Vince Cefalu. BATFE whistleblower, has been fired.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/06/27/atf-to-fire-gunrunner-whistleblower/
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/06/27/atf-to-fire-gunrunner-whistleblower/
ATF Project Gunrunner
- Thread starter Al Norris
- Start date
Fired in a Denny's parking lot, no less. You certainly can't accuse ATF of not being a class act.
http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2012/10/12/atf_whistleblower_fired_in_dennys_parking_lot
Re posts 2659 and 2650 and accompanying news items, dealing with the "termination" of BATFE Whistleblower Vince Cefalu, the following might interest some here.
Yesterday afternoon, on NPR, I heard a segment discussing whistle blowing, the people who engage in this activity both in private industry and in government, government employees blowing the whistle, and what all to often happens with government employees, who blow the whistle on legitimate problems.
They, the whistle blowers often end up being fired, the people responsible for the problems the whistle blowers exposed are often promoted, action against responsible individuals is almost never brought, which is to say that while criminal prosecution of responsible parties is appropriate, it almost never happens, while the person who brought the problem to the attention of "government" is essentially punished, the fact that they might receive a monetary award being beside the point, for they are often renderedeed "unemployable", and might well end up never working in their field again.
The discussion included, as I recall, attorneys from both sides. Seems as if the fate of Mr.Cefalu might go quite some distance in support of the contentions inherent in the segment. Unfortunately, I do not recall which program this segment was part of, it was however broadcast yesterday.
Yesterday afternoon, on NPR, I heard a segment discussing whistle blowing, the people who engage in this activity both in private industry and in government, government employees blowing the whistle, and what all to often happens with government employees, who blow the whistle on legitimate problems.
They, the whistle blowers often end up being fired, the people responsible for the problems the whistle blowers exposed are often promoted, action against responsible individuals is almost never brought, which is to say that while criminal prosecution of responsible parties is appropriate, it almost never happens, while the person who brought the problem to the attention of "government" is essentially punished, the fact that they might receive a monetary award being beside the point, for they are often renderedeed "unemployable", and might well end up never working in their field again.
The discussion included, as I recall, attorneys from both sides. Seems as if the fate of Mr.Cefalu might go quite some distance in support of the contentions inherent in the segment. Unfortunately, I do not recall which program this segment was part of, it was however broadcast yesterday.
A search at http://www.npr.org turned up nothing for yesterday with the word "whistleblower", "whistle-blower", or "whistle blower" in it. The search was narrowed to the last seven days for all programs and all topics.
The only thing which popped up was the following but that was on 10/10/12.
Soldiers Claim Illness After Guarding KBR In Iraq
October 10, 2012 ... oilfield plant was riddled with a well-known toxin but ignored the risk to soldiers while hurrying the project along, firing a whistleblower and covering ... By The Associated Press
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=162671029
The only thing which popped up was the following but that was on 10/10/12.
Soldiers Claim Illness After Guarding KBR In Iraq
October 10, 2012 ... oilfield plant was riddled with a well-known toxin but ignored the risk to soldiers while hurrying the project along, firing a whistleblower and covering ... By The Associated Press
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=162671029
jimpeel :
Sorry to have sent you down a blind alley. Having seen your response, I got curious, I must be getting old and feeble minded, managed to jog my "memory" a bit, finding the following.
Dater of broadcast: 11 October
Show carrying the item: Diane Rehm
There is an audio and I assume text version at the Diane Rehm site. The audio runs a bit over 51 minutes.
The web site includes comments from listeners, which might or might not be of interest.
Once again, my apologies for the misdirection.
Sorry to have sent you down a blind alley. Having seen your response, I got curious, I must be getting old and feeble minded, managed to jog my "memory" a bit, finding the following.
Dater of broadcast: 11 October
Show carrying the item: Diane Rehm
There is an audio and I assume text version at the Diane Rehm site. The audio runs a bit over 51 minutes.
The web site includes comments from listeners, which might or might not be of interest.
Once again, my apologies for the misdirection.
HarrySchell
New member
I know a lady who brought and won an EEO suit against a supervisor for racial/sexual discrimination in a federal agency. The lady was sidelined and isolated, the perp sent to another office and later promoted twice.
