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Christopher Dorner is only ONE man.
- Thread starter maestro pistolero
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The DC snipers took so long to catch because the local LEO's spent far too long looking for unknown suspects driving a white panel van. I lived up there then and now...you can't throw a rock around here without hitting a white panel van. They were stopping them left and right....luckily they didn't shoot up a van driven by innocent people.
With this, they know exactly who their looking for. I think he'll be dead or in custody by the end of the weekend. I don't think this jackass is some sort of criminal mastermind or "First Blood" type of specialist who's going to be outwitting the police at every turn. He'll be dead by Monday.
With this, they know exactly who their looking for. I think he'll be dead or in custody by the end of the weekend. I don't think this jackass is some sort of criminal mastermind or "First Blood" type of specialist who's going to be outwitting the police at every turn. He'll be dead by Monday.
True enough, but if the D.C. shooters had laid low for a few months at a time they might have evaded the law even longer.
And I'm not disagreeing with you, I hope they do get him and SOON. I was merely pointing out what a sane person would do.. of course a sane person wouldn't write out a manifesto.. I truly hope he's an icicle right now.
And I'm not disagreeing with you, I hope they do get him and SOON. I was merely pointing out what a sane person would do.. of course a sane person wouldn't write out a manifesto.. I truly hope he's an icicle right now.
He also name-checks Ellen Degeneres, but I'm not blaming her for it. To place politics on this is to miss the real issue. The plain fact is that the guy's delusional, he's on a vendetta, and he's very well trained. He could turn into another Eric Robert Rudolph.For one he is a left wing extremists. He is a big fan of Obama, Biden, and Anderson Cooper.
Frankly, if I were to cross paths with him, I would be very leery of engaging.
From what I read, his first victims were the daughter of the man he felt didn't adequately represent him at the police board which fired him, and the daughter's fiance.
So he has shown willingness to kill the loved ones of those he feels have wronged them, even if they were on his side.
His manifesto said he intends to kill the family members of those who have wronged him, and specifically the families of LAPD officers.
Given all that, I wouldn't say it's that the officers' lives are considered more important than ours are (though they may be), but that the officers are out there trying to protect their own families.
While that may not be politically correct, or even ideal, I can't say I blame them one bit. I also can't say that I wouldn't view it in much the same way.
As far as anti-terrorism training... he was a Navy Reserve junior officer, assigned to Bahrain for a year as an augmentee. That's Fifth Fleet Headquarters, and the Navy logistics hub for the Gulf. It's not exactly a combat zone. From what I could glean from the articles, my guess would be Dorner was a staff officer, and might have been a training officer (primarily administrative in function) for harbor patrol and/or EOD types, but that's just an educated guess.
So he has shown willingness to kill the loved ones of those he feels have wronged them, even if they were on his side.
His manifesto said he intends to kill the family members of those who have wronged him, and specifically the families of LAPD officers.
Given all that, I wouldn't say it's that the officers' lives are considered more important than ours are (though they may be), but that the officers are out there trying to protect their own families.
While that may not be politically correct, or even ideal, I can't say I blame them one bit. I also can't say that I wouldn't view it in much the same way.
As far as anti-terrorism training... he was a Navy Reserve junior officer, assigned to Bahrain for a year as an augmentee. That's Fifth Fleet Headquarters, and the Navy logistics hub for the Gulf. It's not exactly a combat zone. From what I could glean from the articles, my guess would be Dorner was a staff officer, and might have been a training officer (primarily administrative in function) for harbor patrol and/or EOD types, but that's just an educated guess.
Willie Sutton
Moderator
So he has shown willingness to kill the loved ones of those he feels have wronged them, even if they were on his side.
What he has shown is that he's read Ho Chi Minh's playbook: He understands how to invoke terror.
You don't terrorize people by killing them. You terrorize people by striking out at what they care for, and you make them understand that they are powerless to protect what they care for. You kill their dog. You rape their wife. You kill their children. You not only terrorize the people you are directly targeting, but you terrorize those who are their associates, or those who self-associate with the target. It's worked for eons.. for the IRA, the Mafia, the Viet Cong, etc. It's working here. How do you think the LEO's who worked directly with him feel about their job as they are looking for him... knowing that their wives and children and homes are not being protected by their husbands and fathers... because they are elsewhere? Trust me... they are scared, and so are their families. That's called terror. You can effect any end if you are willing to use terror as a tool. Contemplate this: Imagine that he is able to track down and kill the daughters of ten of his former LAPD associates: The result would be that the other 1000 of his former LAPD associates would call it quits for looking for him, and go home to circle their own wagons around their own families. Getting your enemy to quit the fight in droves is more effective than killing your enemies one by one. Kill one and you kill one. Terrorize 10 and you take 1000 out of the fight. Hearts and Minds... classic assymetric warfare.
This is the classic guerilla warfare. He's dangerous because he's smart and he's studied history a little.
