Engage or evade?

I mean it could be one guy with a knife and I have a 12 gauge...
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That seems a bit unlikely given the OP's stated focus.

According to PCSO, Mexican cartels are sending the "sicarios" -- groups of assassins -- to kill rivals trying to steal their drugs. The armed enforcers are expected to target "rip crews", who ambush other transport gangs to take their drugs and money.​

That said, even in the case of a man with a knife when you're armed with a shotgun, if you can avoid a confrontation, you're better off than sticking around and possibly being forced to shoot him.
 
And if your kids are there? Run and let the guy with the knife do 'em? And if you physically can't run?

Oh, and being in Texas... I don't have to run.

Deaf
 
And if your kids are there? Run and let the guy with the knife do 'em? And if you physically can't run?
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The question was stated with the idea that escape was an option. Clearly circumstances could eliminate that option, but then it wouldn't make sense to ask about or discuss whether to engage or evade.
Oh, and being in Texas... I don't have to run.
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Correct. If you're where you have a right to be in TX, you don't have to retreat if someone attacks you.

That legal fact, however, doesn't automatically make it a good idea to stand up and fight. In general, if you can avoid a gun battle, or avoid shooting someone, it's wise to do so. In the former situation because it can keep you from getting shot, and in both situations because shooting someone is a life-changing event even when it is legally justified.

Having the legal option to stay and fight doesn't have any bearing on whether or not it makes good tactical sense (or good common sense) to do so in a given situation.
 
You evade, establish communications with Regiment, and get arty and air on it.

In your scenario, that means run for the Sheriff and mark up the overlay.
 
When there's no 911, nobody around, and nowhere you can barricade yourself, and you find yourself face to face with an armed assailant (s), what reaction would provide the best chance of survival? Do you run or do you fight?
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I see no such option to be able up run Kemosabe. He states run or fight. Many cannot run, and one may not be able to OUTRUN. Turning your back on a dangerous opponent is not wise, especially if their weapons can reach you.

It all boils down to the exact situation you are faced with. One assailant? Two? More? Better armed? More skillful? Terrain? Etc. Not some simple fight or flight.

And again, in Texas it's not wise to confront someone with a weapon and threaten them.

Deaf
 
I see no such option to be able up run Kemosabe.
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Well, if you read the OP's question ("Do you run or do you fight?") as being: "Do you run when running is not possible or do you fight?", then I guess I can see where you're coming from.
It all boils down to the exact situation you are faced with.
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What it boils down to is whether you can evade or not. If you can evade, doing so is better than an armed confrontation because it eliminates the chances of being shot at. If the circumstances make it impossible, or unreasonable to evade, then you engage and take your chances.
And again, in Texas it's not wise to confront someone with a weapon and threaten them.
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It's not wise to do that anywhere since it's illegal.

And again, the fact that the law doesn't require one to retreat in TX doesn't automatically mean that it's tactically sound to engage.

Just because something is legal doesn't mean it's always a good idea. I got caught in heavy rain yesterday and ended up driving about 50mph lower than the speed limit. It would have been legal for me to drive much faster, but it would have also been stupid given the circumstances.

Similarly, the fact that TX law doesn't require me to retreat wouldn't make it smart for me to get into a gunfight when I could have avoided being shot at.
 
When there's no 911, nobody around, and nowhere you can barricade yourself, and you find yourself face to face with an armed assailant (s), what reaction would provide the best chance of survival? Do you run or do you fight?
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Lots of people survive gunshot wounds. Few do who get shot in the backcountry with no rescue available.

I understand running or evading isn't always an option. If that option isn't available for whatever reason then by all means stand and make a fight of it. However, staying to fight "just because it's legal" isn't wise, even in Texas.
 
This should be no different then the response to an active shooter situation.

1: Flee
2: Hunker down
3: Fight

In that order.

If you can safely get out of the area, that's the best option

If you can't, then hide, I've been in the desert, the jungle, the mountains, and the Arctic. I've never been any place where I couldn't find a place to hunker down.

The third and last option is to fight, if you cant get out of the area, and you are discovered in your hiding place, fight. You have no choice but to cower and wait to die, or fight.

I have combat military training and experience. I have police training and have instructed other police including SWAT.

But I'm not so naïve to believe that in my old age, that I can take on drug cartels.

I certainly cant out run them, (or out run their grandmothers) but I know I can crawl into a brush pile, ditch, or whatever and wait them out.

I'm not a drug dealer, I cant believe they would hunt me down for sport.

I'm pretty sure, that if I can lay in a spot, from before sunrise to well after sunset hunting, then I can do the same if I cross the paths of some druggies. I'm not above laying in hiding, taking a nap even if there is no danger present.

But if cornered then you have no choice but to fight or cower.

I have a tendency to mind my own business now days, I'm not a threat to anyone, therefore I don't see reason to worry about running across bandits in the bush.

