concealed carry.

Well! My ideas are different, I know. But the idea that whatever has happened, just once, any where, could happen to me, just as soon as tomorrow! Maybe even today? It is a long way to midnight!

So, as an old guy, well retired, and I can carry what I want, as long as it is legal, I can get to it fairly quickly, it has enough bullets (16 rounds of 147g HP) and I can hit a 2" circle at 7m, an eye socket, I am a happy chap.

I have no problem with shooting with one hand, either one, and I have seen a lot of shooters who do not like to do that.

So if I get into a shooting/attack, where I only get to fire one, or two rounds, a bonus! Those other rounds do not eat nothing!
 
Well! My ideas are different, I know. But the idea that whatever has happened, just once, any where, could happen to me, just as soon as tomorrow! Maybe even today? It is a long way to midnight!

So, as an old guy, well retired, and I can carry what I want, as long as it is legal, I can get to it fairly quickly, it has enough bullets (16 rounds of 147g HP) and I can hit a 2" circle at 7m, an eye socket, I am a happy chap.

I have no problem with shooting with one hand, either one, and I have seen a lot of shooters who do not like to do that.

So if I get into a shooting/attack, where I only get to fire one, or two rounds, a bonus! Those other rounds do not eat nothing!
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True enough!!!
 
This is a tuckable holster however when I tried tucking my shirt in it just sucked the shirt in around the gun, completely noticeable.
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The reason I went to OWB as my primary means of carry is I didn't want to maintain a wardrobe of size-larger pants and, when tucking, shirts. Foregoing tucking becomes a natural option, and can be done with a normal-sized shirt. Embrace the casual slob look, which happens to be chic these days.
 
My normal attire is a T-shirt and jeans or carhardts but I do like to dress up sometimes. Living down here in sweatville does make things harder.
 
So after carrying my SR40 for a little while I have decided that I want something a little smaller. My big question is should I stay with the 40 or switch to 9 mm. Thinking about the SR9c or the smith and Wesson shield.
 
My big question is should I stay with the 40 or switch to 9 mm.
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Given that the FBI nows says that 9 Luger is the optimal law enforcement caliber, odds are you will switch sooner or later. The 9 Luger gives you performance advantages. Having guns in different calibers gives you diversity that's handy during ammo shortages.

The US military may well soon ditch the 9 NATO for a larger caliber, but they, unlike you, are hampered by The Hague Convention.
 
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Given that the FBI now says that 9 Luger is the optimal law enforcement caliber
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Why is that? Doesn't the 40 have more punch than the 9?
I thought the reason the 40 was developed in the first place was due to the failure or the 9 during that shootout in the 80's.
 
I thought the reason the 40 was developed in the first place was due to the failure or the 9 during that shootout in the 80's.
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Yep. There was a TV movie about the event in the late 80's. FBI agents were shooting 9mm and the 2 BG's were hit several times but stayed alive long enough to kill at least 2 of the agents. That I remember. Think at the time it did prompt FBI to upgrade the caliber of their std issue.

Not sure that is specifically why the 40 was made. I'm sure someone here with more knowlsdge on the subject can respond.
 
the 40 doesnt have any more "stopping power" than the 9. The FBI needed an excuse to cover their disaster. If I was going to downsize to a compact carry gun I would switch to the 9 it will likely hold more rounds than the equivelent size 40...
 
Why is that? Doesn't the 40 have more punch than the 9?
I thought the reason the 40 was developed in the first place was due to the failure or the 9 during that shootout in the 80's.
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Yes, the .40 S&W arose due to failure of the .38 Special and 9 Luger in the '86 Miami Shootout. The FBI adopted military gelatin testing of ammunition and accepted the expert finding that penetration was the most important terminal ballistics characteristic of a handgun round. The 10 Auto was adopted by the FBI because of excellent penetration, but recoil proved too much so the .40 S&W was developed as a 10 Auto light that was able to be used in frames designed for the 9 Luger, thus increasing capacity.

