AR-15 .223 for pronghorn

samsmix said:
I shot the deer and it just stood there for 10 seconds, then fell over
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^^^ That. That right there is why I quit using it on big game. If it was all I had then a-hunting I would go, but there are better choices.
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Except I've seen the EXACT same thing happen with a whitetail deer shot with a 12ga slug.

It was the hunters first deer. He was flabbergasted.... Less than 40 yards, BOOM! Deer just stood there. Hunter is looking at it through the scope. Could see blood dripping. Deer looked around for a few seconds, walked 10 or 15 yards, stood THERE for a few seconds, layed down calmly, looked around for a few seconds, tipped it's head back to lick the wound and slowly rolled it's head back against it's body, dead. It was a perfect, broadside, double lung shot.

If we stopped using everything that didn't result in BANG, FLOP!, we'd stop using everything smaller than a 105mm rifled cannon.
 
I'm not a fan of smaller bullets on big game, but the Sierra 65 grain Gameking is very tempting in my AR. Very accurate and wow do they penetrate my wood back stop made of logs. If I was going to do it, I'd use that bullet and H322 powder.
 
Brian Pfleuger,

I don't doubt your claim one bit. I think with an '06 or even a .243 the results would have been more dramatic.

In my experience, YES deer and antelope CAN be hit with larger rounds and not go BOOM! FLOP! But it in my experience the .223 fails at this instant anchoring drastically more often than (I'll just say it) PROPER big game cartridges. I have killed with the .223, but DRT was the exception, not the norm with heart and lung hits, sometimes multiple such hits.

If it was all I had, I WOULD use it. If I had a better option, I would take it.

For me. Your mileage may vary.
 
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I would think a deer shot at 40 yards with a 12Ga slug reacting as described above is the exception and not the norm. But I have had just as many go down right there as I have had to trail after a well placed 270, 308, 30-06. They don't seem to read the same rule book.;)
 
Guv said:
I would think a deer shot at 40 yards with a 12Ga slug reacting as described above is the exception and not the norm. But I have had just as many go down right there as I have had to trail after a well placed 270, 308, 30-06. They don't seem to read the same rule book.
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Trouble is, every individual instance is it's own exception.

There's a slightly incorrect saying that nonetheless gets the correct point across... "Anecdote is not the singular of data."

I've seen untold dozens of deer shot with everything from compound bows to .243Win, 7-08, 270Win, 30-06, .300mag, 20ga, 12ga and some I'm sure I've forgotten. The only thing I predict ahead of time now is that there's no predicting the reaction ahead of time.

I've watched full sized adults drop like they got hit by lightning when a 55gr .243 hit them and then seen 75lb button bucks take a 300gr muzzleloader bullet through the lungs that literally blew the opposite side leg off except for a flap of skin and they run 75 yards. Of course, I've seen full sized adults drop like they got hit by lightning when that same 300gr ML bullet hit them too, so....

Anyhow, point being, "I have seen..." is over-rated. Unless "I have seen..." enough of each example to eliminate the untold, nearly infinite, variables that make it so unpredictable, it's really quite meaningless.

Now, all that being said, to me the answer to the OP's dilemna is obvious.... namely, you're clearly loading your own "31-06" ammo... so load something more appropriate for pronghorn and try to put that bullet a little BEHIND the shoulder, where there's less/no meat.;)
 
Now, all that being said, to me the answer to the OP's dilemna is obvious.... namely, you're clearly loading your own "31-06" ammo... so load something more appropriate for pronghorn and try to put that bullet a little BEHIND the shoulder, where there's less/no meat.
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I will certainly agree on that.

Like you, I have seen literally hundreds...idk how many, but I'll ball park it at about 400 deer and antelope buy the farm. I've seen a whitetail doe hit through the lungs with a 7 Mag/150gr run a mile and require a follow-up (total failure to expand), and seen a lot of other instances of amazing resilience. I have shot deer with 12ga, .357, 9mm, .44spl, .44mag, .50BP, .223, .257 Bob, .270, '06, 7mm Mag, 7.62x39, 7.62x54R...I may have missed some. I've witnessed deer shot with everything from the .22 WMR to the .375 H&H.

