Does .44 Mag get any easier?

"I had understood that along with a revised hold on the gun wooden grips would allow that roll in the palm that would dissipate the recoil force in an arc, rather than a shock straight back through my arm.

Is this not the case? " [Pond]

No. The gun does not roll in the palm, it is always held firmly. You take a firm grip close but not quite to the top of the grip, squeeze off your shot (DA or SA) and simultaneously you let the gun carry your hand with it, you do not fight the recoil punch, it can push your hand off a foot or more, you then quickly bring the gun back on target and shoot again, its like waltzing the same steps over and over, you guide the lady properly.

Magnum revolvers come in square butt or round butt configuaration. I think you have a square butt. Generally I prefer a round butt, it means a smaller handle which affords a more complete hold and better flexibility in positioning the revolver within the hand. Works for me, your experience may vary.

Additional comments re grips: See pics

S&W M13-4 3" bull barrel (357 Mag) wears an Uncle Mike's K&L round butt grip and an S&W M29-3 4" barrel (44 Mag) wears a custom cut square butt grip...both work well.

S&W M29-4 3" barrel (44 Mag) with a K-frame Pachmyer Compac grip (covers backstrap) works well. The K-frame Pachmyer Gripper grip I removed for esthetic reasons...just don't like the look. Some grips are butt ugly.

S&W M29-2 6.5" barrel with Magnaport cuts under front sight (44 Mag) with large square butt gorgeous rosewood grips...This was the hardest kicker of the three M29s, despite the Magnaporting. Standard S&W N frame square butt pictured above, but I find them somewhat awkward to deal with. Did not care for either grip.

Start with a glove...this can be a homemade cutaway or professional version. Even professional shooters have been known to use a glove.

Good luck.
 

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Thanks Seaman.

That was a helpful description and a nice collection of pics.

Tomorrow I have an hour at the range put aside.
200LR in my bag and 25 .44 Mag.

Probably won't shoot off all the Mags but I'm going to put some of these suggestions to good use!!

Fingers crossed.
 
I would say yes. When i first got my 44 which is a Ruger SuperBlackhawk. It does have a 7 1/2 inch barrel so it would not kick like a 2 inch one but when i got it,t would cock in my hand and cut the webbing on the hand. Now after shooting it many rounds it seems like a 38 special. I can shoot it all day.
 
A big thank you!!

Well, I went to the range today and spend just over an hour there.

Hole-punching has neer been this fun!

I shot 200 .22LRs
They only had a 25 metre alley so, unsurprisingly, my group was a little "nebulous" Still, I got at about half in the black...:o

I only used a couple of target sheets today, and the second was for the last 50 or so. Practise must have paid off as the group was far more centred on the black, with about 80% of the hits.

Then I brought out the Redhawk.
I shot a baker's dozen and the first few were strong handed, side on.

I put on a glove, held the grip further down the backstrap, gripped it firmly but conciously didn't try to keep a very rigid elbow and wrist: just enough to keep it on target. I shot these SA.

The round went off and the Ruger arched up from the elbow by about 45 degrees!!
But, it was comfortable. Strong, but comfortable!!

RESULT!!:cool:

Then I tried double-handed and that was also fine. A world apart from the time before.

Finally, I shot the last one without a glove and I felt it more, but still OK.

I wouldn't want to shoot it all day, but after 13 shots, I still would have been happy to shoot the same again!!

May still investigate grips, as it is quite big in the hand, but right now I am one happy shooter!!

Thanks again!:D
 
Yes.

When I let the recoil move the gun and my arms, they flexed at the elbow. The gun's position, in relation to my forearm didn't move so much.

I hope that is OK technique because it certainly felt much more comfortable!
 
When I let the recoil move the gun and my arms, they flexed at the elbow. The gun's position, in relation to my forearm didn't move so much.

I hope that is OK technique because it certainly felt much more comfortable!
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That's exactly the right technique and it makes a .44 a completely different animal doesn't it. One would think that letting the muzzle climb so much would adversely affect accuracy but, in my experience, it doesn't seem to do so significantly.
 
muzzle climb so much would adversely affect accuracy but, in my experience, it doesn't seem to do so significantly.
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Me neither.

