Bought a copy of Braveheart

Here's a question for anyone who can answer, What clan did Blackbeard or Edward Teach come from?......Im not real sure that Edward Teach has definitely been associated with the villian Blackbeard. Now he appeared in the islands south of fla, after the Jacobite rebellion.. He was reported to be of "bristol fashion"--which refers to his sailing not his dress.....Does anyone have an opinion?, I tried some research awhile back and came up empty, and always thought that an enterprising person could research through edinburgh and perhaps pick up a clue....now the pirate did name his ship the "queen anne's revenge", the timing of his appearance after the latter rebellion led me to believe that he was possibly from that area.........I had way to much free time on my hands back then.....
on the maternal side I come from a sept of the Clan Mackinnon, which are a branch of the Clan Alpin...and according to what Ive read they were a riotous bunch and were considered quite troublesome apparently....
"audentes fortuna juvat"---they must have been to daring cause they lost it all cept some of their lives...fubsy.
 
fusby, yeah, kind of like me and my glocks, "MaryAnn" and "Ginger"! (G29 and G30, respectively; G27 is "Jeannie", as in I Dream Of). The Sharps could have been "Olive Oil" as she was long and thin - he did sleep with it.

Actually, he fell for Laura San Giacomo's character, crazy Mary or whatever her name was - yowsa - she's hot too. I think now she's on the TV show "Just Shoot Me".
 
maryann and ginger?
do you also have a mainbattle rifle named skipper, and a hi-precision sniper rifle called professor, and one that has flyers and jams and generally just messes up, probably a carbine called gilligan, and dont for get the matched howell quad 50, and the amphibious landing craft call the minnow....lol......geat names...fubsy.
 
Historical innaccuracies aside (by the 1300's, even the Scots would have had some plate armor...not just boiled leather), Braveheart is a great movie (my favorite), very moving... especially for one who is of Scottish descent.
( If ya notice, my signature is from Wallace's speech at the battle of Stirling. The Latin is the motto of Clan Fraser "I am ready" ). I am from Clan MacPherson a sub-clan of Clan Chattan. Good to see some other Scotties on here! :)

The battle of Drumossie Moor (Culloden to you English types) was not even a battle, but a slaughter. Many of my ancestors lie under that field, and Scots have long memories. This isn't meant to flame anyone, but the English did go too far. As someone has already mentioned, Tartans were outlawed as well as Gaelic, and no Highlanders could carry weapons, even to hunt. After the battle the English went through the land raping and pillaging Highland farms to further de-moralize them. Many Highland Scots fled their homeland and immigrated to America to start over and to escape the British tyranny. "Scottishness" is just now starting to recover, and people are once again proud of their heritage, and are beginning to learn Gaelic again.

Regarding the statement made that tartans have only been around since the 19th century, and that they aren't what Highlanders really wore: That's only partially accurate. Kilts have been around in Scotland for centuries, maybe even a millenia or so. BUT, not in their present form. They used to be a large piece of cloth about 15' long, that the man put on himself by laying down on the ground and kindof rolling himself up in it. This was the belted plaid. Kilts as we know them didn't become popular until much later, when the "fad" was revived in the late 1800's. Even so, in the time of the belted plaid, many men simply wore long shirts gathered and tied between their legs. When going into battle, off would come the plaid: they would fight in their shirt tails.

The colors of the belted plaids were probably more earth tones (perfect for stalking a stag in the heather), and it isn't really known if Scots of old wore clan colors. But the bright colors of today's tartans continues the ancient Celtic tradition and love for bright colors. Even if my Clans' tartan is only a couple hundred years old, I am proud of it, and would wear it. (yes even women wore kilts/skirts made from plaids, just much longer than the mens'). ;)


------------------
"...What will you do without freedom? Will you fight?... Fight, and you may die, run and you'll live, at least a while. And dying, many years from now, would you be willing to trade all the days from this day to that, for just one chance, to tell our enemies, that they may take our lives, but they'll never take our FREEDOM!!!"
-------------------------
je suis prest
 
Um, Darthmaum, the bottom thingy is French. Je suis = I am from the verb etre: to be
prest = ready. Though the French spelling of that is pret with a ^ over the e.

My mother is Scots, MacMurdo. is there anyway I can trace my clan? I've been trying with little luck.
 
Joegerardi,

Thanks for the info. We already knew it was French. Why a Scottish clan chose a French motto is beyond me. Maybe we'll have to ask 'em.

ADDENDUM: Just reread my wife's post. I see "Latin" in there. D'OH!!!