This travesty occurred with people dealing security matters and at the managerial level.
The feds, and other major bureaucratic entities, sometimes apparently would rather fail at their supposed mission than accept embarrassment.
No wonder people like Newell survive and get well past their level of incompetence and venality.
This travesty occurred with people dealing security matters and at the managerial level.
The feds, and other major bureaucratic entities, sometimes apparently would rather fail at their supposed mission than accept embarrassment.
No wonder people like Newell survive and get well past their level of incompetence and venality.
Thanks, Alan. Was able to find THIS.
Wow! I thought she got full use of her voice back after she lost it several years back. She sounds like she has had a stroke now.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/style/features/daily/rehm0823.htm
Wow! I thought she got full use of her voice back after she lost it several years back. She sounds like she has had a stroke now.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/style/features/daily/rehm0823.htm
jimpel:
Re my perhaps failing, certainly less reliable than it once was memory, there is a similarity between my "problem", and Dianes voice situation. We all get old, I didn't use to have gray hair, though I have it these days. Additionally, as has been observed, "getting old ain't for sissies".
Anyhow, getting back to F & F, and things more closely related thereto, the following headline raises interesting questions. "Uncooperative Witness on Fast and Furious, Returns to U.S. From Sudden Posting to Iraq". One wonders as to exactly what the fellow might have to say.
Re my perhaps failing, certainly less reliable than it once was memory, there is a similarity between my "problem", and Dianes voice situation. We all get old, I didn't use to have gray hair, though I have it these days. Additionally, as has been observed, "getting old ain't for sissies".
Anyhow, getting back to F & F, and things more closely related thereto, the following headline raises interesting questions. "Uncooperative Witness on Fast and Furious, Returns to U.S. From Sudden Posting to Iraq". One wonders as to exactly what the fellow might have to say.
Luger_carbine
New member
Justice Department seeks dismissal of Fast and Furious lawsuit
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...sal-fast-and-furious-lawsuit/?test=latestnews
I've never seen such audacity. These guys thumb their noses at the Congress of the United States, the president claims Executive Privledge, then they tell the courts to stay out of it, claiming the courts have no business getting involved in the issue.
Hopefully the court can recognize a trick bag when it sees it.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...sal-fast-and-furious-lawsuit/?test=latestnews
I've never seen such audacity. These guys thumb their noses at the Congress of the United States, the president claims Executive Privledge, then they tell the courts to stay out of it, claiming the courts have no business getting involved in the issue.
Hopefully the court can recognize a trick bag when it sees it.
Here's the part that annoys me...
Source: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/16/justice-department-seeks-dismissal-fast-and-furious-lawsuit/#ixzz29T3PGB33
Given that Congress has oversight duties, what good is their subpoena power if there is no force of law to back it up? If the court agrees with the administration, it would seem that future administrations could simply refuse to turn over documents and/or refuse subpoenas with near impunity. Congress would then be left with only one real alternative, which would be to revoke any monies for the agency(s), which is unlikely, especially if the administration's party holds the majority of Congress.
If memory serves, the courts settled an executive privilege dispute before, during the Nixon administration. That was regarding an audio tape (with the infamous 18-minute gap).
Source: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/16/justice-department-seeks-dismissal-fast-and-furious-lawsuit/#ixzz29T3PGB33
Given that Congress has oversight duties, what good is their subpoena power if there is no force of law to back it up? If the court agrees with the administration, it would seem that future administrations could simply refuse to turn over documents and/or refuse subpoenas with near impunity. Congress would then be left with only one real alternative, which would be to revoke any monies for the agency(s), which is unlikely, especially if the administration's party holds the majority of Congress.
If memory serves, the courts settled an executive privilege dispute before, during the Nixon administration. That was regarding an audio tape (with the infamous 18-minute gap).
Spats McGee
Administrator
Under the "political question" doctrine, courts actually do not resolve, well, political questions. The issue, then, is whether this particular dispute constitutes a political question. Clearly, the administration hopes to convince the court that it does.
jimpeel wrote in part:
Thanks, Alan. Was able to find THIS.
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I believe your "THIS" was the DR segment I finally referenced. Otherwise, re the guy thaat suddenly went overseaas, and has now aseemikngly returned, it will be interesting to note whether or not he developes "a failure of memory".
