Controversial Topic Warning!! Is owning a gun for SD/HD similar to...
- Thread starter ezmiraldo
- Start date
Statistics are just number. What they "prove" or disprove, can be virtually anything you want it to be. All it takes is selective choice of parameters.
Space flight is the safest endeavor mankind had ever achieved, if you go by number of deaths vs number of miles traveled.
Overall survival rate from airplane crashes (with fatalities) may be 24%, but that doesn't mean anything much, being an average. And I suspect it means even less to the 76% who died.
We focus so much (maybe too much) on the "big picture" and "overall", and ignore (too much) the fact that at any given moment, in any given situation the odds are 50%. Something happens, or it doesn't.
This doesn't mean statistics are worthless, that everything is a coin toss, it just means that we must be careful in the lessons we take from statistics.
I can think of no situation were it is NOT better to have a gun and not need it, than need it and not have it.
Space flight is the safest endeavor mankind had ever achieved, if you go by number of deaths vs number of miles traveled.
Overall survival rate from airplane crashes (with fatalities) may be 24%, but that doesn't mean anything much, being an average. And I suspect it means even less to the 76% who died.
We focus so much (maybe too much) on the "big picture" and "overall", and ignore (too much) the fact that at any given moment, in any given situation the odds are 50%. Something happens, or it doesn't.
This doesn't mean statistics are worthless, that everything is a coin toss, it just means that we must be careful in the lessons we take from statistics.
I can think of no situation were it is NOT better to have a gun and not need it, than need it and not have it.
I don't have a fire extinguisher or do I carry a firearm. The odds of needing either are so low that I don't feel the need. I take my chances I drive every day that's much more likely to get me killed or seriously injured than someone shooting at me. I am sure that some people that carry smoke drink too much eat the wrong things all things there are more likely to kill them than violent attack. But if carrying makes them feel safer that's up to them.
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
Stats are fun. I was in a class where the instructor said outcome X was as rare as being hit by lightning or being in a plane crash.
I was sitting next to a friend who survived a DC-8 crash that killed 30 in the front of the plane. I've been hit by lightning. We both started to laugh.
9\11 caused many deaths after the fact as folks avoid planes to drive and were killed in the increase in traffic accidents.
I do have three fire extinguishers. Garage, kitchen and upstairs.
I was sitting next to a friend who survived a DC-8 crash that killed 30 in the front of the plane. I've been hit by lightning. We both started to laugh.
9\11 caused many deaths after the fact as folks avoid planes to drive and were killed in the increase in traffic accidents.
I do have three fire extinguishers. Garage, kitchen and upstairs.
People forget or don't think about what that really means. A stat may mean that the probability of x happening to someone is .001%. They interpret that to mean that it is unlikely to ever happen. But over the population of the US,
that's somewhere over 3000 times. it is going to happen, it just might not be you.
You won't see a mail person pet a dog. Most dogs are friendly, but if the mail person pets enough dogs he will get bitten.
Well, I haven't flown commercial since 2000.
I've never had to use a firearm for self-defense against a person, but I have been in situations that would have ended better if I had been armed.
I don't like flying, especially the hassle (supposedly even worse now). I do like firearms and am comforted by the presence of my HD shotgun beside my alarm clock.
I've never had to use a firearm for self-defense against a person, but I have been in situations that would have ended better if I had been armed.
I don't like flying, especially the hassle (supposedly even worse now). I do like firearms and am comforted by the presence of my HD shotgun beside my alarm clock.
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
Risk analyses work for the aggregate expense calculations of large populations and institutions. However, if you are in the tail of distribution of critical incident intensity - the group populations stats don't protect you.
You decide where in the risk distribution you make your cut and prepare for it.
You decide where in the risk distribution you make your cut and prepare for it.
Revoltella
Moderator
While the chance of having to need to use your firearm may be .0063792%, when it happens to you, it's 100%.
Rifleman1776
New member
If it is closed, it would not be because it is controversial. There is no useful content or clear question, IMHO.
seeker_two
New member
Fire extinguishers, first-aid kits, spare tires, spare food & water in the pantry.....ask your "friends" if any of these things indicate paranoia as well. Then ask them if they have any of these things....
I agree totally that a gun is a "not very likely to be needed, but essential if actually needed" tool. I wonder what percentage of folks on this and other gun forums have carried for years if not decades and have never, not once, had to even draw their weapon for their own or family defense. Yet even if this is true, it does not change the need for vigilance and preparedness.
Very recently I was on a week-long road trip to NY, where of course I could not be carrying, nor even keep a gun in my car, without real risk to myself legally. The entire week was uneventful; in fact, the who ambience of NYC was so much better than in the past, and I never felt endangered or threatened despite being a senior citizen with some physical disabilities and no offsetting firearm. But that does not change the reality that I well could have needed to defend myself and would have been unable to do so.
Each to their own, and for me, paranoia is the guy who lives in a good area, yet keeps loaded guns in every room and in the pocket of his pajamas as well as in a sealed plastic bag inside the shower stall. Or the guy who carries three handguns, six magazines of ammo, two combat knives and wears a bulletproof vest when he goes grocery shopping. But the individual who carries a handgun, who keeps a firearm or two available for the chance of a household intruder, and trains to be ready if needed to use his firearm, is just being prudent and cautious.
Very recently I was on a week-long road trip to NY, where of course I could not be carrying, nor even keep a gun in my car, without real risk to myself legally. The entire week was uneventful; in fact, the who ambience of NYC was so much better than in the past, and I never felt endangered or threatened despite being a senior citizen with some physical disabilities and no offsetting firearm. But that does not change the reality that I well could have needed to defend myself and would have been unable to do so.
Each to their own, and for me, paranoia is the guy who lives in a good area, yet keeps loaded guns in every room and in the pocket of his pajamas as well as in a sealed plastic bag inside the shower stall. Or the guy who carries three handguns, six magazines of ammo, two combat knives and wears a bulletproof vest when he goes grocery shopping. But the individual who carries a handgun, who keeps a firearm or two available for the chance of a household intruder, and trains to be ready if needed to use his firearm, is just being prudent and cautious.
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
The "if you need it, you need it" argument is cliche, circular and silly. It's like saying "If it's raining, it's raining." Or "If I'm wearing a shirt, I'm wearing a shirt." Expect blank stares and rolling eyes.
The arguments that will work are the ones that put it in terms they understand. IOW, The same arguments they would use about seat belts, insurance, fire extinguishers, etc. If they say those are more likely, you agree, because they are, and say that it's your choice and that no one is forcing them to carry.
Some people will accept this and others will move on to the next argument because their real issue is not self-defense related.
My personal opinion is that if you are not prepared, by owning and carrying firearms, to defend yourself and your family, you are living in fantasy land.
It's unfortunate, but crime can and will happen at any time. There are a lot of bad people in the world. I can't change that, but I can take measures to protect myself if needed.
It's unfortunate, but crime can and will happen at any time. There are a lot of bad people in the world. I can't change that, but I can take measures to protect myself if needed.
There are millions of people that don't carry firearms. I am sure they are not living in fantasy land. They like most people they look at the facts example the chances of needing a firearm are very low so they prioritise other things. There are hundreds of things more likely to kill or injure you than someone attacking you and you needing a firearm. If it makes some people feel safer carrying a firearm that's up to them. But because the majority of people feel safe without carrying a firearm does not mean they are living in a fantasy world maybe they are living in the real world.