There are plenty of genealogy sites on the Web, just do a search. You can also go to www.gaelic.net - they might have some links or something to help you out. They also have an affiliation with Amazon.com who might be able to help you find some books for researching your history.

------------------
"Is fhe'arr teicheadh math na droch fhuireach"
-Sarabian Oomodo

If it isn't Scottish, it's CRAP!

A firearm isn't a weapon until it is used as such.

[This message has been edited by Jedi Oomodo (edited August 17, 1999).]

[This message has been edited by Jedi Oomodo (edited August 17, 1999).]
 
If in saving private Ryan the attack was by land, people wore the wrong uniforms, fought with tactics that weren't used at the time everyone would complain.
Just because Braveheart is set ages ago is no excuse. They used the historical aspect to promote the film and never made it clear that it is on very loosely based on a historical character. I bet 80% of the people who watched it believed it was all fact.
As for Culloden, the English were just defeating an invading force. They through out their Catholic king because they didn't want him - it wasthe will of the people who were by a huge majority protestant.
The Scottish culture promoted these days is nothing more than a "gift shop" culture. It's mainly show to sell stuff and make people feel good.
 
Thanks for the correction, Joe!
I guess I had some mental flatulence when I wrote that :). I'd been reading a book about King Arthur that had a bunch of Latin phrases I was struggling to understand yesterday. Guess I just transposed my thoughts into my post. I hate it when that happens.

But, Clan Fraser is descended from Normans, so I should ha' remembered the French thingy...I need a new brain... :(

------------------
"...What will you do without freedom? Will you fight?... Fight, and you may die, run and you'll live, at least a while. And dying, many years from now, would you be willing to trade all the days from this day to that, for just one chance, to tell our enemies, that they may take our lives, but they'll never take our FREEDOM!!!"
-------------------------
je suis prest
 
Rabbit,

I agree with you totally on the point that they (producers of BH) didn't make it clear that their film was very loosely based on the real W.Wallace. And, sheople being sheople, most of them won't bother to go and investigate the accuracy for themselves, but take what they saw in the movie as written in stone. I knew, from my research, going into the movie, that it was very loosely based on William Wallace's life. FWIW, I also remember when reading the "write-up" of the movie in the local paper, the critic stated that very thing (loosely based...).

I also agree with you that much of what we see today as "Scottish culture" is geared toward the cheesy tourist thing. But, there is a national revival in true Scottish culture/pride going on over there that has nothing to do with tourism. Many people are learning to speak their native language again.

Being Scottish, to me, is so much more than what clan you're from, what tartan you claim, where your ancestor's land was, who won the '45...etc etc. It's everything Scottish: from the ancient Celts who ran sreaming down the hillside butt naked, with woad on their faces and their hair limed into stiff spikes. It's the troubled history of a people and their enduring spirit;It's the lochs, the glens, the burns, the heather, the mountains... (cue Braveheart theme) ;).

Despite all the tourist shops lining city streets in places like Edinburgh and Inverness, you can still experience the "Scots thing." I hope that someday I can go to Scotland and see that for myself. I would not be one to frequent those tourist trap shops, but would travel the Highlands and experience the LAND, which is beautiful.

One last note: how could England have been "defeating an invading force", when the battle of Culloden took place in extreme north Scotland (near Inverness)? The Jacobites never made it down to England to invade! I guess it all depends on your point of view. I, in my IMHO, consider the English to be the invaders, not the other way around.

England has always considered Scotland "her" property, whether the Scots wanted it or no. That's what gets me: The English attitude that they were better than everyone else; anyone w/ a different culture to them was considered barbaric. But, I digress, as this could easily open another can of worms. (I didn't say that to offend anyone, and am not necessarily speaking of English people of today. I'm referring specifically to their past "exploits" in Scotland ).

------------------
"...What will you do without freedom? Will you fight?... Fight, and you may die, run and you'll live, at least a while. And dying, many years from now, would you be willing to trade all the days from this day to that, for just one chance, to tell our enemies, that they may take our lives, but they'll never take our FREEDOM!!!"
-------------------------
je suis prest



[This message has been edited by Darthmaum (edited August 17, 1999).]
 
Many of the Clan mottos are in French. The clan Wemyss motto is "Je pense" which means "I think" (a statement, not a question :))

The use of French in the clan motto has several origins. One being that French was the universal language just like English is today. The other is that in an effort to really tick off the Lymies, France confered citizenship on all Scots and Scotland confered citizenship on all French.

The King of France was so taken by Wallace that he offered Wallace a governorship of a French province, but Wallace wouldn't leave Scotland.