It still takes me just as long to find the target!! :p

Either way, reloading gear is looking way more appealing now. :D
 
I will try this technique this weekend.
I've got a 4" Colt Anaconda, a 7.5" Freedom Arms .454 Casull, and just the right touch of masochism.
 
Webleymkv said:
That's exactly the right technique and it makes a .44 a completely different animal doesn't it. One would think that letting the muzzle climb so much would adversely affect accuracy but, in my experience, it doesn't seem to do so significantly.
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When you sit down and do the calculations on how much force there is on the gun when the powder burns, it's obvious that no man made of flesh and bone could possibly be strong enough to interfere with the muzzle climb of a .44 magnum. All we can do is arrest the rearward motion once the explosion is over.

28,000 psi in the chamber on the base of a .429 diameter bullet is about 4000 pounds of force and also about 4000 pounds of force pushing backwards on the gun. That's about 2 tons, more than my car weighs. That's peak pressure. The average pressure is lower. If you maintained 4000 pounds of force on the base of the bullet through the entire length of a 6 inch barrel, the pressure would do 2000 ft lb of work on the bullet and give the bullet 2000 ft lb of kinetic energy.

A .44 magnum bullet has around 1000 ft lb of kinetic energy out of a six inch barrel which means the average force on the bullet during acceleration was about 2000 pounds. Still way more than any man could possibly interfere with.

I believe that observed changes of point of impact because of changes in grip are primarily due to gun movement during lock time. When a trigger with a lot of backlash breaks, the force on the trigger goes away and the contribution of trigger pressure to the guns position goes away resulting in gun movement while the hammer falls. Single action cowboy revolvers have big heavy hammers with long travels and there is a small reaction to this hammer movement. A stong manly grip or a weak girly-boy grip can make a measureable difference on how much these two things make a revolver move during the time between trigger break and firing. However, no man can even come close to interfering with the muzzle jump due to the bullet's acceleration.
 
Muzzle jump

I agree with BLE about gun movement during lock time. However, the big muzzle jump happens after the bullet is out of the barrel. The TV show Top Shot on the History channel shows a lot of high speed slow motion shots of bullets being shot out of guns. There is a tiny bit of muzzle movement as the bullet moves down the barrel but the vast majority of muzzle jump happens after the bullet is out of the barrel.

I you don't believe me, go to www.history.com and watch some of the episodes online. It's a real eye opener.
 
I don't doubt that most of the muzzle jump and recoil movement occurs after the bullet leaves the barrel. However, the forces that cause muzzle jump and recoil movement occur during bullet acceleration in the barrel. All the movement after the bullet leaves the barrel is momentum, both the bullet and the gun are coasting on momentum once the bullet clears the barrel.

Once the bullet clears the muzzle, any farther muzzle jump no longer matters.
 
Correction, B.L.E.

B.L.E. said:
I don't doubt that most of the muzzle jump and recoil movement occurs after the bullet leaves the barrel. However, the forces that cause muzzle jump and recoil movement occur during bullet acceleration in the barrel. All the movement after the bullet leaves the barrel is momentum, both the bullet and the gun are coasting on momentum once the bullet clears the barrel.

Once the bullet clears the muzzle, any farther muzzle jump no longer matters.
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Absolutely correct, except the last part needs an addition

"...any farther muzzle jump no longer matters to the bullet. We all know it matters a lot to the shooter at the back end of the gun.

May still investigate grips, as it is quite big in the hand, but right now I am one happy shooter!!
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Glad to hear it. Congratulations on your success in tuning your technique.
Pond said:
When I let the recoil move the gun and my arms, they flexed at the elbow. The gun's position, in relation to my forearm didn't move so much.

I hope that is OK technique because it certainly felt much more comfortable!
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You can do a lot with the "Isometric" stance if you want to maintain control of the gun and minimize muzzle rise. Kind of like when you pull a shotgun stock hard into your shoulder. It sort of "pre-loads" the palm, so it doesn't FEEL as bad. Still, it can be hard on the palm nonetheless.

Making yourself a more flexible platform help the palm(s), but allows a lot more gun movement, usually increasing recover time. It is a trade-off among and between recovery time, felt recoil, the shooting circumstances, your body type/ergonomics and other factors I can't think of right now.