Contemplate this, which is fiction but is so well written that it stands as an example: It's the musings of Kurtz, played by Marlon Brando:
We went into a camp to inoculate the children. We left the camp after we had inoculated the children for Polio, and this old man came running after us, and he was crying. He couldn't see. We went back there, and they had come and hacked off every inoculated arm. There they were in a pile. A pile of little arms. And I remember I cried. I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out. I didn't know what I wanted to do. And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it. I never want to forget. And then I realized, like I was shot, like I was shot with a diamond, a diamond bullet right through my forehead. And I thought: My God the genius of that. The genius. The will to do that. Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure. And then I realized they were stronger than we. Because they could stand that these were not monsters. These were men, trained cadres. These men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love but they had the strength, the strength to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men, then our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordial instincts to kill without feeling without passion without judgment... without judgment. Because it's judgment that defeats us....
Think it's fiction?
http://www.newsdaily.com/stories/bre9170c1-us-nigeria-violence/
The other effect of the classic use of terror is that the target of the terror will lash out and harm innocents who are mistaken to be the terrorist. This is a result of fear... over-reaction. This then turns the people against the target of the terror, further weakening them. How many Vietnamese villages did we seach, how many tons of rice did we burn, in Viet Nam... making people who might not have been VC sympathizers into our lifelong enemies?
How does this look for the police in CA?
"Police gave no warning as they mistakenly shoot woman, 71, delivering newspapers and then target another innocent bystander during California manhunt for 'killer' ex-cop"
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-delivering-newspapers.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
How many life-long bitter enemies have the police in California made this week?
Do you think the loved ones of the people targeted blame the terrorist, or the police?
The reason the police are afraid is... because they are afraid. They ought to be.
Willie
.
What he has shown is that he's read Ho Chi Minh's playbook: He understands how to invoke terror.
You don't terrorize people by killing them. You terrorize people by striking out at what they care for, and you make them understand that they are powerless to protect what they care for. You kill their dog. You rape their wife. You kill their children. You not only terrorize the people you are directly targeting, but you terrorize those who are their associates, or those who self-associate with the target. It's worked for eons.. for the IRA, the Mafia, the Viet Cong, etc. It's working here. How do you think the LEO's who worked directly with him feel about their job as they are looking for him... knowing that their wives and children and homes are not being protected by their husbands and fathers... because they are elsewhere? Trust me... they are scared, and so are their families. That's called terror. You can effect any end if you are willing to use terror as a tool. Contemplate this: Imagine that he is able to track down and kill the daughters of ten of his former LAPD associates: The result would be that the other 1000 of his former LAPD associates would call it quits for looking for him, and go home to circle their own wagons around their own families. Getting your enemy to quit the fight in droves is more effective than killing your enemies one by one. Kill one and you kill one. Terrorize 10 and you take 1000 out of the fight. Hearts and Minds... classic assymetric warfare.
This is the classic guerilla warfare. He's dangerous because he's smart and he's studied history a little.
Contemplate this, which is fiction but is so well written that it stands as an example: It's the musings of Kurtz, played by Marlon Brando:
We went into a camp to inoculate the children. We left the camp after we had inoculated the children for Polio, and this old man came running after us, and he was crying. He couldn't see. We went back there, and they had come and hacked off every inoculated arm. There they were in a pile. A pile of little arms. And I remember I cried. I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out. I didn't know what I wanted to do. And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it. I never want to forget. And then I realized, like I was shot, like I was shot with a diamond, a diamond bullet right through my forehead. And I thought: My God the genius of that. The genius. The will to do that. Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure. And then I realized they were stronger than we. Because they could stand that these were not monsters. These were men, trained cadres. These men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love but they had the strength, the strength to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men, then our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordial instincts to kill without feeling without passion without judgment... without judgment. Because it's judgment that defeats us....
Think it's fiction?
http://www.newsdaily.com/stories/bre9170c1-us-nigeria-violence/
The other effect of the classic use of terror is that the target of the terror will lash out and harm innocents who are mistaken to be the terrorist. This is a result of fear... over-reaction. This then turns the people against the target of the terror, further weakening them. How many Vietnamese villages did we seach, how many tons of rice did we burn, in Viet Nam... making people who might not have been VC sympathizers into our lifelong enemies?
How does this look for the police in CA?
"Police gave no warning as they mistakenly shoot woman, 71, delivering newspapers and then target another innocent bystander during California manhunt for 'killer' ex-cop"
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-delivering-newspapers.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
How many life-long bitter enemies have the police in California made this week?
Do you think the loved ones of the people targeted blame the terrorist, or the police?
The reason the police are afraid is... because they are afraid. They ought to be.
Willie
.
Last edited:
Chief Beck; LAPD gun control, Dormer....
This tragic incident with Dormer(the US Navy Reserve veteran & ex-cop) reminds me of Chief Beck's remarks a few weeks ago about how; "we(the LAPD) must face all these guns!(guns that were purchased by law-abiding CA residents who are NO threat to the LAPD).