Also I will not curtail my late in life activities, if I wanted safety then I'd spend my life on a bar stool at the VFW. Even then I could be in danger of falling off the stool.

Don't let fear control your life. There is no safe place. Life is short, and running out for some of us, I plan on living and enjoying what time I have left.
 
1) If possible, try to plan your daily affairs and traveling to avoid areas, venues, or situations which would expose you & yours to the risk of active shooter(s). Obviously, you're not omniscient, but situational awareness and a healthy dose of common sense will reduce risk.

2) If you are unavoidably caught up in an active-shooter event, evade and escape at the first opportunity.

3) If you're legally armed and can't evade/escape, engage the A.S. in lawful self-defense only if you have no other option and only if you've had the appropriate training to do so.
 
Also I will not curtail my late in life activities, if I wanted safety then I'd spend my life on a bar stool at the VFW. Even then I could be in danger of falling off the stool.
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This is my favorite post in this thread. We can come up with countless scenarios to the point of not leaving the couch, whether young or old. There are many dangers out there! My philosophy is to live my life as fully as I can. I have health issues that will sooner or later kill me. My family and I have come to peace (for the most part) with this. I pay close attention to my body and what is going on around me. I will not avoid the activities that I enjoy because there are some risks involved. Whether confronted by drug carriers on the trail or an angry idiot in the parking lot at Walmart, I will do my very best to avoid trouble or protect myself if that isn't possible. I think that is as good as we can hope for.
 
Drug runners and interdiction squads?

Preferably evade and if not, fighting retreat. I'm no smuggler and figure I'm outgunned and outnumbered.
 
Run or fight?

That depends on how they are armed, how I am armed, if I can run, if they can run, night, day, rain, snow, number of attackers, number of defenders (or innocents), etc..
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In all of the situations I have been involved in running was not an option; I run like a tree. And then straight up; I did not want to be blamed for what was about to happen meaning those that were fleet of foot had to have a chance to get away.

Some how I knew I was going to be blamed and more times than not my mother telling them I was a good kid was not enough.


F. Guffey
 
I'm pretty sure, that if I can lay in a spot, from before sunrise to well after sunset hunting, then I can do the same if I cross the paths of some druggies. I'm not above laying in hiding, taking a nap even if there is no danger present.
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I can see the conversation with my wife

Wife: You were gone a long time

Me: Yeh.. I ran into some guys on the trail - looked like drug cartel guys.

Wife: Oh no. What happened?

Me: I ran and hid

Wife: Were they close?

Me: Not certain. I fell asleep
 
Mind. Your. Business.


I realize it's not quite what the OP is asking but I live in a funky part of town and I run into this scenario ON A MUCH SMALLER SCALE frequently.

I've seen at least 4 deals happen right in front of me this week. I make a point of taking zero interest. I didn't see it, I didn't hear it it's not my business.

There's a guy in the section8, roach motel apartments across the street that's dealing out of his living room window. I see cars coming and going all night. I make a point of not walking down that street. I have a neighbor who was sitting out on the steps the other night observing the transactions, if I was aware of it you can bet your posterior the dealer was too.
 
In almost any combat situation that a civilian will encounter, evasion and avoiding combat is the proper answer. What are the chances that you will lose? if you successfully evade, you will not lose. Evasion can be as simple as just sitting quiet and letting the bad guys not engage you.

In fact, you are on defense. you are a civilian, not a soldier, and you are not duty bound to take down the bad guy. This points up that you are not expected to engage, and your only logical reason to engage is to defend your own life. If you aren't alone, engaging if evasion is possible is an absolute sin. If your family is sitting behind cover, you are also behind cover, and the bad guys haven't discovered either hidden areas, engaging the bad guys places your life in great danger. Two men with rifles are a probably more than a match for a single guy with a pistol. So, you nut up and go after the people who look like really bad guys, then get killed, leaving your family or other dependents not only alone, but under threat from the men that just killed you.

Every combate situation is different, but one fact remains. If a civilian finds himself in a dangerous situation, that very rarely requires that the civilian engage the threat if avoiding danger is possible. If it isn't absolutely necessary to engage the bad guys to save lives, the civilian should not engage. in almost every situation, if the threat of death or serious injury, and I mean grave injury are not immediately present, successul evasion is the only logical answer. At the very least, backing away or moving to cover should help your tactical situation.
 
Two words: Krav Maga

Three words: Are you high?

Did you read the OP? The OP posits you against several well armed men. Let us know how squaring up and throwing roundhouse kicks works for you.
 
Moonglum

I'm not here to crack around, but you're sort of right, sir. But, you're obviously not familiar with Krav techniques. There's a time and a place for everything. Here's your sign.
 
I'd very much like to see the hand to hand technique that allows you to deal with several well armed cartel soldiers. If I can add that to my kit I will be unstoppable.
 
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