Backup gun...

Reading some of these drive by responses I can tell than many of you didn't actually read my post and don't understand the idea. Many of you did though and I appreciate the comments, good points to think about.

I'll try and clarify. So whatever your primary gun is, maybe it's your CC gun, your nightstand gun, whatever it is, the gun you have trained with, duplicate that gun and the support equipment for that gun. This does not mean to carry both at the same time, it's a just that, a backup. So for instance, the your primary gun is unusable for whatever reason, you have the entire setup duplicated so that the duplicate can easily transition into the primary.

Some of you are adding some kind of shooting scenario to this, "If ya cain't get'er dun blah blah blah". You've missed the point entirely. This setup would be to simply have so that in the event that your primary gun is unusable you are not at a skills and equipment disadvantage when you replace that gun from your inventory. That is all.
 
I only own 1911s and DA revolvers. I don't have any doubles of exactly the same brand and model but I have multiple 1911s and DA revolvers so the manuals of arms are the same. It keeps things simple when going from my duty gun to off duty, etc.
 
If you're sure you won't be confused in the moment of truth, that's great. Me, I want less things to think about.
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OK, here's the point. It isn't about you and me, and it isn't necessary to re invent the wheel where back up guns are concerned. A primary weapon and a back up snubbie have served many in the real world for many decades.

If carrying a semi-auto as primary and then being forced to transition to the very simple to operate small frame revolver is going to be a tactical complication, then by all means, go with what you consider to be simple.

Good grief, my man, just give it a try. At the range-- try the transistion from one firing system to another and see if it's as complicated as the problem you've created in your head.

Once you've mastered different guns, there isn't anything wrong with utilizing the system you've described. But do it because you prefer it, not because something else is too complicated.:cool:

Lastly, while the snubbie is very simple to operate, there is practice and training required to HIT with it. As Ed Lovette points out in his excellent book "Snubby Revolver: ECQ, Backup and Concealed Carry Standard" you should be a serious threat to an 8" X 11" sized target at 7 yds. I'd suggest ten to twelve yds.

Of course, before you get to that point, you need to be a serious threat with your primary farther away than that.:D

OK, lecture over.;)
 
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Helios?


Ummmm I think everyone gave their version of an answer. You specified a back-up gun. Did you mean to ask if anyone had a similar gun in their collection so if the regular carry gun was at the smith, or in police custody you could transition to the second gun? Having already being used to the other one?...

Whats the difference of why you go to the second gun?

OK so I own two Glock 23
two Styer M40
two S&W Model 10
two S&W Model 36
two S&W 640
two old Baretta .380's
two S&W Model 19's
two S&W Model 64's
two 1911's
two Wather PPk's

So... I guess the answer is "YES"
 
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In any case, the techniques are the same with any hand gun. Breathing, sight picture and trigger control, but you need to adapt to a different handgun. Just like you do when going from an automatic transmission to a standard.
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Good grief, my man, just give it a try. At the range-- try the transistion from one firing system to another and see if it's as complicated as the problem you've created in your head.
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At the range and during a life or death struggle are two different animals. I'd bet my life that failing to properly operate a different manual of arms than your primary firearm, has cost folks their lives in the past.

I watched a jeweler in South Florida almost die because he failed to take the safety off his new Walther PPK (twas different than his other gun). My coworker shot a robber in the calf with his 1911 because he reverted back to the double action trigger pull technique he used with his revolver, a gun he carried for a decade. The short light trigger on his 1911 broke before the gun was level causing a low shot*. On his revolver it would have gone off at level.

Its a valid concern and not some made up problem in OUR heads.

*Thankfully the robber dropped both the loot and the gun and ran like a jack rabbit.
 
I have several different semi autos, and revolvers. In theory one gun would be advantageous, but I do not find the transition between my various guns or types a problem.
So I carry whichever my whim dictates.

Jerry
 
In theory one gun would be advantageous, but I do not find the transition between my various guns or types a problem.
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I'm sure those I listed had the same thoughts prior to their shootouts.
 
At the range and during a life or death struggle are two different animals. I'd bet my life that failing to properly operate a different manual of arms than your primary firearm, has cost folks their lives in the past
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Not nearly as many lives as not knowing the manual of arms for their one and only primary firearm.

Isn't the range the same place you learn to properly deploy your primary gun?

To suggest that the operation of a MORE SIMPLE weapon under stress has cost folks their lives in the past is to suggest that employing one's reserve chute in an emergency costs people their lives. I mean with the rip cord being in a different place and all and the training required to go to reserve chute upon failure of the main.

LOL, a snub nosed manual of arms? Right. Point, pull trigger.:D
 
I don't carry a back up gun, but I carry two different guns, er... I carry one or the other.

My primary carry is a Kimber 1911 .45... when I'm able to conceal it. When it's difficult to hide the 1911, I carry a Colt Gov't .380. My thoughts are... the controls are the same, the grip angle is basically the same and, except for the safety locking the hammer (and thus the slide with the hammer down...) it operates the same.
 
^ I think having the same MOA is important - but I also want to point out that I think it's important to avoid introducing radically different holster arrangements.

I think if you're going to have some kind of retention rig - then you should have the same basic motions that you go through to deploy your BUG as your primary.

My opinion - if you want to see what can happen when you have different model guns in different holster setups - investigate how Tex Grebner shot himself and draw your own conclusions.