Chief Charlie Beck & his anti-gun/anti-2A pals now look foolish as they must track down a violent, unstable former LAPD officer.
The message here should be clear; STOP blaming law abiding citizens who own firearms legally for violent crimes & illegal guns!
ClydeFrog
This tragic incident with Dormer(the US Navy Reserve veteran & ex-cop) reminds me of Chief Beck's remarks a few weeks ago about how; "we(the LAPD) must face all these guns!(guns that were purchased by law-abiding CA residents who are NO threat to the LAPD).
Chief Charlie Beck & his anti-gun/anti-2A pals now look foolish as they must track down a violent, unstable former LAPD officer.
The message here should be clear; STOP blaming law abiding citizens who own firearms legally for violent crimes & illegal guns!
ClydeFrog
2ndsojourn
New member
^^^^ And to add to that, now an untold number of people are facing the same threat as the LAPD.
Bamashooter
New member
2ndsojourn you are exactly right. Why should citizens be any less armed than the police? All are facing the same threat.
I dont think this guy is in the mountains. He knows how LE operates. They follow leads and trails left by their suspects. Give them no trail and what do they do? Nothing. Because they dont have a direction to go.
He burnt his truck. Why? Conceal evidence? Identity. He knows they know who he is. No reason to burn it.
This is just my opinion but I think he left them a bread crumb trail with a burnt truck that lead to where some of his family owns some land in the area, knowing they would follow it.
JMO but im guessing hes no place near that area. Wont be caught unless its by sheer accident and wont strike again until things cool down a little. LAPD cant stay in its shell forever. Eventually they will have to begin business as usual in the absence of another attack or lose whatever respect they have in LA. And be vulnerable.
I hope hes caught soon. But honestly I dont think he will be. My guess he is he finally loses patience and dies in a firefight with LAPD during an attack that he executed too soon. I dont think LAPDs worries will be over for a while.
He burnt his truck. Why? Conceal evidence? Identity. He knows they know who he is. No reason to burn it.
This is just my opinion but I think he left them a bread crumb trail with a burnt truck that lead to where some of his family owns some land in the area, knowing they would follow it.
JMO but im guessing hes no place near that area. Wont be caught unless its by sheer accident and wont strike again until things cool down a little. LAPD cant stay in its shell forever. Eventually they will have to begin business as usual in the absence of another attack or lose whatever respect they have in LA. And be vulnerable.
I hope hes caught soon. But honestly I dont think he will be. My guess he is he finally loses patience and dies in a firefight with LAPD during an attack that he executed too soon. I dont think LAPDs worries will be over for a while.
Double Naught Spy
New member
I disagree on the truck being an intentional bread trail issue, at least not as a plan. I don't think he would have a plan for breaking an axle, though I don't doubt the truck was then used as a diversion of opportunity. Given that he left behind rifles, ammo, and cold weather gear, I don't think his goal was to intentionally leave it behind. That is just how it worked out at that location.
Upset people often come across like this. Plus he may be all over the map. He probably didn't make a nice outline and then succinctly write out the complaints. He probably put them in as they came to him.
I'm the first one to put a political slant on things but if you read his manifesto his singular motivation is perceived injustice by the LAPD/LEOs. His likes and dislikes are all over the map. Eclectic to say the least.
Upset people often come across like this. Plus he may be all over the map. He probably didn't make a nice outline and then succinctly write out the complaints. He probably put them in as they came to him.
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
We really don't know what's up with the abandoned truck yet. Mleake might have it.
There will be real uproar if it comes out that Dorner was unjustly fired and his complaints are real. Also, the police incidents of opening fire on two trucks of innocent folks will be important in the next weeks.
The LA Mayor describing Dorner as a sick individual with mental problems is not the brightest thing to do. Why agitate him even more? Idiot.
There will be real uproar if it comes out that Dorner was unjustly fired and his complaints are real. Also, the police incidents of opening fire on two trucks of innocent folks will be important in the next weeks.
The LA Mayor describing Dorner as a sick individual with mental problems is not the brightest thing to do. Why agitate him even more? Idiot.
Spats McGee
Administrator
I doubt that the mayor is really concerned with Dorner's feelings. Were I the mayor, I wouldn't expect Dorner to come out of this alive. I would, however, be looking for reasons to get my constituents to view a couple of shot-up civilian cars as "acceptable collateral damage in a hunt for a madman."Glenn E. Meyer said:The LA Mayor describing Dorner as a sick individual with mental problems is not the brightest thing to do. Why agitate him even more?
Just a couple of links to add more complexity to an already complex, and bazaar, situation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9yDJ06Z2-w&feature=youtu.be
http://www.buzzfeed.com/ellievhall/lapd-killer-found-8000-and-returned-it-to-an-oklahoma-church
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9yDJ06Z2-w&feature=youtu.be
http://www.buzzfeed.com/ellievhall/lapd-killer-found-8000-and-returned-it-to-an-oklahoma-church
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