Ok so here is the deal. I have been a gun owner since the age of 10, and a hand gun owner since 21. I have CC for 15 years but still havent studied diffrent firearms to be as educated as most people on this forum. So my question is this, Are fixed barrel semi autos that much more accurate than there floating barrel counterparts. I have a G23 and a LC9 both have floating barrels, and I dont even know of any semis with fixed barrels although I read a post on here yesterday about a llama that looked like a fixed barrel. What Fixed barrel semis do you have? Pics are appriciated.
Fixed barrel semi autos?
- Thread starter JRP2
- Start date
H&K P7s are fixed barrel guns. Although they are no longer being made there are still many available on the used market. The p7s are some of the best shooting guns I've ever handled. They are accurate and the delayed gas blowback system reduces the felt recoil making them very easy to shoot.
Most fixed barrel pistols were made for 380 or smaller cartridge. They are mostly blow back opperated handguns. The design is simple, rugged and can be very accurate. (think Walther PPK) Few 9mm or larger handguns used the fixed barrel system because it required a delayed unlock system to be practical in a handgun. This makes for a more complicated design and also adds to the size of the pistol.
Variations of the John Browning design (Colt 1911 and Browning Hi-Power) have proved to be the most succesful designs. The Browning system locks the barrel to the slide. This increases the mass and thus the force needed to make the slide go back. Along with this is some system to drop the breach end of the barrel down. This allows for a smaller profile and ensures easy loading of the next round.
Variations of the John Browning design (Colt 1911 and Browning Hi-Power) have proved to be the most succesful designs. The Browning system locks the barrel to the slide. This increases the mass and thus the force needed to make the slide go back. Along with this is some system to drop the breach end of the barrel down. This allows for a smaller profile and ensures easy loading of the next round.
Fred Garvin
Inactive
I noticed a Sig P230 that has a fixed barrel but the slide moves side to side .015 and with the sights mounted to the slide, do the math. This gun has barely been shot and I also checked the gun stores p232's and they seem to be the same. I believe that HK P7 would be a good choice but an expensive one. A Steyr GB 9mm is a fixed barrel gas operated but it lacking a good reputation. I owned one years ago and it would be lucky to finish a Mag without jamming but all of them couldn't be this way. I would pay more attention to any play with the slide or barrel when the breech is closed.
The Beretta 80 series guns are also fixed barrel pistols all in .380 or smaller. Once Beretta hit 9mm I think they moved away from the fixed barrel designs to minimize felt recoil and excesive wear on the metal.
So you also have the Beretta clones as well like the Browning BDA, LLamas, and perhaps the Stoegers but I am not sure about them.
The Stoeger Couger is odd in that it is smaller like the Cheetahs but the Cheetahs never went to 9mm and stopped at .380.
So you also have the Beretta clones as well like the Browning BDA, LLamas, and perhaps the Stoegers but I am not sure about them.
The Stoeger Couger is odd in that it is smaller like the Cheetahs but the Cheetahs never went to 9mm and stopped at .380.
They can be more accurate, but since the sights are usually mounted on the slide, not the barrel, there can still be some play between the sights and the barrel.
It's hard to quantify how much difference it makes because there are so many other variables. It's probably fair to say that it's easier to design superior accuracy into a fixed barrel gun than into a floating barrel design, but it's certainly possible to achieve excellent accuracy even with a floating barrel design.
Centerfire fixed barrel semi-autos I own or have owned. Beretta 86, Walther PPK, Makarov, Swedish Lahti.
Rimfire fixed barrel semi-autos I own or have owned. Buckmark, Ruger MkII, Ruger 22/45, Walther P22
It's hard to quantify how much difference it makes because there are so many other variables. It's probably fair to say that it's easier to design superior accuracy into a fixed barrel gun than into a floating barrel design, but it's certainly possible to achieve excellent accuracy even with a floating barrel design.
Centerfire fixed barrel semi-autos I own or have owned. Beretta 86, Walther PPK, Makarov, Swedish Lahti.
Rimfire fixed barrel semi-autos I own or have owned. Buckmark, Ruger MkII, Ruger 22/45, Walther P22
chris in va
New member
You didn't specify center or rimfire, so I'll submit the CZ Kadet. Sights *and* barrel are fixed in place. Also the Ruger 22's.
Stonefly_Soldier
New member
The Llama has a locking barrel like the Beretta 92 but its not quite fixed. I do have a Walther sp-22 which is fixed barrel (its hard to tell until you take the shroud off.)
Almost all direct blowback pistols have a fixed barrel.
Anything else with a fixed barrel is something weird and uncommon, like a P7 or Desert Eagle (gas operated).
A fixed barrel theoretically, but not necessarily, has a greater accuracy potential. However, there are so many variables involved it isn't a guarantee. Furthermore, mechanical accuracy is an entirely different thing than practical accuracy.
Anything else with a fixed barrel is something weird and uncommon, like a P7 or Desert Eagle (gas operated).
A fixed barrel theoretically, but not necessarily, has a greater accuracy potential. However, there are so many variables involved it isn't a guarantee. Furthermore, mechanical accuracy is an entirely different thing than practical accuracy.
Well made pistols, those with tight and consistent barrel to slide lock-up, are just as accurate as fixed barrel pistols. Most of the pistols known for accuracy have some form modified Browning action. All that matters is how the barrel to sight alignment occurs. The most accurate pistol would, by design, be one that has the sights attached to the barrel.
insolentshrew
New member
sig mosquito is fixed barrel as well, I believe.
Billy Shears
New member
The CZ83 and the Beretta 85 are my all-time favorites in this category.
In the early days of autoloading pistols, designers first worked with blowback pistols, which usually had (and have) fixed barrels. But when they tried to increase the power to the 9mm Parabellum or .45 ACP level, they found that since in a blowback only the mass of the slide keeps the gun from opening before pressure drops,* the slide had to be made very heavy to keep from having cartridges blow open and spray brass and powder around.
So they worked on locked breech pistols in which the barrel and slide would be locked together until the pressure dropped, after which some mechanism would open the gun. Those guns were operated by recoil, not pressure, and are usually called "recoil operated" pistols. That is still, after a century or so, the most feasible method of designing an auto loading pistol. There are other ways, like a massive slide (Hi-Point) some form of retarded blowback, piston systems, even gas operating rod systems, but all increase compexity, weight, and cost without providing any benefit except theoretically better accuracy.
*The spring does not keep the slide closed as it cannot react fast enough to do so; it does slow the slide down.
Jim
So they worked on locked breech pistols in which the barrel and slide would be locked together until the pressure dropped, after which some mechanism would open the gun. Those guns were operated by recoil, not pressure, and are usually called "recoil operated" pistols. That is still, after a century or so, the most feasible method of designing an auto loading pistol. There are other ways, like a massive slide (Hi-Point) some form of retarded blowback, piston systems, even gas operating rod systems, but all increase compexity, weight, and cost without providing any benefit except theoretically better accuracy.
*The spring does not keep the slide closed as it cannot react fast enough to do so; it does slow the slide down.
Jim
Misssissippi Dave
New member
I'll leave out all the fixed barrel .22 pistols.
Browning FN 1922 and Beretta Tomcat.
Browning FN 1922 and Beretta Tomcat.