Best Home Defense Shotty?

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I have this set up in my bedroom. Here in Canada we are not allowed to store any firearm in a loaded condition. This is a 870 wingmaster with an NEA short barrel. The action is buttery smooth and reliable, more than I can say for a 870 Tac Express model I had.

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mississaugagunnut said:
Here in Canada we are not allowed to store any firearm in a loaded condition.
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That sucks. I'd think that would pretty much negate the usefulness of a standard shotgun for home defense. I'd much rather rely on something with a detachable magazine feed (semi-auto handgun). Then it's only an extra second or so to fully load instead of having to fiddle a handful of shells into the tube, under stress.
 
Our Canadian firearms laws are strictly focused on legitimate gun owners and do little to stop the illegal possession and use of firearms.
We are not legally allowed to own a firearm strictly for the purpose of self defense. Hence, our storage laws make it very difficult to use a gun, that is legally stored, for such a purpose.
In Canada, all pistols and some scary black rifles are restricted. As such they must me stored in a "safe", unloaded. If not stored in a "safe", then they must be trigger locked and stored in a lockable container, unloaded.
The only manner in which a pistol could be stored as a home defense firearm would be to place it in one of those small quick access gun safes, with a loaded magazine beside it.
I felt that the shotgun would suit my purposes better.
 
Dang. That's worse than I could've imagined. If I ever turn to a life of crime, I know what country I'm moving to... :-(
 
Semi auto shotgun for $500? Mossberg 930 Home Security. Might have to tweak it a bit for it to run right.

Oh and lets not call them shotties. K? Thanks!
 
The only semi-auto I'd trust would be a Benelli M4 and certainly nothing under $500.

Some have mentioned the Saiga is an option. I have a highly modified short-barreled one with a 12 inch barrel, but it's a range-toy. I hate the factory set up and it needs some $$$ to turn it into a fighting shotgun, but that's just my opinion.

You can get a quality Mossberg (I prefer the 590A1) or Remington 870 for under $600 NIB or shot around and get a used one for under $500. Either or, you're never going to wear them out.
 
Some have mentioned the Saiga is an option. I have a highly modified short-barreled one with a 12 inch barrel, but it's a range-toy. I hate the factory set up and it needs some $$$ to turn it into a fighting shotgun, but that's just my opinion.
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I discovered the Vepr-12 Molot. It seems to basically be what everyone wants to mod their Saiga into. The gun the Saiga should've been before it gets converted and "sporterized" losing some of the most desirable features such as the pistol grip and folding stock capability.
The VEPR look sweet, apparently are very reliable, but expect to pay around $1500 for one.
http://www.molot.biz/product-e/molot205.php
 
I discovered the Vepr-12 Molot. It seems to basically be what everyone wants to mod their Saiga into. The gun the Saiga should've been before it gets converted and "sporterized" losing some of the most desirable features such as the pistol grip and folding stock capability.
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That's pretty cool and seems to be what everyone typically drops $400 to turn their Saiga into. I've always been surprised that nobody has started mass-producing a "tactical" version of it by importing a stripped one and adding all that stuff to it from the begining to bring the price down.

But I just still can't get passed the goofy looking long barrel of the standard one. That gun is made to be an SBS.
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I was looking at the Kel-Tec KSG for a home defense shotgun, but the price is still above a Grand from most areas.

I would like to have a 12ga semi-auto shotgun for under $500, but I have no experience with them so I don't know what's most reliable. In fact the only shotgun I have experience with is the 870 Remy. I'd like to have the shortest legally available but with a shoulder stock, with the highest mag capacity, and a red-dot sight and iron sights for back up. Any suggestions?
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You might want to do more research on the KSG if that is really what you want. Seems like a neat idea, but not so convinced about it's execution. Here's a review you might take a look at:

http://www.thebangswitch.com/trying-to-appreciate-the-kel-tec-ksg/

My Beretta 1201FP has been flawless as my choice for a HD shotgun over the last 20 years. Of course, I bought it a long time ago, but it was under $700.00. Maybe look for a good used semi-auto shotgun with a proven record of being reliable. This has everything I wanted in a HD shotgun.