Shooting my friend's 500 S&W using a "Cup and Saucer" target-style grip, I thought I was experiencing a 45 degree muzzle rise and keeping my hands together. Not so. I was completely surprised to see a video of me with the gun fully 90 degrees, straight up, in recoil and my hands separated by nearly a foot! Perception is not all that reliable.

I suggest you have someone record a video of you shooting to get an objective view. Collateral benefit, do this in low light and enjoy the muzzle flash.

Lost Sheep
 
Here's a short video of me shooting my .44 with Remington 240gr JHP so you can get an idea of the technique and the type of muzzle climb to be expected.

 
The 44 magnum is an amazing load. This informative thread has taken me back to my younger years when I was just starting out. I'm 44 years old now.

Back when I was a teenager ,and in my twenties, all I wanted was magnum revolvers (.357, 41 and 44), 45 ACP semi-auto pistols, heavy caliber rifles ,well the heaviest that I could afford, and larger bore shotgun shotguns. I owned a couple 22 rifles and a 38 Special Colt Detective Special, but those "wimpy" guns stayed at home when I went to the range.

But over the years things change. I came to realize that the magnum loads were just more expensive. I didn't get into reloading until later. I also came to realize that plinking (recreational target shooting) with full power magnum loads just wasn't that much fun.

In the last ten years I've discovered the joy of shooting with lighter calibers. The .22 Long rifle, 9mm Luger and the .38 Special have become my favorites. Not only are they more affordable, but they're just more enjoyable to shoot. Even the full powered duty 9mm loads that I carry in my Glocks when I am working (I'm a police officer) are not unpleasant to shoot. I carry the Federal 115 grain +p+ jacketed hollow point in my Glock 26 and the Federal HST 124 grain +p jacketed hollow point in my Glock 19.

Over the past decade I've gradually let most of my heavier caliber handguns go and replaced them. I have held onto my .357 magnum revolvers, but I mostly fire .38 spl loads through them.

At one time I owned a Ruger Model 77 rifle in .375 H&H Magnum. That is a great caliber, but it wasn't cheap (though recoil wasn't bad at all), I don't hunt Grizzly bears in Alaska and I doubt I'll ever go to Africa on safari. I sold that rifle and 132 rounds of Federal .375 H&H magnum cartridges for a nice profit and purchased a Colt revolver, ammo and various other accoutrements. I have since fired that Colt many more times than I fired the Ruger.

I especially like that 38 Spl revolvers. As an American it's easier for me to buy used (second-hand) firearms. 38 Spl revolvers are usually 100 dollars cheaper (give or take 25 dollars) than used .357 magnum revolvers. Also many people feel obligated to fire full-powered loads through their magnum revolvers. 38 Spl revolvers are not usually used as hard (though I have found hard used specimens in the past) and unless the previous owner fired his own hot handloads the 38 Spl load is just easier on a revolver.

There is no lesson here. Just a fellow shooters experience. Oh and I am not saying you don't need a 44 magnum revolver or anything foolish like that.

I agree with those other posters who recommend shooting gloves and Pachmayer grips. Rubber grips might not be very attractive, but they help with recoil control and most of the Pachmayer models cover the backstrap of the grip. Which also helps.

Good to hear from a fellow shooter in Estonia. Very interesting.
 
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I find that the Ruger Blackhawk handles std loads very well. I just installed some hogue rubber grips that give it the feel of a DA redhawk and was impressed at how much more comfortable to shot it became. My 240 grain loads felt like very mild loads.

also, most ammo makers make reduced loads that give 41 magnum performance and feel even lighter in recoil. something to think about
 
So are the guys who keep discussing Blackhawks trying to convince Pond to sell his Redhawk and buy a Blackhawk? How many Blackhawks do you think there are for sale in Estonia, or the entire EU?

Pond, I'm glad this is starting to work out for you. If your intention is to carry the RH for bear defense, take a look at the 300 and 320 grain Cast Performance bullets at Midway Deutschland. These are ideal for bear defense and, with the right powder, the RH can shoot these at 1200 fps all day long without a problem. I've loaded bullets up to 355 grains in my RH 44M

Also, if you want to read about using handguns for defense against large bears, the Alaska Outdoors Forum Handgun forum is a good place.
 
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