ATF Project Gunrunner

M. Leake wrote: We all know this is going on. Fox, CBS, and the Huffington Post have provided occasional coverage. But how do we get in-depth coverage of what should be both a major adminstration scandal and a major public concern? Instead, CNN spews the party/DOJ/BATF-E line, and most other media are focused on "Weiner-Gate."
Click to expand...

It seems entirely logical that the reason this has not hit the mainstream public, is that strategically, it makes more sense to gather ALL of the facts and "smoking guns" (pun intended), and release it all much closer to the elections.

From a campaign standpoint, anyway...
 
Don H wrote:

DoJ may wish to consider whether it has an alternate source of funding other than what Congress provides.
---------------------------------------

The gentleman might have a point re DOJ's funding, especially should The Congress see fit to actually do something about the egregious excesses of executive branch powers it sometimes complains of.

I guess that we shall see.
 
it makes more sense to gather ALL of the facts and "smoking guns" (pun intended), and release it all much closer to the elections.
Click to expand...
Another thing to consider: if this extends all the way to the Attorney General (and possibly higher), we'll be making some pretty serious accusations. We've got to be absolutely sure that we've got some pretty serious proof to back it up.

We'll likely see some mid-level management thrown to the wolves if this gets more traction, but getting further up the ladder will require some pretty dire evidence.

And right now, the DoJ controls the flow of evidence.
 
William La Jeunesse has been all over this and the new report released today is not pretty.

There is a video report at the linked page.

SOURCE

House Panel Releases Scathing Report on 'Fast and Furious' Gun Operation, Sure to Anger Mexico

By William Lajeunesse

Published June 14, 2011 | FoxNews.com

Hoping to score a knockout blow against the Mexican cartels, U.S. law enforcement created "Operation Fast and Furious" to stop gun smuggling by allowing the weapons into Mexico, thereby exposing the entire cartel network to prosecution, according to a new congressional report on the U.S. program.

<MORE>
Click to expand...
 
PDF Report released yesterday by Rep Issa and Sen Grassley: http://oversight.house.gov/images/stories/Reports/ATF_Report.pdf

Highlights of the report include:

  • The supervisor of Operation Fast and Furious was “jovial, if not, not giddy but just delighted about” walked guns showing up at crime scenes in Mexico according to an ATF agent. (p. 37)
  • Another ATF agent told the committee about a prediction he made a year ago that “someone was going to die” and that the gunwalking operation would be the subject of a Congressional investigation. (p. 24)
  • The shooting of Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords created a “state of panic” within the group conducting the operation as they initially feared a “walked” gun might have been used. (p. 38)
  • One Operation Fast and Furious Agent: “I cannot see anyone who has one iota of concern for human life being okay with this …” (p. 27)
  • An ATF agent predicted to committee investigators that more deaths will occur as a result of Operation Fast and Furious. (p.39)
  • Multiple agents told the committee that continued assertions by Department of Justice Officials that guns were not knowingly “walked” and that DOJ tried to stop their transport to Mexico are clearly untruthful. (p. 45-50)
 
More Fast and Furious testimony today!

OK, Monday was on the legalities of Congress's request for documents from DoJ. Today is going to be the main show. There will be the members of Brian Terry's family testifyting. Three cooperating ATF agents will testify. And finally, Ronald Welch ("the Agency did not allow guns into Mexico") will follow it all up.
 
Micahweeks said:
Did anyone else see this? That the administration may allowed Operation: Fast and Furious to proceed and fail so they could blame American gun stores and justify gun regulations? I am getting this sinking feeling, and I don't do conspiracy theories. If the report the investigation produces affirms this, what is the recourse of the American people? Is that what Obama meant by "under the radar"?
Click to expand...
I don't think that anyone allowed the operation to fail, at least not in the way that it has. However, I think that the plan all along has been:
1) Find a problem (gunrunning): Check
2) Exacerbate problem (Fast & Furious): Check
3) Make progress in "fixing problem" (massive gun bust, blame FFLs): No check
4) Use the progress as a basis for more regulation and more funding: No check.

Micahweeks, if you haven't done so, go back and read some of the other documents and discussions in this thread. Even the BATFE's own documents indicate that they intended all along to allow guns & other implements of destruction to cross the border and that their own reputation (which is heavily linked to funding, politically) was one of the goals of this operation.
 