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Cz 712 utility - $499.99
Tristar viper g2 $449.99
Mossberg sa-20 $499.99
Tristar raptor $399.99
Howa escort $499.99
Sarsa sp $599.99
Tristar raptor A-tac $419.99
Escort Home defense tactical shotgun $399.99
Bakial Mp 153 $489.99

The remington 870 isn't as great as everyone remembers it to be. New ones are prone to problems from the factory. All those are semi's for around $500. Sure, you may need to use them a bit to find out what they like to feed, but you should have no problems with home defense loads. These prices were all pulled off gander mountain's website. You may be able to find some cheaper.

FWIW, I would rather a semi shotgun that fte's a light load over a pump that turns itself into a club with one. Much easier to slap a charging handle than it is to pound the buttstock of a pump on the ground...
 
I have a very reliable KSG and it has taken the place of my Rem. 870 for HD. Some early KSG's, including mine' had feeding prblems but Keltec identified the problem and corrected it. The KSG design is nothing short of revolutinary in the HD shotgun world and IMO will be tweaked and inproved upon. 15rds of #4 buck is awesome firepower in a HD shotgun and in today's world of home invasions it is comforing to have that many rds for defense without a reload. Keltec now needs to make the KSG in 20ga for lower recoil. The little gun does kick but a brake and a limbsaver slip on but pad tames it nicely.:rolleyes:
 
The Best HD shotgun?

I was going to answer that ost below with forget the Semi Auto and go with a Pump, but the thread was going so good I had to let it run...
Back to my choice, a Pump is mde for some very private reasons of fit function and general reliability.
In any scenario where you might be called to use a Shotgun it'll be a total panic moment, one where you need not be worrying about the safety button, or how to charge the semi=auto action (did you pick up a shell?) and your focus will beupon avoiding being shot or stabbed!
Here, is where the Pumpgun comes best into play! All worries except the safety button placement and condition, will be tken care of by that one wrack of the pumphandle! Now providing the gun was loaded, you are ready to defend your life! a simple mechanical tool that dosen't rely on automatic anythings!
I view the revolver much in the same sense, because you can see and depend upon what mechanical function is going on!
Maybe that was why the allure of the old Colt Single Action hung on for so long? It was totally mechanical and controlable t possibly the WORST moment in your life!
The one instance where the "BEE'S" were buzzing by me and I HAD to shoot, I was sure glad I had a lever action rifle in my hands and that when I pointed for the middle, that;s where it shot! No I didn;t stick around to survey the area, I ranbecause there were 3 others and the one down occupird them so's I could get away, No, Ido not know the outcome. I wish it wou;dn't have happened!
Had it been a Shotgun, I am sure of that outcome but the way it shook down I dunno?
What I am trying to say is "IF" you need it, rely upon something manual that Y O U cycle, feed and pull off! MOST OF ALL PRAY THAT YO WON'T HAVE TO!
 
I just want to point out that semi's and pumps have the same safeties... And the chance of short-stroking and misfeeding/jamming/stovepiping a pump in panic mode is much higher than pulling back 4" on the slide of a semi.

With that being said, I've had the most jams due to a poorly modified shell lifter and binding in the feed tube on a pump (neither of those problems had anything to do with the action really) than any other issue.
 
God I'm old!!! I've got a Lefever A grade Skeet and a Winchester 97 riot...seems like enough... but then no natural predators where I live.

MJ
 
Yes- the Mossy or Remmie. The pumpies.
Use buckshotty.
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LOL-ie!

The remington 870 isn't as great as everyone remembers it to be. New ones are prone to problems from the factory.
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Maybe, Maybe not .....if that worries you at all, there are about a ho-jillion used ones out there and many of them are for sale ...... same with the Mossberg pumps .... and the Ithacas and Stevens and H&R's ...... they all have been shucking shells for generations, and will continue to do for generations more ....

