Buckshot vs. Birdshot for home defense
- Thread starter Helwan
- Start date
Check out this link it well help you. http://theboxotruth.com/docs/bot3.htm
Dave Haven
New member
Yeah, I thought bird shot would be good until I checked out "box of truth".
I stand humbly corrected.
I stand humbly corrected.
campbellcj
New member
FWIW I got the Federal LE 00 2-3/4" from Ammoman.com a while back.
Number 4 Buck has a more even pattern and it does more damage so the target bleeds out faster. I have heard it referred to as hitting your target with twenty-one... 22LR's at the same time!
Of course this depends on the length of cartidge. It could be even more.
Up close, 10 or 15 feet, little difference... then, on out to 30 yards the even pattern ensures a more consistant hit.
I prefer lethality for my target, (He can't shoot back) as opposed to wounding, and bleeding out is second fastest... next to a CNS hit.
Of course this depends on the length of cartidge. It could be even more.
Up close, 10 or 15 feet, little difference... then, on out to 30 yards the even pattern ensures a more consistant hit.
I prefer lethality for my target, (He can't shoot back) as opposed to wounding, and bleeding out is second fastest... next to a CNS hit.
XavierBreath
New member
I think the argument of Bird vs Buck is missing the point.
A shotgun is an effective weapon, but is not a guarantee that a threat will be neutralized with one shot. The ability to provide rapid follow-up shots is essential, especially when home invasions are almost always two or more perpetrators.
For that reason I prefer 2&3/4 low recoil 00 Buck. At distances under 20 feet, as would be the normal home/self defense situation, magnum loads are just not needed.
A shotgun is an effective weapon, but is not a guarantee that a threat will be neutralized with one shot. The ability to provide rapid follow-up shots is essential, especially when home invasions are almost always two or more perpetrators.
For that reason I prefer 2&3/4 low recoil 00 Buck. At distances under 20 feet, as would be the normal home/self defense situation, magnum loads are just not needed.
Harley Quinn
Moderator
Box of truth misleading
Well I am going to wade in on this one.
I will say from personal experience Bird shot is brutal. We are not talking dry wall boards we are talking skin and flesh. If in your home and shooting a shotgun it is devastating. Granted for the all around task, buckshot is very hard to beat, so it is the preferred for police work etc.
Lets take the average room in a house and shoot at something. Problem is the house will need to be fixed so...
Lets do this, take a 3lb plastic large mouth container like the ones that have protein Whey in them. Or get a watermelon. The thing is you can put a few pieces of wood in the container to resemble bone material, a few tennis balls to resemble organs, along with water and jello. The idea is to have some strength on the outside so it will be like a leather jacket or ????...
Let it sit for some time to let the jello jell (refrigerate is better). Then put it at about the distance of 15/20 feet or so and shoot it with #8s. Granted 20 feet is quite a far distance if you want to think about the average room in a house, but it will give you the idea.
At 5 feet it eats holes as big as your fist through 1 3/8 solid core doors. A simple drywall wall is destroyed. Some of it flys back at you so beware. Better stand behind a piece of 3/4 ply or thicker and have two small holes in it one for the barrel and the other for your vision (safety glasses on and ear muffs)...
If it does that to doors and walls where do you think all the flesh and bone goes?
Penetration is fine on car side windows, they just dematerialize. Get realistic and try the test I have said. You will be very surprised.
When going into the brush after live dangerous softskined animals #4 or #6s was the preferred for some of the big game hunters. The distance can be as close as 5 or 8 feet and it is so brutal in that circumstance, the ones who were in the know picked small shot to buck shot. But under those conditions bird shot is not as effective, but neither is a slug. This is my experienced opinion.
Harley
Well I am going to wade in on this one.
I will say from personal experience Bird shot is brutal. We are not talking dry wall boards we are talking skin and flesh. If in your home and shooting a shotgun it is devastating. Granted for the all around task, buckshot is very hard to beat, so it is the preferred for police work etc.
Lets take the average room in a house and shoot at something. Problem is the house will need to be fixed so...
Lets do this, take a 3lb plastic large mouth container like the ones that have protein Whey in them. Or get a watermelon. The thing is you can put a few pieces of wood in the container to resemble bone material, a few tennis balls to resemble organs, along with water and jello. The idea is to have some strength on the outside so it will be like a leather jacket or ????...
Let it sit for some time to let the jello jell (refrigerate is better). Then put it at about the distance of 15/20 feet or so and shoot it with #8s. Granted 20 feet is quite a far distance if you want to think about the average room in a house, but it will give you the idea.
At 5 feet it eats holes as big as your fist through 1 3/8 solid core doors. A simple drywall wall is destroyed. Some of it flys back at you so beware. Better stand behind a piece of 3/4 ply or thicker and have two small holes in it one for the barrel and the other for your vision (safety glasses on and ear muffs)...
If it does that to doors and walls where do you think all the flesh and bone goes?