It, definitely, will be interesting.

There are many times when I can look at both "sides" of a situation, and whether the spinner or the spinnee is reporting, I can follow the logic and even agree with the argument, to a point.

This is NOT one of those times. Even if Agent Terry, hadn't been killed, this was just a DUMB idea. As if we don't already know where all the drugs are coming from. It had to have been to push an anti-gun agenda. It's the only one that makes sense. I hope the investigation into the investigation finds ALL the guilty ones.
 
hogdogs, watching breitbart talk on cspan 3 right now, the bottom ticker says the hearings start at 10am eastern which is right... now.

edit... yep, it's starting.
edit... 10:08 Eastern, Rep. Issa is giving an intro/overview.

Is Elijah Cummings for real? In his opening remarks (ended 10:18 eastern), he just suggested that nobody knows what happened, and that maybe we need to take a critical look at our gun laws. If anyone is unfortunate enough to live in his Maryland district, maybe it would do some good to call his office and ask him to stop being disingenuous.

Grassley on now. 10:23. "Agents said it was a bad idea, and gun dealers said it was a bad idea... Who thought it was a good idea?"
 
I just spotted this on CNN: http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/06/15/us.fast.and.furious/index.html

(I hope this doesn't count as a drive-by.)

Edited to add a short description: This is the CNN coverage of the hearings that are about to take place, in which the relatives of Brian Terry are expected to testify.

Here are the first two paragraphs, as posted by CNN. No challenge to copyright is intended.
CNN said:
Washington (CNN) -- A controversial strategy by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives to link gun buyers in the United States to Mexican drug cartels will be scrutinized Wednesday at a Congressional hearing.

The House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform wants to pin down who authorized the strategy and who knew about it, Chairman Darrell Issa, R-California, said.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Drive - by rule is usually evoked for an OP. Adding a link that informs an ongoing discussion is legit, IMHO.

A short description of what the link is would be useful. Clip, article, hearing or whatever.

No problem, though.
 
Issa just tore into Welch.

ISSA: "Who authorized this program that got people killed? Do you know who authorized it at the highest level? Yes or no."

WELCH: <hemming and hawing> No.

So either the DoJ is less well managed than a KFC restuarant at 1am or Welch just perjured himself in testimony before Congress. It looks like there may be some good job openings in DoJ soon.

ETA: Rep. Lankford just asked why Welch testified that no firearms were knowingly allowed to go into Mexico. Welch responds by saying (my summary)We said ATF did not knowingly allow straw-purchasers to carry firearms to Mexico. Somebody else carried them to Mexico, so we didn't lie about that...

How is that for a legalistic distinction to make in front of the House Oversight Committee?
 
Last edited:
Welch's response was not an answer to the question that was asked. He was very evasive while professing his "desire" to cooperate with the committee (by handing over black paper). Stayed tuned folks. :mad:
 
Looks like the hearings are finally starting to generate media attention from somebody besides CBS News, the Tuscon Citizen, the Examiner, and Fox.

MSNBC
CBS News
CNN
The Hill
NPR
Fox News
Tuscon Citizen
Wall Street Journal
Houston Chronicle
WaPo runs with an AP newswire on the hearings
Even the New York Times covered it...

Strangely, ABC News has almost nothing on the scandal, though their local affiliate in Arizona covered it.

Some pretty juicy scandal bait was released today... and it looks like it is starting to catch some attention finally.
 
I think the "high ups" should be tried for 1st degree Murder of an federal law enforcement officer! They knew exactly what these guns were being purchased for, where they were going, and what was going to be done with them, and let illegal actions occur to allow the end result.
 
@ Dead: I agree with you, the people in the Federal Government and ATF who allowed this to happen should go to jail. I hope the family of that border patrol officer who was killed SUES THE PANTS off of the ATF. The ATF has shown itself to be a trouble institution as long as I can remember, dating back to the whole Waco Tx and Ruby Ridge things. I hope they eliminate the ATF and divvy up its responsibilities between the FBI & DHS, why do we really need a separate agency just for Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms? Why Can't the FBI or DHS take care of this using less personnel and costing the American tax payer less?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top