You just made my point. I'm glad you're getting into bp, I really am and I would be the first to say a flintlock is not a good starter rifle but a good percussion sidelock can't be beat and the sense of satisfaction that comes with making a clean kill with a real muzzleloader is second to none. You will never get the same feeling from a scoped inline. That feeling is akin to making a kill with a scoped 30-06. Do yourself a favor and get a sidelock. Learn the ins and outs of it. Check out some bp only forums and learn all you can.
Buying a muzzleloader
- Thread starter rfxcasey
- Start date
You just made my point. I'm glad you're getting into bp, I really am and I would be the first to say a flintlock is not a good starter rifle but a good percussion sidelock can't be beat and the sense of satisfaction that comes with making a clean kill with a real muzzleloader is second to none. You will never get the same feeling from a scoped inline. That feeling is akin to making a kill with a scoped 30-06. Do yourself a favor and get a sidelock. Learn the ins and outs of it. Check out some bp only forums and learn all you can.
Blindstitch
New member
If that's your view I'm not going to change it.
What I like about the inlines is if I don't shoot them I can open the plug and remove the load. No need for special tools. Therefore I bought one to extend my deer season with reliability.
I do have two other sidelocks and they're fine but harder to clean and if a cap goes pop in the field followed by several of it's friends I don't have to get out the bullet puller and have to inspect what went wrong. Moisture is not your friend.
A couple of tips on the CVA , the rear sight has a set screw , so loosen it first before you adjust the sight . The hammer extension threads are left handed , if you need to remove it .
I have both if you call a TC Hawken and Renegade traditional ( I really don't , but they are wood ) I prefer my line for hunting , easy to scope , easy to clean and easy to load , especially if you use the pills . I have tried Blackhorn 209 . but it is not always reliable , even with CCI 209 magnum primers . Triple 7 and White Hots have always gone bang every time in my rifle . So that is what I use .
I prefer the Hawken hanging on the wall , it's beautiful to look at .
I have both if you call a TC Hawken and Renegade traditional ( I really don't , but they are wood ) I prefer my line for hunting , easy to scope , easy to clean and easy to load , especially if you use the pills . I have tried Blackhorn 209 . but it is not always reliable , even with CCI 209 magnum primers . Triple 7 and White Hots have always gone bang every time in my rifle . So that is what I use .
I prefer the Hawken hanging on the wall , it's beautiful to look at .
"Is black powder more corrosive then residue from non corrosive center fire cartridges? "
I had a very snippy reply but deleted it.
Yes, blackpowder RESIDUE is hygroscopic(attracts moisture) and will rust metal very quickly.
I don't use real BP any more after converting to replica powder which is non-corrosive. I couldn't care less about the aesthetics of real BP(smelly smoke, requirement for immediate cleaning, inconsistent performance). I just want to use primitive equipment to hunt a different season.
I had a very snippy reply but deleted it.
Yes, blackpowder RESIDUE is hygroscopic(attracts moisture) and will rust metal very quickly.
I don't use real BP any more after converting to replica powder which is non-corrosive. I couldn't care less about the aesthetics of real BP(smelly smoke, requirement for immediate cleaning, inconsistent performance). I just want to use primitive equipment to hunt a different season.
Your game, your call !!!
Example;
Currently during our classes, we use a TC New Englander and a Knight MK-85. if we have a large class, we use both. If we have a small class, we stick with the TC SideLock. Yes, on hard use, you will experience more hang and misfires with a SideLock but we love dealing with those problems. ......
Be Safe !!!
Personally I find my SideLocks easier to clean than most MMLs. Granted, the MMLs are more accessible but actually have more surfaces that see carbon deposits, consequently, more to clean. The SideLocks are fairly predictable and easy to clean. .....
Example;
Currently during our classes, we use a TC New Englander and a Knight MK-85. if we have a large class, we use both. If we have a small class, we stick with the TC SideLock. Yes, on hard use, you will experience more hang and misfires with a SideLock but we love dealing with those problems. ......
Be Safe !!!
johnwilliamson062
Moderator
The sense of satisfaction when one bites into a venison steak is what I am out for in the cold and rain.
I have a muzzleloader to get an extra four days hunting. If Ohio eliminated ML season I would sell mine and only ever buy another as a wallhanger. Chimps generally score below 50 on IQ tests using the 7 year old scale. I don't think deer are nearly as intelligent as chimps. Not so "sporting" IMO. Besides, the shot is the easiest part.
I also prefer a word processor to a typewriter.
MP3s in the cloud to 45s in a chest
and fuel injected automatics to carburated manuals.
If that makes me lazy, I claim the title with dignity.
Out of curiosity, do you field dress with split flint and cook over an open fire? If not you are obviously lazy just like me
My understanding is black powder and substitutes are still hygroscopic before being fired. Less surface are for moisture in the air to interact with and such, but same issues. Might be wrong. Buying an inline with speed breech makes it so I don't have to concern myself with such things. Planning to upgrade to one of the finger removable ones so I don't even have to worry about having a tool handy. Now that is lazy!
Somewhat but only if air gets to it. Humidity is very high here and I have hunted in all kinds of weather. I've never had a hunting charge not fire. My BIL however has had numerous ones with both sidelocks and inlines. If you need four extra days of hunting to get a venison steak you don't need to be hunting period. Actually I am kind of lazy when processing. I use a knife with a guthook for skinning but I use a homemade knife for the butchering. I wish I could afford a flint knife. Those are the very best.
