Apple Seed

It will be a great time. If your eyes can still fill the order.. I suggest you use iron sights. It is much more rewarding to qualify with irons than with glass. Also, get yourself a good two point sling that is easy to adjust (G.I. Web slings are ideal). You really only need two magazines; the factory 10 round will be used 95% of the time and only a few times will you need to load over 10 rounds. However you will need another magazine for reloads. At the very least have a 10 and a 25 rounder on hand with about 300-400 rounds. Have fun and be safe!
 
Appleseed started out as a program to teach real rifleman skills to the public so we once again have a civilian army of Patriots that someone like Obama would fear.

It also intended to teach shooting skills to folks with rifles capable of shooting long distance.

I see that today it has become a PC competition for .22 rifles.

So now that they are shooting rimfires and not teaching people the real reasons we have the 2nd amendment I don't see the point of sending anyone there.

You are much better off shooting NRA smallbore if you like .22s or shooting NRA or CMP matches if you want to learn to shoot the distance.
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Mythbuster: I'm curious...have you BEEN to an Appleseed shoot, or are you forming your opinions from what "some feller said"?

We had a shoot last weekend, there were 2 ARs, 1 M-44 Mosin Nagant, 1 M1A, 1 K-98 Mauser and yes, there were 4 Ruger 10/22 rifles on the line. We also have a 500yd KD range.

Along with excellent rifle marksmanship training, we recount the history of April 19, 1775...why it's important to remember the sacrifices our forefathers made, AND why it's important to become active citizens. Not just sitting around, whining about how everything is "swirling down the drain", but actually contacting elected officials, letting them know what YOU think. How YOU want them to vote in Congress.

I'm NOT dissing the NRA or CMP...they have great programs for shooters, too...I think we're all pulling in the same direction.
 
Never been to one. I just know what they used to be about and I was hoping they never change.

Now when the Obama supporter hears you " recount the history of April 19, 1775...why it's important to remember the sacrifices our forefathers made"

and why we really have the 2nd Amendment he is going to consider this a "FAR right militia" type thing and he will pick up his .22 and go home. :eek:

.
 
On the contrary

I'll be there plugging away because some liberals like guns, too. And I don't really care if you think I'm not a patriot - plenty of ignorance to go around in the world and you're entitled to your share.

I support the goals of an active citizenry engaged in the political process. I support liberty. I don't believe the steps taken after 9/11 are at all consistent with it, and my major gripe with Obama is he's done almost nothing to walk us back from the police state all but imposed under Bush. And I have to wonder where the freedom loving patriots were when the right of habeas corpus was eliminated and the 4th and 5th Amendments were discarded like used kleenex.

We're kind of off topic, though. I'll say no more.
 
Maybe this'll make BOTH of you feel better....we are apolitical. We don't endorse any party, don't care what your views are. We are NOT affiliated with any militia groups, period. The ONLY militia we talk about is the 1775 variety.

We WILL, however try to wake up the "citizen" in you. And, no...haven't had anybody grab their gear and skulk away after hearing our history!
 
One thing if you buy extra magazines for the 10/22: Get regular length 10 rounders. I fell for the "need fast magazine change" and grabbed a couple of long 25 rounders - true, they are easier to change, but they get in the way of your natural positioning during prone shooting.
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+1 If I remember correctly, the only sequence that uses more than 10 rounds is not timed, so you can reload with another 10-rounder with no penalty.

Regarding the use of rim-fires over center-fires, I think the .22 is ideal for something like an Appleseed. First, many ranges do not have a 500 yard range available. Second, even if they did, it would take far too long to walk all the way down there to change targets as often as necessary. Third, with that many people in such close confinement, hot brass starts to become an issue. Fourth, Appleseed is aimed primarily at novices and children. Those individuals don't want to spend a lot of money on guns and ammo, and aren't used to high-caliber recoil. Let them learn the fundamentals on a .22, and then move up to bigger guns and more advanced competitions.

Regarding the liberal gun lover, I think that just proves how badly we need more than 2 parties. There are a lot of people in this country, and the spectrum of opinions and issues simply cannot be divided into only 2 camps.

Re scopes vs iron sights, almost all of the folks who made Expert at my shoot used scopes. Modern tech is obviously better, but if you're one of those who takes pride in doing it the hard way, then you'll definitely get more respect if you can shoot well the old fashioned way.
 
Kraigwy, I am an appleseed instructor, and I have been trying to shoot the aqt with my 1903. You said in your last post that my face should not come off the stock when I work the bolt, but if I don't lift my head, I get hit in the face with the bolt. Am I doing something wrong?
 
Appleseed

I went to one Appleseed. I will be going to others. After the first one I learned some things. If you are shooting an M14 load your mags to 10 rds, because that is the limit they shoot per mag. Load your mags ahead of time. If you are always reloading you can't be paying attention.

Be prepared to scoop up others brass who do not want it; if you reload.

Definitely wear knee pads and ELBOW pads even more...even if they are just neoprene. I used iron sights and was close to qualifying. I would bring an EOTech next time in a heart beat. You should have a good to very good shooting mat. Walmart has some exercise mats that were awesome (some other guys had them). I had a regular match shooting mat.

In the summer hydration was a big issue, I ran out of water both days.

We talked about how the revolution started and some other stories during lunch. This help them keep their non-profit status. No militia talk. I think the idea is that if everyone becomes a rifleman in America, everyone can be the militia...no? The rest of you are all cooks. hahahaha.

I shot 800 rounds over two days of .308. It was good to have someone watching me and helping me correct for better shooting. The 2nd day everyone shooting real weapons was too sore or out of ammo to keep shooting.