The bigger 0.400-inch bullet had an edge on penetration and expansion reliability on 0.355-inch bullets, until JHP designers, guided by FBI ammo testing criteria, improved 9 Luger designs. Now that reliable 9 Luger JHP rounds are available, in the absence of evidence that .40- or .45-caliber JHPs result in better results, the agency has concluded that the 9 Luger gives essentially identical results with the added benefits of less recoil (resulting in better accuracy and faster follow-up shots), fewer misses (they claim 70-80% of shots fired during a LE gunfight miss), higher ammo capacity, more affordable ammo, and lower chamber pressures (resulting in guns lasting longer).

I found the FBI Academy memo from May 2014 announcing the change and reasons for it and copied it in the thread about the .40 S&W disappearing.

Ironically, the US Army is dissatisfied with 9 NATO, because it often takes multiple hits to put an illegal combatant down. They may well switch to .40 S&W or back to .45 Auto, but The Hague Convention generally restricts them to using FMJs, while premium 9 Lugers will reliably expand to about 0.6 inches, which yields a cross-sectional area 76% greater than that of the venerable .45 Auto.
 
the 40 doesnt have any more "stopping power" than the 9. The FBI needed an excuse to cover their disaster.
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In the late '80s/early '90s the 10 Auto, then .40 S&W were better bad-guy stoppers than the 9 Luger, because JHPs didn't reliably expand.

Today, premium JHPs for all service calibers afford adequate penetration and reliable expansion. In the early '90s the FBI compared wound channel volume -- expanded cross-sectional area multiplied by penetration depth. Now they resort to saying that trauma surgeons and pathologists, due to the elasticity of living tissue, cannot tell the difference between wounds caused by any handgun of any service caliber until the bullet is recovered; thus, the wounds must be no different, as confirmed by no reliable data proving otherwise. Of course, there are no such reliable data differentiating these calibers because it is illegal and immoral to shoot people in a replicable way to document the results. I assume that enough FBI agents have participated in IDPA where the benefits of the lower recoil and increased capacity of the 9 Luger are readily realized. Finally, the FBI Academy ran a controlled test where they had agents shoot a qualifications course using identical Glocks, one chambered in .40 S&W, the other in 9 Luger. They found, on average and almost universally, agents scored better, in terms of both accuracy and time, with the 9 Luger.
 
Limnophile said:
Yes, the .40 S&W arose due to failure of the .38 Special and 9 Luger in the '86 Miami Shootout.
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and the shootout would have turned out any different if the agents were all using the 40?

coyotewsm, all im suggesting is dont dismiss a caliber because of percieved "stopping power". The 9mm is not a failure and is still one of the top police, military and defense cartridges today. There are more size options in compact and even pocket pistols in 9mm that would round out your collection giving you the versitality you need for dressing around all conditions. Remember you can still carry your full size when prudent so dont short change your new purchase on a slight change in size unless thats really what you want.
 
Koda94. I still love my SR I don't plan on getting rid of it. The fact is its a little difficult to conceal maybe I just don't know how. I figured if nothing else when I get another I can always carry the SR during the cold months when I can put on more clothes. Which down here I GA isn't very long. As far as caliber I have been leaning toward the 9 just wanted some feed back on it.
 
exactly, you got what I was trying to say. As far as how its also a matter of finding what works for you... it takes time and often a few expensive holsters. Full size, mid size, compact and pocket... and some models are in between. I find the difference concealing a full size vs a mid or compact marginal in hot weather its tee shirts and jeans or even shorts if it doesnt fit in your pocket it still prints. Something like a Sig 938 or Ruger LC9 will fit in a pocket and still carry well in a IWB holster for better comfort depending on the day.... so you have more options is the key, even mid day if situaition warrents you can even switch to pocket carry and leave the belt holster in the car. Options are a good thing.
 
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