I didn't know that the targets got bigger as you went farther out, I was always imagining trying to hit the ame 16" targets that I always use at 600yards, that's why I was so overwhelmed, at 200 yards I am still grouping under four inches and dancing around the 1"bull, I hear where your coing from about staying small until the day you don't have to, make t so the target still looks as big as the first time I saw it two days ago
first attempt at long-range shooting
- Thread starter skizzums
- Start date
Full disclosure...I am the person who invited skizzums to the 600yd shoot.
Here's some additional info.
The 600yd shoot that skizzums will attend is not really a "match." It will be a group of 6 Riverbend members, and a couple of guests, shooting on the Riverbend 600 yard range. Skizzums has posted a picture of the range in the thread above. The 600yd range is used for NRA sanctioned High Power competitions. It has a target pit setup, where the targets can be moved up and down for scoring. The target pit will be manned during the shoot. Everyone, including skizzums, will pull pit duty. We try to replicate NRA scoring procedures, using target markers. We will have walkie talkie communication between the firing line and the pit. We will have a couple of benches to shoot off of, primarily for sighting in scopes, and initial exposure to shooting at 600 yards.
We will split the shooters into 2 groups...one group on the firing line, and one group in the target pit. After 30 to 45 minutes of shooting, we swap.
In the first cycle, everyone will get the opportunity to dial in their scopes. After each shot, the target is lowered for scoring. Skizzums will learn the thrill of "hitting the paper," and the agony of a virgin target. Once you hit the paper, dialing the scope is routine. However, you have to remember that 1 MOA at 600 yards is 6 inches. I will make sure that skizzums has enough time to dial in his scope.
In the second and third cycles, we will shoot slow fire, with the pit scoring each shot. Each shooter decides whether to shoot standing, sitting/kneeling, prone, or from the bench. After the third cycle, we will have one rapid fire...10 shots in 1 minute with one magazine/clip change. Participation in rapid fire is optional. The last 600yd shoot we had, we never got to the rapid fire. No big deal, we will have many more 600yd shoots in the future.
It is hard to describe the excitement of shooting an "x-ring" on the 600yd range. I look forward to skizzum shooting on the 600yd range. I am sure he will describe his experience on a future TFL thread.
FtrPilot
Here's some additional info.
The 600yd shoot that skizzums will attend is not really a "match." It will be a group of 6 Riverbend members, and a couple of guests, shooting on the Riverbend 600 yard range. Skizzums has posted a picture of the range in the thread above. The 600yd range is used for NRA sanctioned High Power competitions. It has a target pit setup, where the targets can be moved up and down for scoring. The target pit will be manned during the shoot. Everyone, including skizzums, will pull pit duty. We try to replicate NRA scoring procedures, using target markers. We will have walkie talkie communication between the firing line and the pit. We will have a couple of benches to shoot off of, primarily for sighting in scopes, and initial exposure to shooting at 600 yards.
We will split the shooters into 2 groups...one group on the firing line, and one group in the target pit. After 30 to 45 minutes of shooting, we swap.
In the first cycle, everyone will get the opportunity to dial in their scopes. After each shot, the target is lowered for scoring. Skizzums will learn the thrill of "hitting the paper," and the agony of a virgin target. Once you hit the paper, dialing the scope is routine. However, you have to remember that 1 MOA at 600 yards is 6 inches. I will make sure that skizzums has enough time to dial in his scope.
In the second and third cycles, we will shoot slow fire, with the pit scoring each shot. Each shooter decides whether to shoot standing, sitting/kneeling, prone, or from the bench. After the third cycle, we will have one rapid fire...10 shots in 1 minute with one magazine/clip change. Participation in rapid fire is optional. The last 600yd shoot we had, we never got to the rapid fire. No big deal, we will have many more 600yd shoots in the future.
It is hard to describe the excitement of shooting an "x-ring" on the 600yd range. I look forward to skizzum shooting on the 600yd range. I am sure he will describe his experience on a future TFL thread.
FtrPilot
jwrowland77
New member
Skizzum, man, you got to do it. Especially since it's a laid back event for the most part.
4runnerman
New member
Skizzum- Don't sweat it. 600 is not that far. Oce you dial in it's all downhill from there. Watch the wind flags and as I mentioned before- You are compeating against yourself. Pay no attention to any one else except the line boss of course.
Find your groove and go with it. Keep us posted. Let us also know when that new target rifle is going to be coming ha ha. Your hooked.
Find your groove and go with it. Keep us posted. Let us also know when that new target rifle is going to be coming ha ha. Your hooked.
jwrowland77
New member
That's what happened to me. LOL. Only took one match. LOL.
Like 4runner said, once you're dialed in, you're good to go. After that, it's just a matter of holding left or right a tad of center depending on the wind.
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
If skizzums don't want to go, I will.
(Except you guys are too darn far away.
)
(Except you guys are too darn far away.
)Unlicensed Dremel
Moderator
I enjoyed your story and good shooting; thanks.
4runnerman
New member
oryx-- At my age,I can't see 600 yards
I shoot my M1 Garand at 600 yards.
Dial the rear sight to 6 and start shooting.
First time I shot the Garand at 600 yards, all 8 hit the paper and 4 were in the black...using an NRA slow fire target. Also using 40 year old Greek ammo.
Iron sights or scopes...shooting at 600 yards is a blast.
Dial the rear sight to 6 and start shooting.
First time I shot the Garand at 600 yards, all 8 hit the paper and 4 were in the black...using an NRA slow fire target. Also using 40 year old Greek ammo.
Iron sights or scopes...shooting at 600 yards is a blast.