A great activity for a kid to go to with their dad. If you shoot .22s, get some extra mags so you don't have to be reloading them all the time. If you have a battle rifle....shame on you if you don't have twenty magazines per rifle already:)
 
smoakingun: I agree with kraigwy about cheekweld on bolt rifles. If you can, don't break position to work the bolt...otherwise you have to re-establish NPOA on every shot...not good.

I shot my M-44 last weekend, and the bolt just BARELY touches my nose when its fully opened. There are some rifles this doesn't work on...

I like to have 4 10-round mags for my .22 rifle...sometimes we do "RFAQTs", and you need 4 mags loaded.

Ben
 
Never been to one. I just know what they used to be about and I was hoping they never change.

Now when the Obama supporter hears you " recount the history of April 19, 1775...why it's important to remember the sacrifices our forefathers made"

and why we really have the 2nd Amendment he is going to consider this a "FAR right militia" type thing and he will pick up his .22 and go home.
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Seriously??? I think you should visit one before you say anything more about it.

On second thought I do see a point here. Appleseed does teach you some rifleman skills and it lets you know that you don't have to have a bench and sandbags to shoot a rifle.

But as I said before there are better ways to learn.
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How about just trying one, before you make some assumptions that we aren't a qualified marksmanship course.
Just show up, and let me know how the AQT (Army Qualification Test) grind is for you.
Most people, it takes 2-3 tries before they can even score the Rifleman patch, because it isn't easy; in all honesty, it just isn't an easy test, it is very, very hard, even for seasoned shooters.

The military doesn't teach these fundamentals anymore; tis why there aren't very many good reports on our troops marksmanship these days.

So, I dare you to sign up for one, and let me know if you learn anything.
 
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Kraigwy, I am an appleseed instructor, and I have been trying to shoot the aqt with my 1903. You said in your last post that my face should not come off the stock when I work the bolt, but if I don't lift my head, I get hit in the face with the bolt. Am I doing something wrong?
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With out seeing you shoot, I can't say for sure, but I would guess you might be needing to adjust your position.

You head should be straight, bright the rifle to the head, not the other way around, regardless of position. Head straight, bring the stock to your cheak where you have a chipmunk look with you cheak.

And the 1903 is one of the best rifles for this. If your are getting hit by the bolt, I think you are climbing too far up the stock.

Sitting and off hand isn't bad, but some times in the prone you have to adjust. You roll a tad onto your left (if right handed) work the bolt, drop back into position and shoot.

Now after saying all this, we all know there is an exception to every rules. To me its the Mosin. The bolt handle on the Mosin is a little bit farther up front then other rifles. To reach it I have to drop the stock a bit out of my shoulder.

Remember all people are differant, come in all sizes, Some adjustments may have to be made. Can't do that on the internet. Its best to find a coach to work with you. For position shooting a Bolt Gun, I think the best place to find coaching is the CMP GSM Clinics. These Clincis are designed for surplus military rifles.
 
magazines

I like to have 4 10-round mags for my .22 rifle...sometimes we do "RFAQTs", and you need 4 mags loaded.

Ben
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I'm limited to (2 x 10) + (1 x 5) with my CZ-455 (bolt)
I will also bring a Marlin 795 with 5 x 10

My eyes will determine if I can do anything with the iron sites on the Marlin. They're Tech Sites, so they should be ok.

I'd get more 10 round mags for the CZ-455, but at $35/mag I am at my limit. Something about spending more on mags than the course...now to get the scope mounted and zeroed.
 
Posted by thesheepdog.

"How about just trying one, before you make some assumptions that we aren't a qualified marksmanship course.
Just show up, and let me know how the AQT (Army Qualification Test) grind is for you.
Most people, it takes 2-3 tries before they can even score the Rifleman patch, because it isn't easy; in all honesty, it just isn't an easy test, it is very, very hard, even for seasoned shooters"

I did not say it was not a qualified marksmanship course. It is good for getting the bench shooters off their 2,000lb concrete bench and sandbags and letting then learn a few real world skills.

I know exactly how your AQT (Army Qualification Test) grind is because we used to shoot the exact same course at our club years ago. Because I am not a bench shooter I qualified the first time shooting a half worn out Garand. If I could not do it with a .22 rifle I would give up shooting and stay at home.

I am Master Class in NRA Highpower now trying to be High Master.

Appleseed is a really good thing. It tends to get the sheep's heads out of their asses and lets them discover the REAL reason we have the 2nd Amendment and teaches them the basics of being a real rifleman.

I wish every real American hunter and bench shooter in the USA could attend one. I wish that because I know that if modern liberalism and people like Obama and his supporters are not stopped there WILL come a day when we will either have to fight for our freedom or be slaves.

I would rather have a Appleseed shooter beside me than a bench shooter when it happens.
 
Well, I've learned allot here on Appleseed, I appreciate it. Finally got my bolt action Browning "T" bolt zeroed yesterday at 50 yards. Need to get me a shooting mat at Wally World for the Appleseed next month. I have very bad knees, is kneeling or squatting part of the qualifications? I take a procedural in IDPA shoots on the kneeling portion. It's a PITA getting old :mad:
 
Dennis1209: We do standing (offhand), seated and prone positions. We will work with you, if you're physically incapable of getting in seated position. I have to kneel, instead of actually sitting...like you say, sucks to get old.

I had one older gent (85+) that shot the whole thing either standing or kneeling..his knees were gone and he couldn't get in prone. Excellent shot! He hit 180s-190s, I believe, used touch on the shoulder for range commands...he was pretty much deaf. BUT, he's a retired Marine, and he stuck it out for both days. So if you have physical problems, talk with the Shoot Boss when you get there, he'll work with you.

My Mom always used to say: "Getting old ain't for sissys!" She was right! BUT, we'll work around it.

Have fun!

Ben
 
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