FL: Second child shocked by Taser stun gun within weeks

No doubt, but as noted, unlikely a 6 year old has that ability. And anyway, presumably a adult, with defensive training can disarm a little kid. Or at least I'd hope the standard of training was such...
Or at least some knowledge as how to talk someone down-that's usually preferable or at least suitable until more help arrives.. One of the things I've notice in my forays into the PS, is because of ZT (and Columbine Paducah), they've become very proactive or even a bit overreactive. This event may have warrented that reaction, but recent incidents with inhalers, boyscout knifes and the like demonstrate that the tendancies are clearly there for overreaction.

The vex is, until somebody develops a really effective 'neutralizer'...most of the current solutions have inherent risks...which are enhanced with badly trained, or badly taught people, or a bad day's happenings.
Tasers, some evidence that nervous system damage or heart stoppages have happened.
Capasin, not good for anyone with a compromised lung. And sometimes ineffective in cold temps.
Mace...some junkies liked it.
PR-24's (don't know if these are still being used-haven't seen one for a while) an extended strike to the wrong area,,,can kill.
Kubatons, and the like...same problem. Although these aren't as popular as they once were. Weird thing, back in the PS, saw teachers carry these, some asked to be shown how to use them. Good, but once again, quite a paradigm shift.
The old caritorid (sp) hold, oopsie strokes and brain damage.
Rubber 'stun' bullets,,,sometimes lethal.
Foam, some concerns about airway blockage.
Longswords,Full and halfstaffs, Bills, Maces, Falchions, Tucks, Rapiers...good gods!

And yep...various LE tools and toys like, some restraint holds, and batons...have all caused deadness, also...but usually that involves the drunk, crazed, stupid or NHI contingent so not much of an issue as this ones kicking up to be. Eventually LE, with the tasers, might have to address the PR aspects, as they had to do with the mutts and the batons.
 
faraway,

No doubt, but as noted, unlikely a 6 year old has that ability.
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Why not? The kid was already bleeding like a stuck hog from where he'd slashed his own face and his hand and his leg. Why would he be unable to cut his own neck?

Or at least some knowledge as how to talk someone down-that's usually preferable or at least suitable until more help arrives
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Well, that's what they tried to do. The security guard talked to him, and he slashed his own face and hand. Then the cops showed up and talked to him, and he slashed his own leg, and threatened to slash his own throat. Then they tased him. Personally, I'd've told the little punk to go 'head and slash his own throat, but that's just me. :o
 
Tamara, that's horrible. Absolutely horrible.

Letting kids bleed themselves out on the floor? Who's gonna clean that up? Won't somebody think of the janitors?
 
I am jealous; drinking alcohol and smoking cigars? I can barely afford one of the latter once in awhile. Mind you, I don't smoke the cheap ones.

About the only criticism in the first case is that really the 12 year old should perhaps have been restrained - at least until she was inside the car. Children that have problems, especially alcohol problems, would be high on my list of subjects likely to bolt.

Wonder what psychotrophic drug (or drugs) the 6 year old is on.

Although a 6 year old is certainly capable of harming themselves, I have to wonder how a school principle with the aid of a security officer were unable to "disarm" their captive - or even allowed him to get into a position to harm himself in the first place.
 
I wonder how many folks have really ever stopped to think about it. Use of Force never looks "nice", never looks "good", period. Whether justified beyond belief, it will still never be a "nice" thing to watch.
jmho

TBO
 
Good point about the medical aspect. Long ago, when mucking about in the PS, it wasn't uncommon to have 4-5 kids in a given class on various types of behavior modification drugs. Often wondered if that actually aggravated the problems rather than mitigating them.
 
Cowboy's for hall monitors!!
:D

No, no... Steve Irwin the Crock Hunter as hall monitor. He uses nets and all sorts of things. ;)
 
It happened again...

This time in Detroit. A teenager wouldn't stop playing his video game in class and was sent to the principal's office. The kid still refused to give up the game. The school police officer was called and the kid started to resist. The cop used the taser, and the kid still resisted! The cop hit him with the taser again and this time he stopped. Luckily, this time the kid's mom apologized to the cops. Nice to see the blame applied on the right person.
 
My high school years were spent in europe when teachers were still permitted to maintain control of their classes and students.

Our chemistry teacher was a balding man about 45 years old, with one leg several inches shorter and thinner than the other due to polio so he wore a built up shoe that thumped the floor as he walked. His voice was alittle high pitched, and all in all he was like someone you'd expect to see in an old B movie. He was also a proficient swimmer - and a weightlifter. Although he was all of about 5' 7" his upper body was quite broad. But in his white lab coat and little round glasses his appearance was alittle deceiving.

The first and only lad to disrupt his class had dared to utter a second word to one next to him after Mr. T had asked that talking stop and to pay attention. Mr. T said nothing again, but covered half the room with a rapid clumping gait in a few seconds, hauled big D out by his scruff to one side and seized what appeared to be a two by four about four feet long. It probably was not quite two by four, but it made a resounding crack across D's backside. D went a deep shade of red and was tearing up; and what was one of the tougher lads in the class was obviously making an effort to resist actually cry. Mr. T clumped back to the front table where he left off as if nothing had happened. There was no noise - or trouble - from anyone in that class for the rest of the year. Or the next.

