Bedding my Savage accu-stock

UPDATE - FWIW

Still waiting on Savage to get back with me . I asked if the action is indeed supposed to be floating in the bedding system . I explained that I believe only the front is floating when torqued to 40lbs as they recommend .

I did take the muzzle brake off . The crown looks good to me but with out huge cracks or nicks , I don't think I could really tell if there was a problem . It does not appear to have a bunch of carbon build up But I did not pick at it to see if any thing would come off . I'm afraid to mess with the crown . Right now the rifle is out of the stock and I put a thread protector on the muzzle . Until Savage gets back with me there's not much to do .
 
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Sorry guys I have a virus on my computer . Its the type that sends what I'm doing on my keyboard to the hacker . If I log into any site that needs a password , that gives the hacker the pass word . They got my credit card info that way .

Anyways the only way I know how to load pics is through a website I would need to log into so no pics for now and I have a bunch . I'm having the computer looked at tomorrow . Maybe tomorrow night I can have some up .
 
UPDATE :

Just got off the phone with Savage . They told me the 40# is accurate and the action is floating-ish . Meaning the recoil lug and sides of the receiver are the only things that should be making contact with the bedding system/stock . The action is not intended to bottom out on the spine/bottom of the bedding system . :confused: OK if they say so :confused:

Here's my plan and it should have been the plan from the get go . I will do new load work ups for the new torque . Making sure the action screws are always at the proper torque per Savage . This should take less time and shots then before because I already know What loads are safe to shoot in the rifle . No need to start at the lowest charge anymore .

I'm not going to claim I know anything at this point but I believe 38.5gr loads work well . They don't have the velocity's I want so I'll start there and see if I can find another good node at a higher charge . I did have some good results at times with 40.5gr of IMR-4895 and something close to that with 4064 . Based on that I'm hoping I'll find that second node at a higher velocity .

This testing and load development will take a few trips to the range . First to develop then to confirm . I'm going to try to keep it as controlled as possible so any advice on what you guys do to be sure your not introducing different things that will change performance would help . I would assume the obvious thing would be to only work on one load at a time . same case , same powder , same bullet and all other things that should be the same . Trim length , primer , consistent FL sizing until I nail that load

What else do you guys have for me ? Going on Friday to start testing but don't plan on posting results till completed after second or third range trip .

I'm hoping I just fixed the last thing that may have given me some inconsistency's with my cartridges . I had been sizing my brass a bit short from the shoulder to head and have corrected that . They were constantly short but still short buy 8 to 10 thousandths . Please don't tell me that was my problem the whole time :eek: I say no because of the GMM having the same inconsistency's as my loads , at least thats what I'm telling my self :)

One other thing I have the muzzle brake off right now and a thread protector over the threads . Any thoughts on if I should put it back on for the tests ?
 
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Ok been weighing the 175gr smk . I've done 35 of them and the ES is .5gr with most with in .3gr . Now I would think .5 gr is nothing to worry about when it comes to this testing .

What say you ?
 
I weighed the brass when I first sorted it and it was all with in a few grains . I trim every time so I just assumed they still weigh the same . I'll go check and get back with you .

Just weighed 60 cases that I just finished prepping . ES was 6gr with almost all with in 3gr . Funny part about that is they weigh 20gr less then when I started using them . They were all in the 175gr range and now in the 155gr range This was there 4th FL sizing and trim maybe 3rd sizing and 4th firing .

The funny part is the "DUH" moment I had when I first started weighing them just now . Of coarse they weigh less . I've cut material off them at least 3 times now .:rolleyes: not sure what I was thinking .:)
 
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ES was 6?. so you had some that were off 8 or 9 or so?. That's a lot. I keep my 6MMBR to with in 2 gns, but like you I have not checked them in 5 or 6 loads now. Makes me wonder now. Not sure where you want to go with your accuracy at this point,but I have been staying on top of all your post's and it seem's like you are looking for ultimate accuracy ( good ).

All I can say Metal is- You had one load that was shooting very well in your rifle way back. Take that load and go with it. POI means nothing in the first stage. Look for group size. I believe you had that. Now not to beat a dead horse,but load up 30 or so rounds. Go to range and play with the action screws. Start at what appears to be almost loose. Tighten rear 5 inch lbs and front 5 at a time ( rear 5 higher than front). Keep going in 5 lb increments doing 4 or 5 shot groups. The heck with what Savage tells you. I have 9 and none are set to what Savage say's. It will come together for you, I know it will. When you get there,Just a dab of blue loctite and your good to go. Blue breaks loose real easy but will not come loose by itself. Keep your cheek weld the same,the amount of pull against your shoulder the same and squeeze slow. It's a Savage- It will come together for you.

