Are shooters their own worst enemies?

O

Old Stony

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Some time back I set up a range on some property a kind gentleman lets me use. I let friends and acquaintances use the range with only a few simple rules to follow and it costs them nothing. I only ask they pick up after themselves, don't shoot glass, don't shoot high powered rifles at the 25 and 50 yd. steel targets. I consider the 100 yd. steel targets as basically sacrificial as the high powered stuff will tear it up pretty good.
I went out to the range today to do some mowing and generally look the place over. What I see is old targets laying in pieces all over the place for me to pick up...holes in the closer steel targets...one target holder pretty much shot to pieces and unusable.
I have shot on a lot of ranges myself over the years and basically if someone is not there to police things, this seems to be the condition of things. I'm really surprised there are not old tv's, washing machines and whatever dumped there and shot to pieces.
I wonder if it is just laziness that leads to all the mess people leave....and then I hear people complaining about no place to shoot. It leaves a guy shaking his head in disappointment.
 
That's really sad and I'm sorry for this happening to you. Things like this disgust me as well because people don't understand the effort needed to create and maintain something. Its sounds like a small group of people shooting there and I hope you find out who did it.
 
We have the same problem at my gun club. We are constantly replacing target stands that are shot up for no valid reason. We've found computers and TVs shot up. And this at a range used by dues paying club members. Unfortunately we have had no luck catching the miscreants.
 
Yes... Shooters mess up everything for others.

It's not hard to take care of things and clean up your debris.

You should see some spots in national forests
 
I hate being put in the position of trying to make other people do the right thing. I have always been one to try to give back more than I took from a place like this....but I guess some other people don't see things that way. It takes very little effort to dig a hole and repair a target stand...but I guess it's just easier to leave it and walk away. I intend to drop some serious hints at some guys and see if it makes a difference.
 
In Hunter Safety class we tell our students to leave the woods in better shape than it was when you entered it. IOWs, not only take out what you carry in, but pickup or bury other trash you find. I'm thinkin' 85% or better do.....but it's what the other 15% leaves behind that gives all of us a black eye. Same with gun ranges....especially free ones. Folks seem to have no respect or regard for things they get for free. Until it's gone. Then they're the first to whine.

I have a nice 150 yard range set up on my son's hunting property. It's close to the town road and many has been the neighbor that has stopped and asked if they could shoot there when we're not there. Most of the time it was just a few shots to sight in their deer rifle before season. For a while it was good. Soon tho we began to see the same things the OP has. Target stands intentionally shot, targets and other trash left everywhere, target stands gone. We had a shooting bench I made in the open shed next to the range, left there so it would always be there. One day it came up missing. After deer season one of the neighbors brought it back, seems he thought it would work well for him where he sat on the edge of a open field. Even tho he never asked to use it, or bother to tell us where it went, we were the buttholes when we asked him to stay off the property from now on. His actions and the actions of a few others have made it so if we're there, you can shoot with us. We've asked the neighbors and have posted signs asking others to stay off when no one is there. Still we find folks are using it still and leaving trash as to say, "nah, nah, nah...nah." Probably the same folks that wonder why they can't get permission to hunt private property.
 
Talking to some folks will help, others less so.

You're going to have to close the site, clean it up, and then limit use to your friends, and no one else. You're going to have to be there.

Were I the landowner, I would expect you to manage the site you asked me to allow a lot better than you are. Nothing personal, but people require proactive, not passive, management. The days are long gone when simple signs could regulate behavior, sorry to say.
 
People are people, they consume, damage and destroy everything they come in contact with. Some destory, damage and consume faster than others but it ends the same regardless of who they are (myself included). Small groups minimize the constant damage to a manageable level, and nothing kills a good attitude like dealing with people who just do not care about what they destroy. Then again I may be clouding the discussion with my sunny disposition.
 
Or you gave permission to 3 people, they gave permission to 3 each....now it is just known as the place to go shoot stuff up.

People don't realize how you really have to defend these places. I belong to a range where you just about have to keep a guard posted to keep the freeloaders away and we gave a gate....it is getting better.

HEY PEOPLE....A RANGE NEAR THE ROAD IS NOT USUALLY FOR PUBLIC USE AND DESTRUCTIONS!
 
This is why I don't like people in general. The percentage of self-absorbed ingrates seems to grow every year. I feel for you, getting taken advantage of like that would make me furious.
 
