Disgruntled man shooting tires and engine block of utility truck in front of his home

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"...what we would do..." Simple. You call police. Having a CCW permit does not make you part of a posse or LEO.
And you cannot act because of what you think the guy might do. Nor do you get to determine his state of mental health.
"...a fun quote to throw around..." Doesn't pay the 5 or 6 figure legal fees either.
 
What I see when I watch the video is ample opportunity to walk away and find a safe place. The shooter is focused on the truck. It seems that he had opportunity to target the workers and didn't. I would not want to be the catalyst in changing his intent from targeting property to targeting people. This is one of those times it is wise to ask "Must I shoot?" rather than "May I shoot?"
 
Very stupid and totally unacceptable, the sort of publicity we DON'T need. I wonder if he somehow thought he could get away with it. Jail time at 64, not exactly a good retirement plan.
 
SIGSHR said:
Very stupid and totally unacceptable, the sort of publicity we DON'T need. I wonder if he somehow thought he could get away with it. Jail time at 64, not exactly a good retirement plan.
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I actually predict he get's no more then 90 days in jail.
and probably a year or two probation.

It sounds like he has a clean record, he was a firefighter (yes this will play a role as he served the public much like a cop), He is also 64.. If he has any major health issues they really don't like to keep you.
They let prisoners with serious medical conditions out early all the time.

Sure they WILL throw his ass in prison if the crime is heinous enough.
But let's look at it.. he has 2 felony assault and 2 felony vandalism charges.

I suspect the assault charges get dropped altogether, and only the vandalism sticks.. and might even get reduced.

Im not a lawyer but I just have a feeling he's not gonna see more then 90.. or maybe 180 days in jail.

He's not gonna get years or anything as shocking as it might seem to some people on video it does not appear he intended harm on anything but property (trucks) and no one was injured.
 
If my home is in the vicinity of the shooting, I would check that the doors were locked, call the police and move to an inside area of the house putting as much mass between myself and the shooter as possible in case of ricochets.

If I did not live in the neighborhood but was just on the street, I would call the police, answer any questions they had about the situation, leave my name and contact information and withdraw from the vicinity.
 
There is nothing in that story that shows a need to intervene.even if you just by chance encountered an old man shooting a truck, without a shred of evidence that he has people pinned down inside, should you interfere?

As it sits on paper right now, the old man was shooting a car and not presenting a direct danger to anyone. Pointing a gun and yelling "FRREZE!" is an unnecessary escalation that could make him vent his anger on you.

Your ideas are good. Draw, record, prepare, wait. But hiding behind a car? Isn't he shooting at cars? Maybe rethink that.

The last line on the chart is that you haven't a shred of evidence that he poses a risk to life or injury. Professionals will be there soon. This situation, as it stands, shows no signs of possible escalation. It might resolve itself when he runs out of ammo, but even then, you don't k ow if ed Norton is waiting inside to provide backup.

There is nothing at all in the scenario posted that would suggest civilian intervention. Civilian intervention here has, imo, an absolutely shocking level of potential damage.
 
Every American male has grown up with the television image of a gun being used to settle a dispute, it's the final move, it trumps everything. Point a gun and they leave. It takes twenty-five minutes and commercials from beginning to end, the bad guy steals your cow a nd kicks your mule, you hunt him down and take back your cow, and make him apologize to the mule. Maybe you shoot the gun out of his hand. It all ends up good.

Sometimes, people just lose touch with what's real. Taking a gun after the revenooers like snuffy Smith used to.

Twenty years ago we had a similar incident. Old man who had owned his home since the Louisiana purchase had an open pit outhouse, inside the city. There were months of negotiations, and well, he liked doing his business out in the fresh air, so the city finally had to intervene. When a crew arrived to fix things up he pointed his .22 rifle.

You can't tell anymore. Brandishing a weapon used to be the beginning, and it was over. Point the gun and the other guy backs down. In the current cinema and television, the rules that are fed into our souls are confused, and unreal. You may see fifty or more people shot or killed in a two hour shift, sometimes just because they are standing next to a bad guy.
 
