Do people really think you must Overnight UPS a gun to an FFL?

I went through all of these mental gymnastics before I sent my revolver back to S&W. I ended up going FEDEx third day. I notified them that I was shipping sporting goods. They returned it UPS overnight. They have more money than I do.
 
The reason UPS/FED Ex want you to ship is to minimize the chances of one of their employees stealing the firearm. There are more controls on overnight packages than general ground delivery. That sticker "TO: Joe's Gun Store" might give them a hint that something interesting is inside the box and they might want to re-route it to their car instead of the next brown truck.
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And, so we, the consumer, have to pay 3X as much shipping cost to keep THEIR employee's from stealing OUR stuff! and you are absolutely correct that is the reason they require it, is to keep their employees from stealing it and having to explain to the BATFE how they lost a firearm.
 
I was told by UPS that when they know a firearm is being shipped, it stays with the driver at all times. Or at least they will keep an eye on it....I don't know if that's BS or not, but that's the reason they gave when I asked why I had to tell them I was shipping a firearm....
 
What kind of "written" notice do people give?

I thought that people simply told the FedEx agent when handing them the package that it contained a gun. What do people do to comply with the "written" requirement?
 
I thought that people simply told the FedEx agent when handing them the package that it contained a gun. What do people do to comply with the "written" requirement?
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You are absolutely correct. And that is because there is no written notification requirement, unless the firearm is being shipped to a non-licensee in another state. In that case - being shipped to a non-licensee in another state - the shipment and the transfer of the firearm to an out of state resident that would occur, in most cases, would be illegal anyway.
 
tjhands You can do whatever you like, I think I'll stick with the INSURED overnight because I would be the one who had something happen in shipping. When laws are open to interpretation you better hope the one interpreting the law reads it the same way you do!
 
There is a good reason for sending it next day air and thats because people steal at these shipping facilities.

There was one time where I ordered 3 GPS systems for a certain company I worked for. The package was stolen and lost at UPS never to be found again.

Yes, you will save $$$ by sending it by ground. However, what if the package is lost or stolen and the weapon ends up in other hands? Do you want to be indirectly responsible for someone else's death if the weapon is used?

Even if the package is unmarked, who knows who is working the x-ray machines.

In the interest of safety, do us a favor and send it by next day air...
 
tjhands You can do whatever you like, I think I'll stick with the INSURED overnight because I would be the one who had something happen in shipping. When laws are open to interpretation you better hope the one interpreting the law reads it the same way you do!
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As I stated in my opening post, I always ship through my FFL agent; he's cheap.
 
"And, so we, the consumer, have to pay 3X as much shipping cost"

It's voluntary, you don't HAVE to. I use local FFLs and they charge a minimal fee to ship because they can use the U.S. Postal Service. It's like $10 or a little more for insurance on an expensive item. The manufacturer has always shipped directly back to me. If there is a transfer fee it's a lot less than fedex.

For guns I bought at the shop, they covered the warranty shipping.

So no, you don't HAVE TO pay 3x as much for shipping unless you want to.

John
 
I'm going to respond to this in the interest of saving somebody a headache, and not to get into any sort of debate. My opinion comes from being a Criminal Justice major, in final year of study now; There is one key word left out here so far and that is "discretion". Enforcing whichever laws/policies/rules is up to interpretation and discretionary powers of the LEO involved, if they do become involved somehow.

There are so many differing situational angles that you can get into legal or monetary trouble by skirting the law(s) that it would make your head spin. The hypotheticals we can get into are intricate, but make for great stories that you don't hear about because nobody wants to admit them. Keep it simple, follow the guidelines, pay for the insurance. It's sooooo much easier that way.

" Do you really think you must..." is in the title of this thread. That's a pretty mirky gray area to be standing in, say, in front of a judge, when you've shipped a weapon improperly to somebody under DOJ surveillance. For instance. [I know it won't be me and that's what matters.]
 
Why are you bringing up a CJ degree? It means nothing.

How does LE have discretion regarding shipping something in violation of a private corporation's policy which is not law, therefore out of the jurisdiction of LE? :rolleyes:
 
There are so many differing situational angles that you can get into legal or monetary trouble by skirting the law(s) that it would make your head spin.
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It just really bothers me when people call not complying with a law that does not exist as skirting the law. That's like saying that a person open carrying a firearm in Washington state without a CPL is skirting the concealed carry law by not concealing the firearm.

There is no Federal law that requires notification of a common or contract carrier of the shipment of a firearm within the same state or going to a licensee in any state.
 
Not to muddy the issue, but my own experience with UPS leads me to believe that their insurance is pretty much worthless no matter what you're shipping and no matter what you've told them.
 
Yes, yes, your insurance on the package is voided if something goes wrong and it's damaged in transit, but that's such an infrequent occurrence as to be practically disregarded
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Maybe I am unlucky, or maybe you don't ship much. The most valuable item I have ever had disappear was a stock certificate. I was pretty worried about it until it all got straightened out.
 
If you choose to be dishonest
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That sums it up rather nicely. Folks, what ever happened to choose to be honest? It is sad to see here the regular presentation of dishonest behavior, lack of ethics, and occassional outright support of illegal activity. Have a little respect for the rest of us gunowners, even if you don't have any for yourself. Some of us have worked pretty hard to convince others that gunowners are honest, ethical, law-abiding folks that can be TRUSTED. Every time someone posts this stuff about choosing to be dishonest, ignoring rules that they don't like, and so on it just shows that you cannot be trusted. Have some respect for those of us with higher standards, please.
 
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It is just, to me, this thread is about calling BS to a falsely held belief that something is required by Federal law, when, in fact, it is not. How many times have we heard B.S. like "handguns must be shipped by an FFL to an FFL, that's the law", "it's illegal for a New Jersey resident to possess hollow point ammunition", "a 20 year old cannot legally own or purchase a handgun", "a California resident cannot buy and use a 30 round magazine in Nevada".

My one and only point, for me, is this: we, as gun owners, need to stop quoting stuff as if it were law that is not law. We have enough restrictions placed upon us that are actual laws as it is. If we keep spreading and standing behind rumors or company policies as the law, we won't notice it when the anti's try to make those company policies or rumors actual laws because we have been deceiving ourselves all along by believing and promoting them as laws that already exist.
 
David, that was a wonderfully touching speech, but this thread isn't the place for it.

The sole intention of this thread was/is to educate the misinformed people who believe that the LAW states that UPS Ground may not be used to ship a firearm. Anything beyond that simple goal is tangential to the point.

You're reading too much into it and, I believe assuming too much. :)
 
A larger point in my view is that UPS, FedEx and the like are charging firearm customers exorbitant fees because their own employees can't be trusted not to steal guns being shipped (at least, that's what I've heard has been their main rationale for imposing the price gouge). If true, I find such a policy appalling. Doesn't it occur to them to fire the thieves and to hire honest people? Or would they rather just make us pay a lot more money to make up for their supposed losses and keep their crooks on the job?
 
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