Luger_carbine wrote, as the close of his post:
Hopefully the court can recognize a trick bag when it sees it.
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I would think that that depends on whether or not the court has the guts to really look at what is being waved in it's face, which it might or might not have. I guess we shall see.
Thanks, Alan. Was able to find THIS.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I believe your "THIS" was the DR segment I finally referenced. Otherwise, re the guy thaat suddenly went overseaas, and has now aseemikngly returned, it will be interesting to note whether or not he developes "a failure of memory".
Luger_carbine wrote, as the close of his post:
Hopefully the court can recognize a trick bag when it sees it.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would think that that depends on whether or not the court has the guts to really look at what is being waved in it's face, which it might or might not have. I guess we shall see.
NRA's Ginny Simone interviewed Vince Cefalu on his unceremonious firing, October 12, 2012.
VIDEO LINK
VIDEO LINK
jimpeel:
Re the video clip linked in your post 2675, Mr. Cefalu seems to be of the opinion that, "the system works", which I take to mean that in the end, truth will out, and he will be vindicated, he thinks.
I hope that it turns out that he is right, that the truth favors him, and that it really will come out. Realistically, I just don't think that it will, this based on my perhaps jaundiced view of things. Of course, I'm 79 years old, and I've not led a particularly sheltered life, and then I might not know what I'm talking about.
Our Sec. of State, we are told, has "accepted responsibility". As I recall, then Attorney General Janet Reno did too, and aside from a bunch of people getting killed, what happened, nothing much as I recall, but them perhaps my memory isn't worth much these days.
Maybe Cefalu is right, maybe "the system does/will work". As I view the things, the system works, but only for those who operate it. Cefalu is not one of those. Meanwhile, regarding the fiasco of Operation Fast & Furious, a bunch of people have been killed, mostly Mexican nationals, shot with firearms that a run away agency of the U.S government "walked" across the border. Has anyone been punished over that? Not that one would notice, yet Cefalu believes that "the system works". I hope that he's right, but personally speaking, I wouldn't bet much on that idea.
Re the video clip linked in your post 2675, Mr. Cefalu seems to be of the opinion that, "the system works", which I take to mean that in the end, truth will out, and he will be vindicated, he thinks.
I hope that it turns out that he is right, that the truth favors him, and that it really will come out. Realistically, I just don't think that it will, this based on my perhaps jaundiced view of things. Of course, I'm 79 years old, and I've not led a particularly sheltered life, and then I might not know what I'm talking about.
Our Sec. of State, we are told, has "accepted responsibility". As I recall, then Attorney General Janet Reno did too, and aside from a bunch of people getting killed, what happened, nothing much as I recall, but them perhaps my memory isn't worth much these days.
Maybe Cefalu is right, maybe "the system does/will work". As I view the things, the system works, but only for those who operate it. Cefalu is not one of those. Meanwhile, regarding the fiasco of Operation Fast & Furious, a bunch of people have been killed, mostly Mexican nationals, shot with firearms that a run away agency of the U.S government "walked" across the border. Has anyone been punished over that? Not that one would notice, yet Cefalu believes that "the system works". I hope that he's right, but personally speaking, I wouldn't bet much on that idea.
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So did anyone else notice that Eric Holder told Congress one story under oath in May of last year, but told the Inspector General a different story?
He told Congress that he probably learned of Fast and Furious from media reports a few weeks earlier, meaning some time in April, presumably.
At the time Holder testified before Congress and for months afterward, the DOJ was still standing by their initial response that the ATF did not allow illegal sales and then let the guns walk. If he admitted that he asked his own people what happened, it would lead to the question, "Did they tell you about the gunwalking?" So he pretended that no one was talking about such unimportant matters way back in February and he had only recently caught wind of it in the media.
He told Congress that he probably learned of Fast and Furious from media reports a few weeks earlier, meaning some time in April, presumably.
At the time Holder testified before Congress and for months afterward, the DOJ was still standing by their initial response that the ATF did not allow illegal sales and then let the guns walk. If he admitted that he asked his own people what happened, it would lead to the question, "Did they tell you about the gunwalking?" So he pretended that no one was talking about such unimportant matters way back in February and he had only recently caught wind of it in the media.