Then there was the history teacher ...
 
Nelson said he noticed the girl was intoxicated and was walking her to his car to take her back to school when she ran away through a parking lot.
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Why would they bring a drunk child to school?

a baton and take down that might leave scrapes and bruises that will heal,
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To knock someone over you have to push them. Whacking them with a baton will not move them, but it can break bones or kill the person. I am no expert, but I would not use a baton vs a suicidal six year old.
 
You mean something like bug bombs, right? Not bad, but bug bombs take too long to work and often cause collateral damage to those standing around and waiting for them to work. It is a little cruel to watch a kid end up on his back, surrounded by cockroaches, arms and legs in the air, twitching, just like the roaches' legs.

Maybe they could use that spray foam glue that they determined to be lethal if it covered the nose and mouth. That stuff would stop a child in his tracks very quickly. Of course then comes the hours of getting the goo off the kid.

Seriously, I can recall an incident from some 20 odd years back about a junior high school kid with a knife, threatening to stab anyone who came too close and threatening to kill himself. The kid ended up getting whacked with a wooden broom pole, swung with some force, breaking his thumb or wrist in the process. Given the options now, the taser sounds much better.
 
I have to wonder how a school principle with the aid of a security officer were unable to "disarm" their captive -
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Teachers and administrators are extremely limited in the amount of physical contact they can have with their students.

They are not trained to subdue armed students at that level.

NEA lawyers usually roll over in the face of a lawsuit for inflicting injury on a child for what ever reason.

There is no "Not Guilty" ruling in DCF investigations of teacher to student child abuse complaints. Theres only "indicated", "not indicated" and "confirmed"

A negative ruling is a career ender and possibly jail time.

Why would they bring a drunk child to school?
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They are under school board control and responsibility.

The schools have resource officers on campus and all the pertinent info on the child

It's pretty much policy in most areas here
 
In all seriousness, I believe that sonic technology or incapacitating laser light is the wave of the future, and less lethal tech will have a giant role in the military in the future.

You all probably know about less lethal sonic tech, but I saw on the history channel police or prison guards use this green, strobing laser that made the perp extremely nauseated (like you can't even move and wish you were dead) and he stopped immediately and started groaning. In contrast, hardened criminals know how to deal with tasers and mace, rendering them useless.
 
Joab,

I am aware of the changes in many school administrations due to political subversion over the last twenty years or so.

But outside of what sometimes is the topic of "how smart kids can be", a six year old lacks both the physical strength and more significantly the reasoning powers of an older child - let alone an adult. In other words, not very hard to overcome by swift physical restraint in combination with alittle guile.

Anyone who is old enough to be a school principle, and had as much experience around children, ought to have been capable of firstly not allowing a 6 year old to get into a position in their office with broken glass in hand by way of vigilance. I am trying to visualize a 6 year having the run of a principle's office, and getting to the point where it not only smashed glass covering a picture, but apparently was able to select a suitable piece of broken glass before getting some serious attention with a view to being restrained.

Even once the child had the glass in hand, I am further surprized that between a school principle and a security officer (who I presume was an adult too) they were not able to disarm a 6 year old child by outsmarting him. Anyone competent and experienced enough to be a school principle out to be at least as smart as that without "special training".
 
I am trying to visualize a 6 year having the run of a principle's office, and getting to the point where it not only smashed glass covering a picture, but apparently was able to select a suitable piece of broken glass before getting some serious attention with a view to being restrained.
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Can't find any argument with that

I can see the events taking place after the child has the weapon. But then I have seen an unstable child throw a full scale temper tantrum.

A friend I knew years ago was a foster parent for troubled kids.

He was a very large man specially trained to deal with their violent outburst and still ahad problems controlling them
 
"Troubled children" when they fall above the age of reason and into the middle to upper age (and size) brackets can be a handful. A six year old - even a "big" six year old - might be a bit much for an elderly person who is on the weak and slow side. But not the average adult.

As an aside; in addition to wondering how many psychotrophic drugs this six year old is on, I wonder where he got the idea of breaking a picture glass, selecting the right piece, and making like he was going to slash his own throat from.
 
I also wonder if the 6 year old knew where an artery is to cut it.
If a 6 year old has the strength to cut deep enough to get to it.

Police are trained to take down adults, but a 6 year old is too much. The baton is designed for such purposes.

It is against taser rules to use it on a someone under 60lbs.
The taser has not been tested on under devloped children so, instead of scrapes and scars that heal, the child could be dead.

The superintendent for the district asked the police chief to stop tasing the children.

I am happy nothing serious happend, but the lack of testing of Tasers on anyone but physically fit adults, especially on children with physical or mental problems could have left the child brain dead or any number of other ailments.

Tasers are marketed as a option instead of lethal force. So if the taser did not work, would the 6 year old been shot?

My point is the LEO did not know what the taser would do to a kid, and either knew it was risky to use on a child or the department failed to train him properly.

The end does not justify the means.

If the glass was right at an artery, how did a taser (that involutarily contracts muscles) not put the child in danger of stabing himself with glass?

Again, if this same situation happened to a teenager, Shock the hell out of him.

btw, if anybody works as a security guard at a school during the day and does not know how to effectivly deal with children in dangerous and problematic circumstances, you need more training or another job.
 
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