There is nothing at all in the scenario posted that would suggest civilian intervention. Civilian intervention here has, imo, an absolutely shocking level of potential damage.
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I completely agree.
 
Joe, I expect suspended sentence or several years of probation. He's not a criminal, he's obviously demented, and there can't be anything stupider than locking him up just because he committed this crime.

Psych evaluation. Leave him alone in his home after taking away all dangerous objects. Arrange for observation.

What are they going to do? Have him plead guilty to whatever level of charge they need to do all of this, to enforce observation and compliance.
 
If I saw something like this going on down the block, I'd obviously pick up my rifle and binoculars and go to a window to watch. He's shooting a car? Okay. That's no reason to kill him. Unless I have a good reason to use deadly force, I don't need to be any closer than that.

I wouldn't even set down my coffee.

If the guy had shot an ice cream truck, it would have been much easier to understand.
 
Good idea to draw and observe. Yeah - people call the law. Man with a gun. The police roll up and see a man with a gun. YOU!

Why do folks want to stay around where there is gunfire? Ego, hero wannabees?

Unless you have a compelling reason to defend someone - leave the scene.
 
Sure they WILL throw his ass in prison if the crime is heinous enough.
But let's look at it.. he has 2 felony assault and 2 felony vandalism charges.

I suspect the assault charges get dropped altogether, and only the vandalism sticks.. and might even get reduced.
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First result from a Google search suggests otherwise -
Hussein and Webber
Penalties for Aggravated Assault

In Florida, Aggravated Assault is a third degree felony, with penalties of up to 5 years in prison or 5 years probation, and a $5,000.00 fine. The offense is harshly prosecuted throughout the State, and even first-time offenders will face a realistic possibility of prison.

The range of punishments can increase substantially, to include mandatory prison of up to 20 years, where a firearm is discharged during the course of an incident. Even if a firearm is not discharged, the mere fact that a gun was wielded during the assault will subject the accused to a 3 year minimum mandatory prison sentence..."
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For certain, his savings are now going to go towards paying an expensive lawyer. A rather expensive lesson in not blowing one's top over trivialities.
 
You're right. There's no need to draw a gun. That's a step of preparedness far beyond what is called for in this exact, specific scenario.

I don't necessarily agree with running from the scene, leaving an active shooter in absolute control.

I'm not going to go into fantasy. This was a crazy old man who posed no probable threat, as long as I'm not a target or causing problems, observing from concealment is what may provide a measure of safety for the cops, (HEY! He went under the porch!) or provide the testimony that makes a conviction. Under nearly any situation that I can imagine, being in a position where you can safely observe and possibly intervene if the situation absolutely calls for it (saving lives).

There is no perfect solution. Run like hell to save yourself from any possible risk without any regard for the situation is one answer that may save a person's life. Relaying information that the guy has barricaded himself behind that truck, apparently to ambush the units that he hears coming may save several lives. Nothing more that I can say
 
About an hour after “having words” with one of the workers, Jove came out with his .357 revolver and caused over $1,000 of damage to the trucks, an officer wrote in the report.

A Hialeah sergeant who responded to the shooting said he saw Jove fire at an AT&T worker in a raised bucket lift. After being told to put his weapon down, Jove dropped it on the swale, according to the report.

“After waiving his Miranda Rights the defendant furnished a statement stating he went ‘bananas’ and wanted to stop them from leaving,” the officer wrote in the report. “He shot at tires and truck to [get] the AT&T workers from leaving prior to police arrival.”
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Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/news/loc...e/hialeah/article162808923.html#storylink=cpy

I adore his explanation of the events.
He 'has words' with the workers and then goes inside his home for an hour but doesn't call the police.
He goes outside and shoots up two utility trucks, prompting a 911 call to the cops about an armed man shooting.
...
...
His explanation is that he didn't want the trucks leaving before the police arrived even though he didn't call them and they were responding to his actions.:cool: Yeah, cool story, bro.
 
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