Apathy and No Guns Signs
- Thread starter Bogie
- Start date
the_pragmaticist
New member
I voted "just carry it"...I would tend to agree that a lot of stores that post that sign (and they're not too common here in northern Ohio) are just uneducated / brainwashed. It's not that they're anti-gun; they just don't take the time to think out just why the sign is the most ineffective, useless approach they could take to reducing the probability of robbery or violence.
I do, however, observe the rules in state-owned buildings (which don't have to post as far as I know, you're just not allowed to carry in Ohio). There's no ask-to-leave policy in the state buildings. If you're caught carrying, you have committed a 5th degree felony which, in addition to jail time, comes with a "do not pass go" revoke of your CCW.
I do, however, observe the rules in state-owned buildings (which don't have to post as far as I know, you're just not allowed to carry in Ohio). There's no ask-to-leave policy in the state buildings. If you're caught carrying, you have committed a 5th degree felony which, in addition to jail time, comes with a "do not pass go" revoke of your CCW.
Every time folks see those signs, it reinforces the concept of "We don't want guns here."
Which makes it that much harder to persuade folks on the issues.
It only takes a few seconds to ask a store owner or manager about "Hey, why don't you want my business?"
Now...
What NATIONAL chains are nationally posted? I'm having a hard time thinking of any... I know that some Wal-Marts, Home Depots, etc., have -been- posted, but when someone contacted corporate management, and the corporate folks had their come-to-jesus meetings with the store managers, those signs came down...
Small stores, and even small chains, are scared to death of the megachains, and with good reason. If Joe's hardware posts, remind him that "Hey, Lowes and Home Depot want my business more than you do - it's going to make me feel bad to go to them, but if you insist..."
These owners and managers are not psychic.
You have to talk to them to let them know that you are not happy. Be nice. Be polite. But be firm.
Some of them will give you BS excuses, like their insurance makes them do it. I know shooters who are in the insurance business, and they NEVER heard of that... Most of the folks with the signs up think that they're being safe. Or they think that they are required to put them up for some reason. Remind these folks about Lowes, Home Depot, Wal-Mart, or whatever, again. And ask them again why don't -you- want my business, when the folks in Bentonville welcome me?
When the signs come down, we're winners. You may not win them all, but you'll win some. Feels good.
If you do nothing, and the signs stay up, you lost, because you never even tried. You forfeited what might have been an easy victory.
Are you a winner? Or are you a loser? It's your call.
Which makes it that much harder to persuade folks on the issues.
It only takes a few seconds to ask a store owner or manager about "Hey, why don't you want my business?"
Now...
What NATIONAL chains are nationally posted? I'm having a hard time thinking of any... I know that some Wal-Marts, Home Depots, etc., have -been- posted, but when someone contacted corporate management, and the corporate folks had their come-to-jesus meetings with the store managers, those signs came down...
Small stores, and even small chains, are scared to death of the megachains, and with good reason. If Joe's hardware posts, remind him that "Hey, Lowes and Home Depot want my business more than you do - it's going to make me feel bad to go to them, but if you insist..."
These owners and managers are not psychic.
You have to talk to them to let them know that you are not happy. Be nice. Be polite. But be firm.
Some of them will give you BS excuses, like their insurance makes them do it. I know shooters who are in the insurance business, and they NEVER heard of that... Most of the folks with the signs up think that they're being safe. Or they think that they are required to put them up for some reason. Remind these folks about Lowes, Home Depot, Wal-Mart, or whatever, again. And ask them again why don't -you- want my business, when the folks in Bentonville welcome me?
When the signs come down, we're winners. You may not win them all, but you'll win some. Feels good.
If you do nothing, and the signs stay up, you lost, because you never even tried. You forfeited what might have been an easy victory.
Are you a winner? Or are you a loser? It's your call.
Garand Illusion
New member
Awesome post, Bogie.
I did get my wife to get a CCW, though she never carries (still trying to work that one out, though I may never).
My winning argument was that I often have a gun in the car's lockbox, and if she get's pulled over in another state when I'm not in the car she could find herself in trouble.
So she's got her CCW ... took me about 2 years ... maybe in another 2 years I'll have her carrying a weapon ... 2 years after that a bug ... it's a slow process.
I did get my wife to get a CCW, though she never carries (still trying to work that one out, though I may never).
My winning argument was that I often have a gun in the car's lockbox, and if she get's pulled over in another state when I'm not in the car she could find herself in trouble.
So she's got her CCW ... took me about 2 years ... maybe in another 2 years I'll have her carrying a weapon ... 2 years after that a bug ... it's a slow process.
New Hampshire's legislature may actually trust its citizens
Link
Can't carry in courts (TITLE 12 § 159:19), schools are restricted, too, but I couldn't find a NH citation, I think it's a Federal thing anyway.