Sometimes "We start the problem !!!

I let friends and acquaintances use the range with only a few simple rules to follow and it costs them nothing.
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Stony,
Many of us have had similar situations whether it be on a range or "sharing" a hunting spot with a buddy. We try to do a good thing but once you start, you have no control where it goes and it usually goes bad. You share it with a trusted buddy and he then shares it with someone he knows and pretty soon you are out there and you don' know where these guys came from. We have to realize that it started with "us". Soon the landowner is calling you about problems he is having. :mad:

Be Private and;
Be Safe !!!
 
There used to be a free gun range on WiDNR land not too far from my house. The DNR put up a sign for people to clean up after themselves and be respectful to the neighbors and other shooters.

People dumped TVs there to shoot up, left trash of all sorts there, and to top it off shot the crap out of the sign the DNR posted. Well, the inevitable occurred and now that range is closed. I keep hearing rumors of the DNR opening another range but it is almost 2 years now and nothing has been done that I am aware of.

Not all shooters are jerks and slobs but enough are to taint us all and ruin some really good things for us.
 
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I am a Member to the Local club here. I started out like OldStoney( Nice,calm). I would mention it to people that would bring water jugs, Pop cans, ect, ect. When they did not pick up, I would do it for them when they left. One day I was out there with another guy that had been a member for 15 years plus. people tried to leave stuff laying around. I got to tell you I could never be as forward as this guy was, but it was a pleasure to watch him just rip into these guys. I swear those 2 will never cme back again. Since then I have gotten old ( and with age comes the grumpies) I have threatened 3 people now with calling the Sherriff on them. Wrote down plate numbers and made the call. We ( Members) spend 6 days a year, 8 plus hours a day fixing the range ( most is typcal damage) But the picking up the milk jugs, TV's Computers, propane tanks, ect,ect. that is just bull.
To all that know how to respect the pleasure we have- Don't wait like I did for someone else to say something. If you see it- Make a commment, write down a plate number,ect. Confront them and make them clean it up. We all know how fast one of these ranges can be shut down and then we are at a loss because of some slob.
 
But doesn't the Second Amendment cover all behavior? d It's their right to
destroy and defile and to strut and to show off. And it all should be free or
else the Second Amendment is being infringed.
 
Do your homework !!

But doesn't the Second Amendment cover all behavior? d It's their right to destroy and defile and to strut and to show off
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No sir as that is covered by the First Amendments of which you are freely expressing. ..... :rolleyes:

Be Safe !!!
 
Yep, that's pretty much the way it happens. You allow two guys to use the firing range and they invite two buds each. Pretty soon the range is a mess and no one knows who trashed it.

Against the advice a close friend i allowed folks to use my firing range. No one ever picked up anything. i hauled pickup loads of trash off that range. Then someone fired out of safety and killed one of the neighbors beef cows. i paid for the cow, changed the locks on the gates and told everyone who wanted use the range no. i was the wicked witch of SW OK.

Allowing others to use your firing range comes with a liability issue. Every bullet that leaves the range has your name on it.

Now i enjoy the range i built.
 
Pahoo,

I think you misread what I wrote.

But yes I was being snide, sarcastic and hopefully castigating
the boobs who mess up ranges. Oh well.
 
This is also an issue in the 4x4 community. Many years ago there were lots of trails and areas on state or county land that was open to our use. Even most snowmobile clubs didn't mind us using the trails in the summer. But over the years a few idiots ruined it for everyone with trashing the trails, dumping trash (appliances, tires, furniture, etc.) and generally having no respect for anything. All but a few areas are now gated, bermed and closed off. We tried to clean up after others but just couldn't hold the line; and lost our access privileges.

One of our local public ranges tried to install steel gongs and targets a few years back, but they were quickly trashed by azzhats that have no discipline. The targets and stands were replaced once, but it got to be too expensinve to constantly repair them so they are gone.
 
Not much different on the Game Commission ranges in PA. The Wardens have been cracking down in recent years, but they cannot be everywhere. I have seen a large chest of drawers down at the 100 yard line with no way to get it there but carry it. Coconuts and various fruits seem popular, and what the heck they are biodegradable. Every now and then the occasional bowling ball shows up. When you get into metal and plastic the items get even weirder.
 
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