The conclusion that I drew from that situation is that when you have different MOA for the guns and different motions to operate the holsters - it can lead to confusion -muscle confusion, mental confusion - whatever - and bad things might happen.
 
I have two Glock 19's a Gen 3 and Gen 4. Both have the same trijicon night sights and use the same magazine, extended slide locks, holsters etc for ease of transition. They both can be easily accessed when needed. The Gen 3 is my primary CCW and Gen 4 is the bug and I rotate shooting them at the range every two weeks. My wife can shoot the Gen 3 very well but prefers the grip reduction of the Gen 4.
 
I personally carry an assortment of guns because my manner of dress changes frequently. The only requirement that I have for my carry guns is that there semis and they have no safeties or levers. For me that is the same battery of arms. I don't see a need in a back up gun maybe an extra mag though.
 
Not nearly as many lives as not knowing the manual of arms for their one and only primary firearm.
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For sure.

Isn't the range the same place you learn to properly deploy your primary gun?
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Yes and it causes little to no pressure while practicing. Certainly not the pressures claim to be felt while involved in a life and death struggle. So actions deemed easy and unproblematic at the range are much more difficult under duress.

To suggest that the operation of a MORE SIMPLE weapon under stress has cost folks their lives in the past is to suggest that employing one's reserve chute in an emergency costs people their lives. I mean with the rip cord being in a different place and all and the training required to go to reserve chute upon failure of the main.

LOL, a snub nosed manual of arms? Right. Point, pull trigger.
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Didn't mean to suggest that. Major differences like external safeties even something as minor as trigger pull lengths can effect the outcome IMO. If the BUG is a grab and pull like a snubby obviously there isn't much other than trigger pull to worry about.
 
I personally carry an assortment of guns because my manner of dress changes frequently. The only requirement that I have for my carry guns is that there semis and they have no safeties or levers. For me that is the same battery of arms. I don't see a need in a back up gun maybe an extra mag though
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I have chosen the same route (except I use a BUG a times) selecting the simplest of platforms (Glock) and using only them as primary and mainly Glock as BUG with a splash of Glock lite guns like the Kahr PM9 and Diamondback 380.

Like you said no levers or safeties to be concerned with. Just pull and shoot. Thus we have eliminated even the remote possibility of forgetting to remove the safety. In this we have also reduced the number of things that can malfunction in our platform. Plus we have eliminated ever accidentally turning the safety on during a shootout.

Make Mr. MURPHY and his law have as difficult a time as possible getting us.
 
Just wondering - how is it that you find places to put: 2 guns, 2 holsters, a cell phone, wallet and your keys....without a purse?:D Seems like an awful lot of stuff to keep track of on a daily basis.

I'm one of those guys that sometimes carries. My cell phone usually stays in my car - hate carrying it around. I'll generally carry my wallet and keys. Add a gun to that, and that's about all I'm capable of keeping track of.
 
I use a FAG bag AKA a fanny pack. The BUG goes in a pocket or mexican carry or the ankle.

My cell phone clips on my pocket. The fanny pack allows me to carry my G30 plus a spare G21 mag and my checkbook, cash, some lip balm, tube of Advil, change, all my credit & other cards, and a crap load of receipts. All clip on and off in 2 seconds with ease.

Plus I can access the gun pretty easily and quickly and DISCRETELY.
 
I just look like a homo while carrying according to my wonderful friends LOL. My wife is okay wih it however. She isn't embarrased to be seen with me.
 
Cargo pants. Eddie Bauer cargoes, today.

M&P45c @ 3:30 in a CompTac Minotaur.

442 in a Mika pocket holster, left front.

Spare .45 mag, along with wallet, left cargo.

SOG SpecElite II and truck keys (keys connected to belt by Simply Rugged keeper) in right front.

iPhone and .38 speed strip in right cargo.

No problem.
 
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Just wondering - how is it that you find places to put: 2 guns, 2 holsters, a cell phone, wallet and your keys....without a purse? Seems like an awful lot of stuff to keep track of on a daily basis.

I'm one of those guys that sometimes carries. My cell phone usually stays in my car - hate carrying it around. I'll generally carry my wallet and keys. Add a gun to that, and that's about all I'm capable of keeping track of.
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I guess I carry two handguns, 44 Spl Bulldog 3" in a left hand paddle holster and a S&W 38 Spl in a pocket holster left pocket. My cell phone and other items on the other side. One thing I learned in CWP training as that I never leave my home armed without my cell phone. My instructor taught us that if you have an incident you need to be the one calling 911, because the victim calls first. So on occasions where I have forgotten the phone I walk back inside and get it before I leave. So my rule is cell phone muse accompany my handguns. I would not need two guns if I carried a SA but I prefer my revolvers. And I have only had one incident where I might have drawn my handgun but did not, instead letting someone else call the police. But when that happened I did call someone who handled the rest of the problem. Later I did get called on to sign a report of the incident as a witness, but the guy bonded out on an assault charge before the day was over. With 3 speedloades for the 44, I am now looking for a pocket holster that holds a strip for 5 rounds of 38Spl but have not found what I want yet.
 
I carry a glock 22 as my primary and a taurus model 85 snubby .38 as my bug. Same rule applies for both weapons; draw, point and shoot. No safeties to worry about, just the target. I may add my. 38 derringer in the winter just to throw in a coat pocket for easier access.
 
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