Florida attempts to pass open carry.........

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Well, thanks to all of those who loaded the email boxes of the committee chairperson who was apparently attempting to stall SB 234, and the Senate President, Mr. Haridopolos, The bill has finally been scheduled to be heard, tomorrow.

This is the second of three committees, the bill must pass to catch up with it's House counterpart, HB 517.

If these both pass their respective committees and receive a favorable floor vote, one will be forwarded to the Governor who has promised to sign it into law. They are currently worded so that, they go into effect immediately, upon becoming a law.

I'm unsure how often approved bills are submited the the Governor's office, but we are getting closer...:D
 
I'm hoping this bill would pass. Not that I would open carry often, but it would make it less of a pain if your firearm shows for some reason.

Today after jogging in the am in a public trail, I needed to change my shirt and had to make sure no one saw my XD in my belly band holster. OC will change all that...
 
I believe that if one has the desire to open carry, he should indeed have a CCW permit, especially in Florida where there are too many cowboys in the city. I have lived in Florida for nearly 50 years so I speak from experience.

I am not a fan of open carry and would not do so even if approved by law. I believe it is not to one's tactical advantage...just my opinion, but this topic has been discussed many times in previous postings so I will stop right here.
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45Gunner said it all for me. I think if it ever does pass, which I doubt it ever will, it will cause us more trouble than it will be worth. Concealed is a tactical advantage AFAIC and OC will give the antis more fuel for their fire. YMMV.
 
I hope it passes just to cover all of us who CCW and on occasion have printed or inadvertently exposed our weapon due to movement. If and when it passes doesn't mean WE have to OC. Nice to have the option
 
Purely as a legal question, the bearing of arms is a fundamental right.

Various schemes that implement (or not) concealed carry have a long line of judicial approval. What is not approved is a total ban on carry.

What I believe we will be seeing, in the next 5 to 10 years, is that regulations for concealed carry will come under increasingly close scrutiny by the courts, but mainly for those States that don't allow for some form of nearly unregulated open carry.

Florida appears to be taking the middle road, here. They want to regulate all carry, but in a "reasonable" manner. How the Courts will see that is still open for debate.

I know that in States like Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Idaho, Montana, Nevada and Wyoming, where open carry is almost unregulated and and regulations for concealed carry are liberal by most other standards, there will be no real court challenges (let's leave out the so-called constitutional carry aspect for this discussion, please) based solely upon CC regulations.

It is all the other States that don't permit carry at all, or CC is the only method (and that is highly regulated) of carry, that we are seeing litigation.

Right now, the path that Florida is taking is perhaps the safest approach to head off litigation, for the near term.

The discussion should not be upon any merits of open carry v. concealed carry. The discussion should center upon how much regulation of a fundamental right is the State allowed.
 
Just wanted to point out that today SB 234 passed through its last committee. The respective floors of each house are the next stop for 234 and 517. Cross your fingers!
 
Too bad this won't do me any good! I refuse to shell out cash I do not have to pay for the right to exercise my right.

I just tote a Buck 110 and will have to get up close and bloody if I have to defend myself.

Brent
 
Yeah...LEGALLY...it covers you during a wardrobe malfunction. Doesn't cover you from getting your head slammed and cuffed then let go for having a permit.
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The "inadvertent display" wording was withdrawn from the Senate bill. It has been reverted back to OC with a permit.

I think, initially at least, a lot of folks will be exercising their right to open carry. After the first several hundred, in your scenario, I think the cops will figure it out. Maybe, their respective department heads will even warn them to expect to see alot of guns, at least in the beginning.
Heck! A few of the LEOs that frquent our store, even welcome it, as they feel it will be another deterrent to the average criminal's thought process.
 
Actually, I know where Constantine is coming from.

GoOfY-FoOt, the area you are from has a much more positive attitude towards and a greater understanding of guns. I am from around the same area as Constantine and here, police and people in general are militantly anti-gun. This greater area is home to the new Chairman of the DNC, just to give some perspective.

I know the inadvertent display language was quashed and the bills provides for full open carry, but I have no doubt that local law enforcement will do everything they can to discourage anyone from exercising their rights, including stop and frisks, temporary detainment, etc.

That being said, I'm damn excited about the passage of this bill. Hopefully it happens.
 
Sounds like the bill needs to be nixed and tried again next year with fewer restrictions.
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I don't know how things work in FL, but in TX, we've had decent luck relaxing restrictions on laws passed in earlier legislative sessions.

