OP is seriously interested in getting a 375 H&H
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LanceOregon
Moderator
Now that is just plain silly. If limited to only 1 rifle, a .243 Winchester would be far more versatile.
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LanceOregon
Moderator
While that is a possibility, it is also rather unlikely.
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A .243 more versatile?
Seriously?
You can load a .375 down to .30-06 performance.
You cannot load a .243 up to above .30-06 performance.
LanceOregon, your arguments would be more accurate for non handloaders. TFL has a lot of handloaders, though.
Besides, why are you so emotionally invested in whether people buy larger calibers? This seems to be a very big thing to you. Is there some sub-text here?
Not to pick on you, you may be thinking of taking this to something like - "A lot of hunters buy larger calibers thinking that will make up for their lack of training or skill;" or "newbs buy magnums and then attempt long-distance shots that are way beyond their personal capabilities."
I could see your level of agitation if those are the folks you have in mind.
I used to live in Maine, and had a great deal of antipathy toward out-of-state hunters, who paid big money to go on their annual hunt, and then shot at the first flash of brown and white they'd see. Cows, often as not. Dogs, sometimes. In one case, a woman who was unaware enough to wear a suede jacket and white mittens while hiking a trail, during deer season...
This made me very jaundiced toward out-of-state hunters, for quite some time, although most couldn't have been so idiotic or else we'd have had a lot more damage. In fact, most must have been at least mostly ethical. But they all got smeared with the "careless and clueless" brush.
So I have to wonder if this .375 issue has some underlying history for you.
Seriously?
You can load a .375 down to .30-06 performance.
You cannot load a .243 up to above .30-06 performance.
LanceOregon, your arguments would be more accurate for non handloaders. TFL has a lot of handloaders, though.
Besides, why are you so emotionally invested in whether people buy larger calibers? This seems to be a very big thing to you. Is there some sub-text here?
Not to pick on you, you may be thinking of taking this to something like - "A lot of hunters buy larger calibers thinking that will make up for their lack of training or skill;" or "newbs buy magnums and then attempt long-distance shots that are way beyond their personal capabilities."
I could see your level of agitation if those are the folks you have in mind.
I used to live in Maine, and had a great deal of antipathy toward out-of-state hunters, who paid big money to go on their annual hunt, and then shot at the first flash of brown and white they'd see. Cows, often as not. Dogs, sometimes. In one case, a woman who was unaware enough to wear a suede jacket and white mittens while hiking a trail, during deer season...
This made me very jaundiced toward out-of-state hunters, for quite some time, although most couldn't have been so idiotic or else we'd have had a lot more damage. In fact, most must have been at least mostly ethical. But they all got smeared with the "careless and clueless" brush.
So I have to wonder if this .375 issue has some underlying history for you.
sc928porsche
New member
I am of the opinion that there is no such thing as overkill unless you are hunting with a 105mm cannon. Short of that, have at it. Of course if the 105 is all you have, just let me know before you light it off so I can get a reasonable distance from the muzzle and put on my ear protection.
My deer rifle is a 300WM and my bear rifle is a 378WBY.
My deer rifle is a 300WM and my bear rifle is a 378WBY.
Overkill it exists, at least sometimes
If you just want to kill something, EG a defensive weapon vs a bear, then there is no such thing as overkill - unless the possibility of collateral damage exists, EG 105mm...
But, if you want to keep the edible parts edible, then there definitely is such a thing as overkill. Too big and fast a bullet (although too fast seems to cause more damage than too big) can result in a lot of bloodshot, wasted meat.
A bear-load .375 will very likely make a mess of a deer. A loaded down .375 very likely would not.
But a hunter could have a mix of ammo if hunting deer, in an area where bear are a real concern, using a .375. (Then again, with smaller bears, the same could be said of .30-06).
If you just want to kill something, EG a defensive weapon vs a bear, then there is no such thing as overkill - unless the possibility of collateral damage exists, EG 105mm...
But, if you want to keep the edible parts edible, then there definitely is such a thing as overkill. Too big and fast a bullet (although too fast seems to cause more damage than too big) can result in a lot of bloodshot, wasted meat.
A bear-load .375 will very likely make a mess of a deer. A loaded down .375 very likely would not.
But a hunter could have a mix of ammo if hunting deer, in an area where bear are a real concern, using a .375. (Then again, with smaller bears, the same could be said of .30-06).
This thread has been hyjacked so I figure I would join in.
A good friend of mine, named Butler Saved and Bought a CZ Safari Mauser, in .375 H&H. I asked him if he was planning a Safari?, he said no, then I said, I bet that thing kicks.
My friend said, he didnt know he had never shot it, but it sure looks adventurous sitting in his gun cabnet.
A good friend of mine, named Butler Saved and Bought a CZ Safari Mauser, in .375 H&H. I asked him if he was planning a Safari?, he said no, then I said, I bet that thing kicks.
My friend said, he didnt know he had never shot it, but it sure looks adventurous sitting in his gun cabnet.
A 2700 fps .375 bullet,constructed to do 375H+H work,does not tear up a lot of meat.It is just dependable.
It would not surprize me that I would have more edible meat from a deer or pronghorn struck with a .375 than I would from a .270.
I know what happened to the first Pronghorn I shot with a 7mm Rem M
Extreme velocity destroys meat.
If I could own only one off the shelf rifle,a M-70 Safari in .375H+H would be a fine choice.
I am not even interested in owning a .243.I prefer the .257 R.
It would not surprize me that I would have more edible meat from a deer or pronghorn struck with a .375 than I would from a .270.