In all of this, I cannot but agree with you that each instance is unique. That said, over the long haul, while there were exceptions, the trend has been towards the reinforcement of the conventional wisdom about proper cartridge selection.

I still respect your opinion, and would still use a .223 if it was all I had, but I think the quoted advice at the top of this post is as solid as it comes, and that would be my top choice as well.
 
Winchester's 64 grain soft tip is a good one for taking deer sized animals. I've taken a lot of antelope and my average shot is about 275 yards. At this distance the .223 is less than ideal for hunting. It does its best work at 150 yards or less.

Jack
 
I grew up in eastern MT, most of what we ate was pronghorn, just because they were plentiful and our indian friends loved to hunt year round but didn't like how tough antelope meat is(so we were gifted a lot of them). antelope are tricky buggers, they run extremely fast, are extremely skiddish compared to deer and if you make the wrong move or put a round in the wrong place they can run a long ways just on adrenaline. on the other hand they do not have a lot of meat to begin with, any amount of overkill will spoil a large amount of the meat that you can harvest, especially when it comes to backstraps and front quarters. personally I would go with either a heavy bullet going slow, or a light bullet going fast. given pronghorns love of open prairies, probably the light and fast option would work best so you're probably looking at either a 223 or a 243 using lighter end bullets (heavier end meaning 80 grains or more). just be careful to put the round where it is supposed to go the first time, if you need a followup... you probably won't get it.
 
Lotta good hunting down there. Some of the best. I'm in Great Falls. It's been tougher hunting around here since the winter and disease kills of 2010-12.
 
Unless your Idaho antelope are a lot bigger the Wyoming antelope your AR will work fine.

First off, I don't care what round you're using, there is no such thing as a guarantee DRT bullet.

I shot a antelope at just short of 600 yards with a 150 Gr Horn IB. Perfect heart/lung shot. The sucker ran about 100 yards acting like it wasn't hit at all, then did a triple summersault. It's lung looked like a pile of used coffee grounds and I could put my fist in the exit hole.

If you're concerned then pick one of the Berger VLD Hunting Bullets. They are designed to go in a few inches and shatter, destroying they central nervous system and they do that darn well. According to the Berger Techs. the remaining velocity needs to be about 1800 fps for the bullet to work properly.

In a 223 using the 70-77 size bullet your MV will be about 2700 FPS, with a remaining velocity at about 600 yards at or just beyond the magic 1800 fps.

But anyone who has used the Bergers as intended, will tell you they are effective. Some times too much so. I load the 87 Bergers in my wife's 243 for deer and antelope. We decided to go to a more conventional bullet because the Berger's do make a mess.

Just watch the critters after you shoot, I lot of people give up on antelope because they think they missed the way the run off. Those suckers can run a long was with the heart/lungs completely destroyed.

Heart/lung shots don't ruin much meat. If you use a heavy bone crushing bullet and hit bones, you ain't getting much meat.

As far as distance, its not the bullet that is the limiting factor, its the shooter. Like I said a 223, 70-77 size bullet will work to about 600 yards if the shooter can shoot them.

Before you believe those who say the 223 isn't a 600 yard round, go to a couple high power matches, those suckers rule that game.

I've shot some fair scores at a 1000 using the 223 our of my White Oak Service rifle.

Use the proper bullet, learn to shot the rifle and you'll find the 223 is an excellent Antelope Round.

I've found there is so much that cant be done, that use to be done before the days of the internet. Back then we had to go buy experience instead of what computers told us.
 
Antelope are lightly built creatures and easy to topple with a chest shot. But my average shot is about 275 yards with my .243 rifle. At 275 yards, the .223 is losing power rapidly.

Jack

 
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