The anti's tend to fight these bills with predictions of doom, gloom and mayhem. A couple of years later when nothing bad has resulted from the initial passage of the law, it's hard for them to oppose lightening some of the restrictions.
 
I know where you are coming from, CBRgator and Constantine...
I have been to your neck of the concrete jungle. I believe that as ambassadors of our beliefs, it is all about how we carry that will separate us from the wanna-be's and thugs.

I plan to dress accordingly, carry myself in an appropriate manner, maintain my typical chivalrous and respectful nature, and continue to obey the law, as I always do.

The only difference will be, that my gun will be on the outside and not under my shirt.


I don't know how many gang-bangers and drug dealers have CWP's, but my guess is, not too many. And the ones that do, who apparently haven't been caught yet, probably are packing anyway. So if they do decide to OC, it just gives you a heads-up, so that you can be extra cautious.
Besides, I doubt they train as much as we do, so we have the advantage either way.

Just don't get caught in a prone position, and they won't be able to get a bead on you, anyway...(sideways gun??!!)
 
First off printing and accidental exposure is already covered in the CCW statutes and is not illegal in florida. OC does nothing in this dept.

I would prefer OC with or without permit but IMO any legislation advancing 2nd amendment rights I am all for.

I OC in the woods now and you would be surprised how many LEO's dont know its legal to OC while camping,fishing,hunting or target practicing with or without a license.
 
The anti's tend to fight these bills with predictions of doom, gloom and mayhem. A couple of years later when nothing bad has resulted from the initial passage of the law, it's hard for them to oppose lightening some of the restrictions.
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Absolutely correct and could have not said it any better meself. We went though this when the Stand Your Ground Law was being looked at. All they kept saying was that Florida was going to be the next WILD, WILD WEST. They tried to scare all the folks abroad as to hurt the tourist trade to try and stop the bill. DIDN'T WORK and as far as I know FLA did NOT turn into the WILD, WILD WEST.

First off printing and accidental exposure is already covered in the CCW statutes and is not illegal in florida. OC does nothing in this dept.
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From what I have read from Jon H. Gutmacher, Esq. book there is NO case law pertaining to momentarily unconcealed so as he put it "its test case time".
He also stated that the statutes are very vague in this area.
 
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Add WA to that list of freer open carry states. I open carried for quite awhile before I finally broke down and got a concealed permit. Only restriction is must be unloaded in a vehicle with no permit.
 
cbrgator said:
I have no doubt that local law enforcement will do everything they can to discourage anyone from exercising their rights, including stop and frisks, temporary detainment, etc.
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There won't be many of those. After a few result in lawsuits and awards of $$$ against the cops and their jurisdictions for violation of civil rights under color of law -- they'll figure it out. Their departmental tile crawlers will provide remedial training in the court decisions for Terry and Hiibel, and they'll get the message that engaging in statutorily legal activities does not constitute and CANNOT be used as "reasonable suspicion based on clearly articulable facts" that a crime is being committed.
 
There won't be many of those. After a few result in lawsuits and awards of $$$ against the cops and their jurisdictions for violation of civil rights under color of law -- they'll figure it out. Their departmental tile crawlers will provide remedial training in the court decisions for Terry and Hiibel, and they'll get the message that engaging in statutorily legal activities does not constitute and CANNOT be used as "reasonable suspicion based on clearly articulable facts" that a crime is being committed.
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Aguila, I truly hope you are right, though I am skeptical.
 
Aguila, I truly hope you are right, though I am skeptical.
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I think he's absolutely right. But it's not gonna be easy and it's not gonna happen overnight. We have to think long term and stay in the fight.

Regards,
 
What Sheriff's and police chiefs threaten, and predict is quite different than what MOST street cops will do. I'm sure there will be a few blow-tops who will be freaked out by someone carrying openly in public... but for the great majority it will be a ho-hum subject.

Again if there are incidents where a police officer or deputy draws down on a citizen wearing a firearm in a holster, and posing no threat. That citizen should make a complaint about the officers behaviour. Then make a complaint about the police chiefs, and Sheriffs who suggested this behaviour.

This is Florida, Anyone who wants to be armed is armed. If not CCWing then having one in their automobile. We have the castle doctrine, we have a stand your ground law.... But were also a polite society.


Glenn!
 
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