Flat tire scenario

[Johannes_Paulsen]

It's really very sad the first thing people think of in this situation is how to defend ourselves. Didn't used to be that way. Personally I can't stand to see someone on the side of the road trying to fix their car alone.

Didn't used to be that way? No, thus it always has been, and thus it ever shall be!

Why have a weapon in the first place if you're not, on some level, concerned for your safety?

Until the date that Human nature changes, the responsibility of personal security will, and should, always be an important concern.

 

[easyG]

If someone throws a punch at me, or pushes me in anger or something, he doesn't deserve to have a loaded gun leveled at his chest or killed. He would have to have a weapon and obviously about to use it on me in order for me to be threatened enough to pull my gun on him.

I disagree.

Here's something to consider...

There is no such thing as a fair fight and there never was!
Unless the guy is pissing drunk he is not going to attack anyone who he thinks might kick his butt.
In other words...men assault those whom they are confident that they can beat.

And the only reason they might think that they can beat their opponent is if they have an advantage over that opponent...it might be strength, surprise, fighting skill, size or weight, an unseen weapon, or maybe even some friends nearby.
Keeping this in mind, only a fool will go toe-to-toe with someone who is physically aggressive toward them.


I'm just an average 40 year old guy.
And while I'm not in poor physical condition by any means, I'm not an UFC fighter either.
Why should I be expected to risk being beaten to death by someone bigger and stronger and faster than myself just because that person is unarmed?


I'm a radiologic technologist in a hospital and I image folks everyday who have been beaten.
And I can tell you with 100% certainty that an unarmed man is not to be taken lightly.

I've seen guys who were just kicked and punched, no weapons involved, who have suffered various injuries such as:
crushed facial bones, broken jaw, smashed teeth, broken ribs, collapsed lungs, ruptured testicles, ruptured bladders, ruptured eyeballs, hearing loss, crushed trachea, kidney damage, broken legs, broken arms, fractured skull, brain damage, spinal fractures, and nerve damage.

And they rack up enormous medical expenses often sending them in a downward spiral of debt that they will probably never get out of.
And many will require continuing physical therapy for the rest of their life.
And some no doubt will lose their job and the ability to support their family because of the damages they received.

If you want to risk that kind of damage simply because the other guy is unarmed then that's certainly your right.
But don't think less of those who are not willing to be someone else's punching bag.

 

[mattro]

If someone:
1. has the physical ability to harm me (not too weak or drunk or etc), and
2. they show me that they plan a physical fight with me that I cannot avoid

Then they are getting a gun pulled on them. Probably not shoot immediately, but it will be pulled. I don't have to subject myself to a beating, Noone has the right to inflict that on an innocent person.

I can see some punk getting a lucky punch and knocking me out cold, leaving my wife and/or kids to the mercy of the punk. For what??? So I can be show mercy to some puke that starting something against me and my family.

A verbal argument - No, of course you should not pull a gun. If you do, you should go to jail and loose your ccw license. But an unavoidable physical confrontation I did not solicit - I'm Pulling!

 

[eltorrente]

I disagree.

Here's something to consider...

There is no such thing as a fair fight and there never was!
Unless the guy is pissing drunk he is not going to attack anyone who he thinks might kick his butt.
In other words...men assault those whom they are confident that they can beat.

And the only reason they might think that they can beat their opponent is if they have an advantage over that opponent...it might be strength, surprise, fighting skill, size or weight, an unseen weapon, or maybe even some friends nearby.
Keeping this in mind, only a fool will go toe-to-toe with someone who is physically aggressive toward them.


I'm just an average 40 year old guy.
And while I'm not in poor physical condition by any means, I'm not an UFC fighter either.
Why should I be expected to risk being beaten to death by someone bigger and stronger and faster than myself just because that person is unarmed?


I'm a radiologic technologist in a hospital and I image folks everyday who have been beaten.
And I can tell you with 100% certainty that an unarmed man is not to be taken lightly.