My Savage 308 seem's to really like 42.3 gns of RL-15 and Serria 175's. I run with the plain jane 2.80 COL. Right in that 2650 FPS range.
I am such a Die Hard Savage fan that it bugs me that it is not shooting one hole for you:eek:
 
ES was 6?. so you had some that were off 8 or 9 or so?.
Click to expand...

Sorry I thought ES means extreme spread and I thought that means the lightest to the heaviest . From the lightest to the heaviest was a 6gr spread and my ave was about 3-ish . I was thinking thats pretty darn good considering they all lost around 20gr and yet they're all still with in a few gr .

Yes I've had some crazy good loads .3 , .4 and a bunch a .5 and .6 moa loads . Problem is I rarely could duplicate them on paper . That always made me think they were not really good loads . The other thing was If I could get one load to shoot well the other "good" ones would shoot like crap . I guess I've been chasing that torque / what ever that had my rifle shooting everything great . I guess your right I need to suck it up and just pick one and go for it .

You know , when I think about it . My rifle was shooting its best when I could shoot 168gr GMM into the same hole . There was a point that I could shoot sub moa with GMM easy . It took very little effort to do so .

What I should do is go get 60 rounds of that and torque my action using GMM and in theory that should get my rifle shooting great again .
 
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4runner, I'm like you; it just bugs me about the savage.

Metal, do you chrono your loads? A chrono can help tell the difference between an accurate group and a lucky group.
 
yep I chrono and I'm going to do what 4runnerman says to do .Just find a load that worked in the past and go for it . I just went back and looked at my notes and found a load that has shot well on more then on occasion . It's also a load that has the velocity I'm looking for with the components I want to shoot . 175gr smk , 40.5gr IMR-4064 with a velocity of 2560 . That load has shot .5 moa once and .75 moa a couple other times . I should add I have notes showing it shoot 1.4 moa a couple times as well . Two of the best groups were before I started looking at the torque issue and the rest were after. One sub moa and a couple over moa . The velocities have been pretty consistent with them staying in the mid 2500 area .

I'm going to load 50 rounds of that load and do the torque thing . Once I get that working I'm going to work up all other loads to that torque .

Well that's the plan anyways ;) Watch I won't be able to get that load to shoot worth a darn but I'll get something else to shoot great that never has before . :rolleyes: :)
 
I know it will come together for you Metal. It's a savage. Keep us posted.

PS- I want to see those pics of one hole:D

The work up other groups I can't say much. I have 9 Savages and I shoot 9 different loads. One load per rifle ( never have to re sight in ). I find the best load for each one and that is the only one I shoot in that rifle. Sounds silly,but works great. I want to bring the BR for Yote hunting this year. There are lots of times I could shoot one at 600 yards plus,but with the 223 I just don't.
 
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You did see the pics you just don't remember

GMM shot count 260
guns188.jpg

GMM shot count 13 , 14 , 15 first shots ever taken at 100yds with rifle
guns167.jpg


This was pretty good for 300yds .33moa My load shot count 700-ish
ky8u.jpg


I was shooting groups like this all the time .5 moa shot count under 100
guns170.jpg

.6moa
guns174.jpg


And the thread that started me on the path Im on now
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=533726
 
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UPDATE-ish

I don't want to get to happy but I did have an encouraging day . I started the day out by doing the torque test and for the most part it went as expected . I took 50 rounds of a believed good load to do the test . It took 48 of them to confirm a torque setting . I went thru the torque spectrum pretty quick . 15 thru 50lbs in 5lb increments shooting 4 shot groups . Two settings and really three were good , 20lbs .5 moa , 35lbs .85 moa , 45lbs .6 moa. I went back to confirm each were indeed good torque settings . I settled with 45lbs as being the most consistent . I wish I had more rounds to shoot just to be sure .

I then went ahead and shot 3 different load workups I brought as well . One I had done before and the other two were new-ish . I had worked with parts of them before . Different cases and bullets this time . Anyways those all went as one would expect with some loads being better then others .