I know what happened to the first Pronghorn I shot with a 7mm Rem M
Extreme velocity destroys meat.
If I could own only one off the shelf rifle,a M-70 Safari in .375H+H would be a fine choice.
I am not even interested in owning a .243.I prefer the .257 R.
LanceOregon
Moderator
270:
OK, then let's see you post a photo of your current 375 H&H that you claim that you currently own.
Getting back to the original subject of FN Winchesters:
You did not explain where you read that the FN Winchesters are having so many problems. These rifles have barely been on the market 2 years now, and I've not seen any such reports like you describe anywhere.
Yet, you claim that someone, somewhere has had multiple issues with multiple rifles? And yet you provide no details at all regarding what the problems are?
That does not sound at all convincing or credible to me.
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LanceOregon said:
Okay, then let's see you post photos of your current .30/06, .270 Win, and .243 Win that you claim that you currently own.
And if you don't:
LanceOregon said:
I honestly don't know why you're being so intolerant of another person's desire (sincere or not) to buy a Winchester M70 in .375 H&H, wether they already own one or not....
You're not being very friendly or helpful here.
MLeake said:
Actually, a .375 H&H round tailored for bears would likely cause less damage.
When you think about it, dangerous game loads are (more often than not) designed for deep penetration and a little expansion in tough flesh/bone vs. other hunting rounds which lean more towards rapid expansion in comparison. The heavier, tougher-constructed bullets used for dangerous game wouldn't expand nearly as much as a "regular" or loaded-down hunting round in a .375 H&H. They'd punch a bigger hole, but the exit wound on a deer from a bear-load .375 H&H would probably be much smaller than that of a ballistic tip or soft point bullet fired from a .270 Win.
There's just not enough resistance from the skin/muscle/fat/bone of a deer to cause expansion from a tough, dangerous game bullet.
No picture, since I'd be doing it for a guy who seems to doubt what I say.
My current 375 H&H is a Browning A-Bolt. Light for this chambering--about a pound--but has a long 26" barrel which helps counter it's light weight. Limbsaver recoil pad also helps. Shot it from the hip once. Believe it was harder to hang onto than a 12 gauge double I did the same with. Both barrels at once, in this case.
As I say, I enjoy owning quality guns and just plain and simple PLAY WITH THEM.
Example: Not long ago I lined-up a bunch of gallon milk jugs filled with water and shot through 15--over 7ft--of them. Now going for 20. 300 gr Hornady FMJ bullet. Typical soft point center fire rifle will go through 4-5 of these jugs. My 243 with this light 55 grain bullet went through 1 with a few bullet fragments in the second. Very explosive whether water of varmint.
Example II: Take a head of cabbage and put a 55 gr bullet through it which is traveling about 3800 fps. Instant salad! Lots of mist and no big chunks whatever. My Browning 1886 SRC with 300 gr hp bullet did a great job on cabbage as well. Both would be terrible to be hit with.
To make it even more fun I used my camcorder and recorded the above and much more. Great to have this gun fun permanently on record for viewing from time to time.
One reason for being interested in the Winchester 375 is to compare it--side-by-side with my Browning. Then, sell one of'em.
Lighten-up Lance and have more fun. Believe me now? Doesn't matter.
270
My current 375 H&H is a Browning A-Bolt. Light for this chambering--about a pound--but has a long 26" barrel which helps counter it's light weight. Limbsaver recoil pad also helps. Shot it from the hip once. Believe it was harder to hang onto than a 12 gauge double I did the same with. Both barrels at once, in this case.
As I say, I enjoy owning quality guns and just plain and simple PLAY WITH THEM.
Example: Not long ago I lined-up a bunch of gallon milk jugs filled with water and shot through 15--over 7ft--of them. Now going for 20. 300 gr Hornady FMJ bullet. Typical soft point center fire rifle will go through 4-5 of these jugs. My 243 with this light 55 grain bullet went through 1 with a few bullet fragments in the second. Very explosive whether water of varmint.
Example II: Take a head of cabbage and put a 55 gr bullet through it which is traveling about 3800 fps. Instant salad! Lots of mist and no big chunks whatever. My Browning 1886 SRC with 300 gr hp bullet did a great job on cabbage as well. Both would be terrible to be hit with.
To make it even more fun I used my camcorder and recorded the above and much more. Great to have this gun fun permanently on record for viewing from time to time.
One reason for being interested in the Winchester 375 is to compare it--side-by-side with my Browning. Then, sell one of'em.
Lighten-up Lance and have more fun. Believe me now? Doesn't matter.
270
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jgcoastie...
.... you have a point. I was thinking of the bear load more in terms of higher pressure and velocity, and less in terms of bullet weight and construction.
From reading different articles on ballistics, though, I agree with HiBC - velocity causes more loss of meat due to hydrostatic action and bloodshotting.
So I was thinking of a .375 deer load less in terms of a softer bullet, and more in terms of slowing it down significantly.
I read one article where they showed a comparison between bloodshot meat using a high velocity .270 vs a .45-70; the .45-70 made a larger permanent wound channel, but ruined a lot less meat.
.... you have a point. I was thinking of the bear load more in terms of higher pressure and velocity, and less in terms of bullet weight and construction.
From reading different articles on ballistics, though, I agree with HiBC - velocity causes more loss of meat due to hydrostatic action and bloodshotting.
So I was thinking of a .375 deer load less in terms of a softer bullet, and more in terms of slowing it down significantly.
I read one article where they showed a comparison between bloodshot meat using a high velocity .270 vs a .45-70; the .45-70 made a larger permanent wound channel, but ruined a lot less meat.