*****now for the research question*****

One place to do research is www.scottishtartans.org It is the only Tartan museum outside of Scotland and is affiliated with the main museum in Scotland.



------------------
"God grants liberty only to those who love it and are always ready to guard and defend it." --Daniel Webster
 
Yes the English were mongrels 500 years ago, e.g Henry V killing all french prisoners before a battle.
But so was the USA, at least the Scotland exists many Native American ones were totally wiped out. I don't need to say much about slavery either. So stop this selective critcising of the English, I could quote you hundreds of incidents of Scottish barbarity if needed. EVERY nation more than a couple of hundred years ago would conquer someone else if they could. The English just happened to be better at it than most. Of course they thought they were superior, who didn't think that then?
This attitude about the English perpetuated by everyone that defeated them is racist. It is not based on fact. If someone thinks a country wasless barabaric than another prove it.
Reminds me of the anti-gun lobby. Selectively quoting facts.
 
As long as we're discussing Braveheart, IMO Patrick McGooghan stole the show out from under ol' Mel. Especially when he said, "Send in the Irish, arrows cost money." What a great villain! Also, his treatment of his son's "Minister of War" was right on.

------------------
Remember: When you attempt to rationalize two inconsistent positions, you risk drowning as your own sewage backs up... Yankee Doodle
 
Just chunked him out the window without warning! LOL.

The crazy Irish guy killed me too: "God tells me I'm gonna live through this one, but he's pretty sure - you're f***ed".

Also, at the first "battle" scene after the English guy killed his wife and they offed all the soldiers installed in their town, ol' boy redhead's dad took an arrow, then afterwards they held him down to cauterize the wound with a hot iron ("Here, you do it; I'll hold him doon"), and when they let him go, he came out a swingin' and punched the one ol' boy. Funny stuff.
 
Edward II was eventually deposed by nobles who didn't want "his kind" on the throne. Of course, the queen and her lover helped propetuate the matter.

Funniest line from the movie comes from when they were discussing the spears.

Hamish: How big will they be.

Wallace: As big as a man.

Hamish: Some men are bigger than others.

Hamish's father: I see your mother has been talking about me again.
 
Rabbit,

Retract your claws (or bunny teeth)! I do not believe that the English were/are the only people in history to abuse a people they "conquer." I did not intend to imply that. Just when I start talking about Scottish history, and what was done to them by the British, I tend to get pretty riled up.

I understand that what happened was pretty much war (it doesn't make it right, no matter who's doing the oppressing). It's gone on all through history (Egyptians enslaving Isrealites, Babylon enslaving Isreal and Judah, Roman subjugating practically the entire known world, so on and so forth...). I realize that Scots, who had come over to America, were some of the very people who owned slaves, and forced the Native Americans from their land. I am certainly not vindicating those deeds or those who part in them...

On to less controversial things, one of my favorite scenes is when Wallace and Hamish duel it oot with the rocks.. "you drroopped yourr rrock" gets me rolling everytime! I also love the battle where the Irish are on the frontline, running toward the Scots: When they meet in the field, they all start gripping one another's arms (in the age-old Celtic welcome of brothers) and talking on the battlefield, as if it's a family reunion. That's great!

------------------
"...What will you do without freedom? Will you fight?... Fight, and you may die, run and you'll live, at least a while. And dying, many years from now, would you be willing to trade all the days from this day to that, for just one chance, to tell our enemies, that they may take our lives, but they'll never take our FREEDOM!!!"
-------------------------
je suis prest
 
Some one questioned about Blackbeard...
Yes, Teach and Blackbeard are one in the same. He died off the coast of South Carolina - beheaded. And from what I remember - he was not Scott, but English to the bone. Visited a Blackbeard Museum in SC several years ago, near Charlston i think it was...

------------------
"But I don't want to go among mad people," Alice remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Cat: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "or you wouldn't have come here."

RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE
The Critic formerly known as Kodiac
 
As to the revival of Scottish pride, I've been told that my ancestors were Welsh, Scots, Cherokee, and Spaniards. I don't really care though, because I am an American first, second, and last. I still believe in Teddy Roosevelts statement that there is no room for hyphenated Americans in this country.

------------------
Arizona Morgan, The Official Armchair Warrior
 
Talking about wounds, just reading about the battle at Culloden, apparently one Scott has his hand cut off and runs into Culloden house and sticks his arm in the fire to stop the bleeding, now that hurts.
As for heritage I've got 2 lots of McDonalds and also McPherson ancestors from Scotland, the other are Irish and English. I'm interested in the culture and history of all three. I'm simply Australian, not anglo Australian, Irish Australian or Scottish Australian.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top