Pathfinder45
New member
Here in Western Oregon, for Deer and Elk, the limit is one unless you are successful in drawing a controlled hunt tag. But then the question we have to answer is whether we want to bow-hunt, muzzle-loader hunt, or hunt the general rifle season. Choose one, and only one. So a muzzle loader here simply gives you a different season, that if selected, will exclude you from the regular season. Of course, you can bow hunt for Elk and muzzle-load for Deer, etc. Way too many restrictive rules with ever-increasing tag prices, if you ask me. But at least we don't have to wear hunter-orange, and we can hunt on Sundays. In our Muzzle-loader season, the propellant must be loose powder, not pellets; open, exposed ignition without centerfire primers; projectiles must be patched round balls or conical non jacketed bullets with a length that does not exceed twice the diameter, but no sabots or plastic tipped bullets..... and no scopes unless you have a special permit for certified visual impairment that meets a fairly stringent standard. I would rather hunt, but it is certainly far less restrictive to watch football and get drunk. I think that's why license and tag sales have reached such lows lately.
Blindstitch
New member
Pathfinder that sounds really restrictive. If it were for one animal I wouldn't need a muzzleloader but still want one. At this current moment I have 2 tags for Michigan and 4 tags in Wisconsin. Both groups of tags can be used at anytime between October 1st and the end of the year for Michigan and September 17th to January 8th for Wisconsin so long as the right tool is used in the right season. But we do have to wear orange during gun seasons.
There aren't any real restrictions besides muzzleloaders have to be 50 caliber or larger and I think there's a 3 day doe only season sandwiched in there the first week of December.
There aren't any real restrictions besides muzzleloaders have to be 50 caliber or larger and I think there's a 3 day doe only season sandwiched in there the first week of December.
Sure Shot Mc Gee
New member
[QUOTE Dufus said: Alliant's BMZ and Blue MZ are not corrosive.QUOTE]
I disagree.
As read. "A little less corrosive" is Alliant's answer to their ML powders barrel corroding ability. To say not-corrosive kind'a reminds me of a typical Hillary's reply.
I disagree.
As read. "A little less corrosive" is Alliant's answer to their ML powders barrel corroding ability. To say not-corrosive kind'a reminds me of a typical Hillary's reply.
Pardon my ignorance but I'd never heard of Bob Ruark, interesting read on Wikipedia. According to the article he grew up in Wilmington North Carolina which is New Hanover county. New Hanover is about about 4 hours east and then another hour south from me, its quite a ways off. I'm in what's considered central NC according to www.ncwildlife.org.
There are a ton of deer here, I think the tag limit last year was 6 or 7, two of which were bucks. Your also allowed 1 or 2 turkeys (I think its 1) and a bear with the appropriate tag purchase. I see hordes of deer standing on the side of my road on the way to work. Seems like everyone winds up hitting one at one point or another.
I decided to order a CVA Optima V2 in stainless with the camo stock and fiber optic sights. All said and done it came to $268 with shipping. I could have gotten the same thing minus the camo for about 40 bucks less, but most of my guns are black and I wanted something different. Besides that the stainless with camo just looks great and I felt like treating myself, if I'd have bought the black stock I would have kicked myself time and time again in the long run.
I'm also talking to a guy about buying a CVA 50 cal
Says he'll take 100 buck for it. Says there is no rust, works fine and bought it in the 80's.
Cheapshooter
New member
I wouldn't say lazy. Just caught up in modern, high tech. Which to me negates the whole purpose of a "muzzleoader" or "black powder" season. To those who use the in-line, closed ignition, sabot wrapped jacketed bullet firing, pellet charged, scope mounted super rifles it's just another opportunity to fill a tag.
My state recognised that, and replaced the muzzle loader season with "alternative method" which added modern, centerfire handhuns. Now, if I just want to fill a tag, I use my T/C Contender with a scoped barrel in either 7-30 Waters, or 35 Remington, or my 10MM Glock 20. If I want to challenge myself, I break out my T/C New Englander, some real FFG Black powder, #11 caps, and patched pure lead round balls.
Unlike many of the "gotta fill my tag" types that would not buy a muzzle loader tag if they had to be restricted to the real thing, I have let many deer pass if they are out of my 100 yard comfort range. But have also harvested a few that were within that distance.
Congratulations on your new rifle . I think you made a good choice and like you said you will soon forget about 40 dollars if you got what you wanted .
If you are going to use Black Horn 209 they make a special breech plug for that gun and powder .
There is a good gun store in NC Ed's Gun Shop and Carlos knows his stuff . He could put you on a good bullet , sabot and load for your rifle .
That is a good price on that CVA Hawken . Even if you don't use it , it would look nice on the wall . Just check inside the barrel for pitting with a light and if the guy is familiar with removing the barrel and nipple get him to show you and you can see if there is any rust underneath .
If you are going to use Black Horn 209 they make a special breech plug for that gun and powder .
There is a good gun store in NC Ed's Gun Shop and Carlos knows his stuff . He could put you on a good bullet , sabot and load for your rifle .
That is a good price on that CVA Hawken . Even if you don't use it , it would look nice on the wall . Just check inside the barrel for pitting with a light and if the guy is familiar with removing the barrel and nipple get him to show you and you can see if there is any rust underneath .