Penetration is fine on car side windows, they just dematerialize. Get realistic and try the test I have said. You will be very surprised.
When going into the brush after live dangerous softskined animals #4 or #6s was the preferred for some of the big game hunters. The distance can be as close as 5 or 8 feet and it is so brutal in that circumstance, the ones who were in the know picked small shot to buck shot. But under those conditions bird shot is not as effective, but neither is a slug. This is my experienced opinion.
Harley
Well
I don't know exactly how Turkey Mag #4 fits into everyone's view points....?
As for myself and the short distances of my home's rooms and hallways.....Well, I will continue to use it and feel very well protected if need be to pull the trigger on some misguided home invader...
and a full (turkey) choke should keep the group tight. Someone stop me if I am too sure of my equipment and components?
I don't know exactly how Turkey Mag #4 fits into everyone's view points....?
As for myself and the short distances of my home's rooms and hallways.....Well, I will continue to use it and feel very well protected if need be to pull the trigger on some misguided home invader...
and a full (turkey) choke should keep the group tight. Someone stop me if I am too sure of my equipment and components?
Lesson Well Learned
Many, many moons ago I took a hunter safety course. The instructor used visiual aids to help make his points.
He had taken his Remington 870 field gun to a range. It had a modified choke. He also took some #8 dove loads. He then shot at sheets of paper at various distances. He started at 30 yards and continued to twenty feet. At the longer distances it was clear that the small bird shot would unlikely be fatal except to maybe an eyeball. At short distances, the target had one large hole in it. The bird shot acted like a large projectile.
Shots at in house intruders is measured in feet, not yards. Anything coming out of a 12 gauge will be most unpleasent to anyone hit at those distances.
At very short ranges, a shotgun is a very wicked weapon.
Many, many moons ago I took a hunter safety course. The instructor used visiual aids to help make his points.
He had taken his Remington 870 field gun to a range. It had a modified choke. He also took some #8 dove loads. He then shot at sheets of paper at various distances. He started at 30 yards and continued to twenty feet. At the longer distances it was clear that the small bird shot would unlikely be fatal except to maybe an eyeball. At short distances, the target had one large hole in it. The bird shot acted like a large projectile.
Shots at in house intruders is measured in feet, not yards. Anything coming out of a 12 gauge will be most unpleasent to anyone hit at those distances.
At very short ranges, a shotgun is a very wicked weapon.
It's your own responsibility for your own protection. People are not paper. You must decide what you would bet your life on.
After taking care of gunshot wounds for over a decade I will take #1 buck. A couple of years ago I cared for a gentleman who's duck dog stepped on the trigger of his loaded shotgun. He took a 3 inch magnum load of duck shot at point blank range. He was functional for some time before the blood loss ultimately incapacitated him. He survived the wound with some disability.
Charles
After taking care of gunshot wounds for over a decade I will take #1 buck. A couple of years ago I cared for a gentleman who's duck dog stepped on the trigger of his loaded shotgun. He took a 3 inch magnum load of duck shot at point blank range. He was functional for some time before the blood loss ultimately incapacitated him. He survived the wound with some disability.
Charles
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Lycanthrope
New member
The local Wal Mart is selling Valu-packs of Remington Buckshot.
It was marked $3.24 per 15 rounds, but rang up $6.27 per 15. I got the first price.
It was marked $3.24 per 15 rounds, but rang up $6.27 per 15. I got the first price.
RE bird/buck
My h/d mossberg 590 is loaded with 8 shells of #4 buck. . . winchester superX 27 pellet #4 buck iirc. That said, i have 5 ranger HP slugs in the stock shell carrier. i would never trust my life or anyone elses to anything less then #4 buick or low recoil 00. . .never.
My h/d mossberg 590 is loaded with 8 shells of #4 buck. . . winchester superX 27 pellet #4 buck iirc. That said, i have 5 ranger HP slugs in the stock shell carrier. i would never trust my life or anyone elses to anything less then #4 buick or low recoil 00. . .never.
Correction
I admit that buckshot is better then birdshot for defense. But birdshot is better then nothing, and far superior to most small caliber handguns. If you were out bird hunting, and someone approached you to do some harm, a round or two from your gun will more than likely discourage the dude from hurting you.
Charles,
You have to admit that birdshot wounds are pretty ugly.
I admit that buckshot is better then birdshot for defense. But birdshot is better then nothing, and far superior to most small caliber handguns. If you were out bird hunting, and someone approached you to do some harm, a round or two from your gun will more than likely discourage the dude from hurting you.
Charles,
You have to admit that birdshot wounds are pretty ugly.
Harley Quinn
Moderator
Don't take sides just think logically
I will stand by my post. Others can stand by theirs. While others who have an inquiring mind might put some math together and figure out the real situation. No more on this topic. We need some fresh air.
Harley
I will stand by my post. Others can stand by theirs. While others who have an inquiring mind might put some math together and figure out the real situation. No more on this topic. We need some fresh air.
Harley