I've seen guys who were just kicked and punched, no weapons involved, who have suffered various injuries such as:
crushed facial bones, broken jaw, smashed teeth, broken ribs, collapsed lungs, ruptured testicles, ruptured bladders, ruptured eyeballs, hearing loss, crushed trachea, kidney damage, broken legs, broken arms, fractured skull, brain damage, spinal fractures, and nerve damage.

And they rack up enormous medical expenses often sending them in a downward spiral of debt that they will probably never get out of.
And many will require continuing physical therapy for the rest of their life.
And some no doubt will lose their job and the ability to support their family because of the damages they received.

If you want to risk that kind of damage simply because the other guy is unarmed then that's certainly your right.
But don't think less of those who are not willing to be someone else's punching bag.

I totally agree - fists/feet/elbows/knees can be truly dangerous and in fact, as you know, people have been killed by single blows to the head.

Now that being said, I still would hold off as long as possible - after the fists started flying probably. I'd leave if I could, or stand my ground if I couldn't. I'd try to use intimidation or my fists to defend myself first. Now there's all sorts of scenarios that I can think of where this would be a bad choice, like if there's more than one guy or it's obvious he's planning on killing me with his bare hands and looks capable of it. I just can't imagine some guy laying there choking on his own blood, breathing his last breaths, while I'm standing above him with a just a good ole' black eye. I would feel horrible and would rather have a fat lip or maybe just some bruised knuckles instead.

Now obviously the older one gets, the more mismatched the altercation is likely gonna be, so of course it becomes more justified to pull it out. If someone went after my 80year old Grandpa, I'd sure hope he has a gun with him to protect himself.

 

[easyG]

Now that being said, I still would hold off as long as possible - after the fists started flying probably.

But by that time it could already be too late.

My old Drill Sgt had a saying...."You aint even gonna know I have a knife until I stick it in you".

What he meant was this:
Don't show that you have a knife or a sap or some other weapon before you use it, keep it secret until the last second.

So you might hold off in pulling your gun until the fists start flying, but the other guy might have a knife hidden in his hand and stab you on the first strike.
You might never get the chance to pull your pistol.

I just can't imagine some guy laying there choking on his own blood, breathing his last breaths, while I'm standing above him with a just a good ole' black eye.

If a guy indicates that he is going to physically attack you, and you draw your pistol and tell him to stop, the choice is his whether he gets shot or not.
If he makes the decision to continue the attack then he deserves what he gets.

 

[markj]

It's really very sad the first thing people think of in this situation is how to defend ourselves

and he had a tire iron in his hand to remove the lug nuts and was scared of a unarmed guy as most here sound like they would be

Bunch of Nancy boys, turn yer testicles in at the door on yer way out girlymen this thread is just too funny for my old heart to take

Edith I'm coming (Sanford and son for all you youngins)

I belive every one is good at heart, I am starting to think some are not, and they are armed

Why have a weapon in the first place if you're not, on some level, concerned for your safety?

I hunt. Sometimes a cow needs to be put down or a horse. I like to target shoot, also hunt small animals with the .22 handgun.

Guns are not only for killing humans.

 

[easyG]

...and he had a tire iron in his hand to remove the lug nuts and was scared of a unarmed guy as most here sound like they would be

Most attackers appear unarmed....until they are attacking!

Edith I'm coming (Sanford and son for all you youngins)

BTW, Sanford's deceased wife was Elizabeth, not Edith.

Edith was Archie Bunker's wife (for all you youngins).

 

[markj]

BTW, Sanford's deceased wife was Elizabeth, not Edith.

Edith was Archie Bunker's wife (for all you youngins).

watched em both the other day on tvland tv isnt the same these days. Too violent, hmmmmm I wonder if that has anything to do with the way folks think today?

 

[anotherKevin]

"It's only a beating"

I find it somewhat surprising that folks would suggest that getting in a physical fight is less than dangerous enough to respond with deadly force. Why are you so sure that if the other guy has the advantage on you, and beats you, he will actually stop once you are down?

In the course of history I've met a few dangerous, brawler types. One of them beat a guy, and put him down. Unbeknownst to him, the other fella got up and walloped him with some object and he nearly died at the hospital. After that he vowed he would never leave the other guy just down. He would continue until he couldn't get up again.