I guess what the 2 most encouraging things I got from today were . The rifle shot sub moa many times today . Both with the load I already knew should shoot well . As well as the other three load work ups . They all had at least one sub moa group . That in it self would not be all that great but I was not shooting well today A good 1/4 of the groups I was calling bad shots . I had one of my "Can't keep the reticle still days " I get that every once and a while and today was one off them . If I were shooting my best-ish today I think a good 1/4 to 1/3 of the groups today would have been better .

Don't get me wrong , I shot OK it was just hard to do so . Most days I can lock in pretty well ,not so much today . I had to just stop unload step away relax comeback and start over a few times .

The fact I was having trouble and was still able to get the rifle to shoot better then it has in a while was encouraging . I did not shoot one group over 1.6 moa all day . All groups were 4 shots in 2 min or less .

I will add that I shot with out the muzzle brake for the first time . the rifle seemed to shoot fine but I did notice I needed to find the target for the next shot more often then before . To say find the target may be a bit over stated . When I would come back on target after recoil I was looking at the targets on the lane next to me . It was always the lane to the right . I know that means I need to adjust my hold in some way so I come back on target . I'm just not sure what to do to fix it .

In closing It appears all is not lost and I may be dialing this thing back in . ( fingers crossed ) :)
 
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Sounds promising Metal. Now you were 5 inch lbs heavier in the rear than the front and always tightened the rear first?. As for a bad shooting day-- Hey we all have them. Somedays I wonder why I even keep shooting. Now if you were having a bad day--That could have made a big difference. What ya shooting for a scope and what power?. I try do all my load work up at 300 yards, That will give you a better look at whats going on. The reason I ask on scope is---Aim smaller -- Smaller groups. My 300 yard bullseye is a Pencil I put in middle of bullseye and drew a circle around it. Now I run a 8-32 x 56 scope,so 300 yards is easy to put crosshairs in that circle. Don't give up,It will happen.
 
I have a lower end Vortex 6-18x44 . It's pretty good for the price and very clear until 16x then starts to haze . I've always shot at 12x no matter what distance . The 300yd target that's stuck to the plate above is a 3" shoot-n-see . That's what I like to use for my 300yd targets . At 12x I don't have a problem getting my crosshairs on it .

Here's a perspective pic of how big they are , Think can of chew ;)
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guns202.jpg


I do shoot 300yds often but not on load work up . Maybe I'll give it a try
 
Those are nice scope from all I hear. I only do load work at 300 yards for this reason ( a lot of people disagree with me here ). If a bullet is going to go south so to say on you 100 yards will not show you. Example- I have maybe 5 different loads in my 308 that will make one hole at 100 yards,but take them out to 200 or 300 and they fall apart. Only exception is my 223. I do that one at 100 yards because i very seldom shoot it past 200 at Yotes. So much for shooting today, Must be 35 mph wind here today.:(. Maybe do the $20.00 and go to indoor range with the 45 today. I know it will come together for you Metal.
 
Glad your rifle's doing right metal.

4runner, that sounds like a really good practice. 300 yards would help highlight good groups on an accurate cartridge. On my .308 I had no trouble telling which loads did what because the spread went from 4.5" down to 1.5" and back out. My 6.5 seemed to like everything with only a minor spread in group but a steady rise in poi. How do you handle wind changes? Even a 5 mph wind straight across could move your bullet 3", how do you adjust for it?
 
Semi-- Good question,because my main issue I have is doping wind. I am fortunate enough that where I am I get to range about 5 AM. Most days I can hold my Bic lighter up and light it with out the wind blowing it out. I also put out wind flags. For my testing I never shoot on windy days. Once I have found a load then I shoot no matter what,rain,wind,snow. I have so much to learn about doping the wind:eek:. I am also lucky enough to shoot with some very awesome people. I listen, I implement what I have learned, Oh Hell I will just say it--I am OCD to the max:D. when it comes to shooting..

I shoot with a bunch of Bench rest shooters and F Class, The commander of the Red River Swat Team, 2 police Snipers and the ATF agent for Minn. I am surrounded by knowledge and eager to learn. I know ATF guy, But hey, hey shoots like WOW. I also get a shot now and then to shoot with the old timers.
Old military rifles,open sights and dinosaur ammo. Man those guys get my respect. Rifles look like the termites have already left,but they shoot 3 inch groups at 300 yards with them.
 
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