As for "short-stroking" a pump gun...... that sounds like a software problem, as opposed to a hardware problem ....... operator head space and timing, as it were ..... an entirely user level fix, to be sure!
 
I don't have to worry about 870's problems. I drive a pardner pump.

The post I was replying to had made comments about the ease of operation of a pump vs a semi duing panic moments.

If you think about the mechanics of the two, and how they operate, and how you operate and leave them loaded.... The semi wins.

1) single hand use. (if for some reason you lose the ability to use an arm, you can keep putting rounds out with a semi
2) second shot placement - semi's have less felt recoil than pumps. Facts of life
3) ease of use:

Pump- condition 1 - disengage safety - engage target - pump slide to eject and reload - reaquire target - engage target - pump slide to eject and chamber round - reaquire target - engage target

Problems encountered: short stroke-stove pipe shell - attempt to engage - pump slide to eject shell turning weapon so half stuck in shell can fall out hoping round now sitting on slidegate doesn't wander around and jam when you rack slide forward.
Short stroke slide-shell ejects but no second shell is picked up- bring to battery empty chamber on target-attempt to engage-pump slide to rack a round-reaquire target -engage
Short stroke-shell gets stuck on lifter but under bolt - spin gun around and use as club
Soft stroke pump causing shell to not fully disengage from mag tube-slam gun against something to make round fully disengage-slam forearm forward-aquire target-engage

Semi - condition 1 - disengage safety - engage target - engage target - engage target - engage target...

Problems encountered with semi:FTF-rack bolt back-engage target
FTE-rack bolt back-engage target
Round stovepipes-rack bolt back- engage target

Semi's are just easier. They seem more complicated, but really they're not. Some need a bit of attention before hand, but they take a lot of user errors out. If you left your gun in condition 3, you could have a problem with finding the battery release; depending on how you load it. Also, you can (and are supposed to, for some semi's) load a ghost round under thr bolt. If practiced with, this gives you a +2 capacity free. And/or a +1 and easy way to load it from closed bolt/empty chamber.

Pumps have a big standing as home defense guns. They're cheap and they're "whats been done" semi's had a long standing of being finicky with round type, expensive, and largely unknown to general population. Pumps are made out to be some sort of rugged, indestructible thunder sticks that never fail. And, in the right hands, I'm fairly confident they'd run just fine. Semi's are getting more popular and cheaper. More user friendly and widely available. Walmart's selling a 930 spx for $499 with 5+1 (+2 with ghost round) with a breacher muzzle.
 
When I was I kid in the mid sixties and started to waterfowl hunt with my father we had Rem. model 11's, Browning A5's & my first gun a Wards Hercules 410 SXS.Man I loved the wood & blued guns and still have a great affinity towards them as they bring back many great memories of moments afield. I'll never forget the day I opened a hunting magazine in the 60's and saw a Colt advertizment with a guy holding the werdist gun I had ever seen. He was on a farm and the rifle was being suggested by Colt to be the newest thing for hunting & protection.It looked like something out of Star Trek and nothing like I would ever want. Being young I did not pay much attention to the nightly news much,which my father had on every night, but not long after seeing the gun in the magazine one night I noticed during some Vietnam footage that a soldier was carrying that very same rifle. I thought it was ugly and never would I own one or replace one of my beloved wood & blued guns for it. Little did I know that what I was looking at would evolve into one of the most popular shooting platforms of all time and today I own 8 of them in different Calibers and configurations. My point being that the design of the KSG, for the shotgun HD, world is much like the AR15 was to the rifle world at the time. I said the design,which is bullpup,will be tweaked and improved upon and IMO will become the new standard for HD and maybe combat shotgun platforms. I have owned 870's for HD & hunting and they are a time tested reliable shotgun but with the short length and avalible firepower of the KSG I think the design will become standard in time for HD and law enforcment use.
 
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