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
I appreciate the offer. I'd love to take you up on it. There's no such thing as a 600 yard range in NY, at least none I've ever heard of. Few get beyond 100 and those that do are almost always 300.
In NRA HP the black on the 200 yard target is 13 inches in diameter. The black on the 600 yard target is 24 inches.
They look the same size over the front sight. If you can see the target at 200 you can see it at 600. The same for the Long Range target (1000 yards) the black bull is bigger so it looks nearly the same as the 200 yard target.
As too mid and long range shooting with the AR (600-1000) you're best option is going with heavier bullets, in the 80-90 gr class. These bullets require you to load them longer so they wont fit the mag, but in HP Mid/Long Range shooting you single load anyway.
I shoot irons on my AR, at 1000 I use my 600 yard zero and twist the front sight down 4 full revolutions.
80-90s will get you there, its judging wind that will determine how well.
The twist issue mentioned is worth looking at.
The heavier match bullets would be better suited to your 1 in 7 twist.Not saying thelight ones won't shoot,but at longer ranges the heavier ones hold velocity and buck wind better.
Someone recommended a 75 gr Hornady A-Max.I have to question that for an AR if you want to mag feed them.If loaded to 2,260 length to magazine fees,the ogive will actually be down in the case mouth.Hornady does not recommend the A-Max for AR's.
The 77 gr Matchking and Nosler Custom Comp are good.Try RE-15 or one of the 4895's
Hornady does make a nice 75 gr HPBT Match bullet that will work very well.It hasone of the best BC's for a mag length load.Look in Hornady's book under AR-15 loads and try RE-15.4895 is another suitable powder.
With 69 gr match bullets,I had very good luck with Varget,both with Sierras and Noslers.
For an expanding varmint bullet,try the 60 or 62? gr(I forget) Nosler Varmint Ballistic tip with Benchmark.(Benchmark is like Varget,but a step quicker)
I don't recommend charge weights,get them from your manuals.
You are off to a good start.These heavier bullets will work better at longer ranges.Have fun!
The heavier match bullets would be better suited to your 1 in 7 twist.Not saying thelight ones won't shoot,but at longer ranges the heavier ones hold velocity and buck wind better.
Someone recommended a 75 gr Hornady A-Max.I have to question that for an AR if you want to mag feed them.If loaded to 2,260 length to magazine fees,the ogive will actually be down in the case mouth.Hornady does not recommend the A-Max for AR's.
The 77 gr Matchking and Nosler Custom Comp are good.Try RE-15 or one of the 4895's
Hornady does make a nice 75 gr HPBT Match bullet that will work very well.It hasone of the best BC's for a mag length load.Look in Hornady's book under AR-15 loads and try RE-15.4895 is another suitable powder.
With 69 gr match bullets,I had very good luck with Varget,both with Sierras and Noslers.
For an expanding varmint bullet,try the 60 or 62? gr(I forget) Nosler Varmint Ballistic tip with Benchmark.(Benchmark is like Varget,but a step quicker)
I don't recommend charge weights,get them from your manuals.
You are off to a good start.These heavier bullets will work better at longer ranges.Have fun!
thanks everyone, very excited about it, sorry if i was being mil-leading about being a competition or a shoot or whatever it is, i wasnt really sure to be honest
i have a 16in 1:7 twist, picked up some 64gr but knowing now that they will not be heavy enough, i will look for the 77gr in time to get some practice time with them before late-april
between now and april 19th, its my sons b-day, wifes b-day, my b-day and anniversary; will be busy till then, but can also make a few hours for practice
i shoot on private property that is good for about 300yards down-hill, after that is starts going uphill and is hard to manually measure distance from hill-hill
anyone now an easy way to measure distance without a range-finder?
anyways, thanks for all the nice comments, i will get back to you guys again end o april, you will see me in the reloading forum looking for heavy-loads for 223 for sure
thanks ftrpilot for the great day at your range and look forward to it next time, you have been more than hospitable to me and really appreciate it
i have a 16in 1:7 twist, picked up some 64gr but knowing now that they will not be heavy enough, i will look for the 77gr in time to get some practice time with them before late-april
between now and april 19th, its my sons b-day, wifes b-day, my b-day and anniversary; will be busy till then, but can also make a few hours for practice
i shoot on private property that is good for about 300yards down-hill, after that is starts going uphill and is hard to manually measure distance from hill-hill
anyone now an easy way to measure distance without a range-finder?
anyways, thanks for all the nice comments, i will get back to you guys again end o april, you will see me in the reloading forum looking for heavy-loads for 223 for sure
thanks ftrpilot for the great day at your range and look forward to it next time, you have been more than hospitable to me and really appreciate it
One point to clarify;;the bullets I mentioned are good for shooting at longer ranges.
However,I have not shot a hog,and I have not shot big game with the 5.56/223.
I cannot tell you the match bullets will perform on game.They may not.In general,they are not recommended.
I might be inclined to try a Barnes TSX 62 gr.As it is solid copper,I suggest you sneak up on your powder charge.You might get higher pressures.
However,I have not shot a hog,and I have not shot big game with the 5.56/223.
I cannot tell you the match bullets will perform on game.They may not.In general,they are not recommended.
I might be inclined to try a Barnes TSX 62 gr.As it is solid copper,I suggest you sneak up on your powder charge.You might get higher pressures.
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
IPhone, and other "smart" phone or any GPS. You can also get a reasonable approximation with Google Maps.
4runnerman
New member
Never have used I Phone ( didnt know you could ) but I do use my GPS all the time. You mentioned you shoot down hill?. Keep in mind your POI is going to change when you shoot level. Just a FYI. If you sight in downhill at 300 and then shoot level at 300 you will need to adjust your scope for zero again.