Carry allowed in Wildlife Management Areas, State/National Forests, State Parks, Road Side Rests.
Link
Can't carry in courts (TITLE 12 § 159:19), schools are restricted, too, but I couldn't find a NH citation, I think it's a Federal thing anyway.
Carry allowed in Wildlife Management Areas, State/National Forests, State Parks, Road Side Rests.
I haven't noticed here
I haven't noticed no gun signs here. On the other hand when the mall went no smoking I chose to not take my buisness there anymore. Well over a decade now. Recently county law for no smoking in resarants was passed have rarely eaten out since. The same if I were to see a no gun sign That would end my buisness there. If there were no alternative for a good or service I would have to decide if it were something I could live without.
That said I have found mail-order sourses for some items some things I have found I realy did not need at all it has saved some cash so its not all bad.
I haven't noticed no gun signs here. On the other hand when the mall went no smoking I chose to not take my buisness there anymore. Well over a decade now. Recently county law for no smoking in resarants was passed have rarely eaten out since. The same if I were to see a no gun sign That would end my buisness there. If there were no alternative for a good or service I would have to decide if it were something I could live without.
That said I have found mail-order sourses for some items some things I have found I realy did not need at all it has saved some cash so its not all bad.
+1 Firemax ... my wife and I had been married for a while when I moved from a baseball bat next to the bed to a Mossberg 500 and then to a collection of handguns. She accompanied me to the range a few times, then moved on. When we got to Texas I quickly applied for a CHL, against her wishes, explaining that it was my right as a citizen to carry a weapon, that I was doing it to protect her and myself and our possesions from predators. She grumbled, but didn't make a huge fuss. Two years ago, we celebrated our anniversary with a weekend in San Antonio. We stayed in a bed and breakfast about a mile from the River Walk. After dinner and a stroll along the river, we headed for bed. The walk that was pleasant in the sunshine was now a bit ominous, passing a darkened park with youths sitting around, smoking and talking. I moved her to the side away from the park as she leaned in and whispered, "You ARE packing, right?" Nothing happened, and I've since broken her of the "packing" bit, but she's no longer a skeptic.
Don't have a CCW yet even tho the BIL tried to get me in a class.May not get one till things get better.With that said I still understand whats going on with this posting crap.Ido my best to avoid the places that turn away the safest group of customers they could have.He gave me a letter for an Ohio carry board that I pass around when I have'em.
Ruthless4christ
New member
o voted to disarm becuase i have only seen these sighns on gov buildings, banks and bars. i figure im breaking the law to do otherwise
IMHO if you see a no-gun sign in window, don`t spend your money their because of sign, shouldn`t you feel obligated to let business owner know why. how else will he know the sign just cost him money. have some cards made up that states"no gun= no money, i am a licensed ccw holder that has passed an exstensive background check with no felonies or violent crimes on my record. what do you know about your other customers"? get owner or manager and politely give them one. rsgraebert, you may want to take a look at Ohio law on this subject as you may be commiting same felony ccw`ing in posted business as you would carrying in government building, banks or bars.
IZinterrogator
New member
So far, I haven't found a place around here that has a legal 30.06 sign.
LoneStranger
New member
All I can say is that I have personally dealt with four stores which have posted "I LOVE CRIMINALS" signs, sorry I meant "No Lawful CCW".
My contacts have resulted in two stores removing the signs and two who have not. I will be going back, when I get the chance, to show a receipt to the managers of the two posted stores and telling them why I won't be spending money in their stores.
Just my small humble activity for the greater good.
My contacts have resulted in two stores removing the signs and two who have not. I will be going back, when I get the chance, to show a receipt to the managers of the two posted stores and telling them why I won't be spending money in their stores.
Just my small humble activity for the greater good.
I've tried contacting management about these types of signs before. This is how it went, to the best of my recollection.
"So you have a problem with not carrying a gun inside our bank?"
"Yes."
"Why do you need a gun
in our bank?"
"I probably don't. But I don't want to take a chance on getting killed over money, so I carry. Except in your bank."
"You're safe in our bank. We have a security guard at that location."
"While I am certain your guard is willing to lay down his life for eight bucks an hour, he's inside, and unarmed. If I carry a lot of money into or out of your bank, crooks outside know I am unarmed, and am an easy target. Besides- they know I left my gun in the car, and can come and steal it."
"So... Your only problem with our bank is that you can't carry a gun in there."
"Yes."
"You're serious?"
"As a heart attack."
" Yeah... O.K.... I'll put your complaint in."
"So you have a problem with not carrying a gun inside our bank?"
"Yes."
"Why do you need a gun
in our bank?""I probably don't. But I don't want to take a chance on getting killed over money, so I carry. Except in your bank."
"You're safe in our bank. We have a security guard at that location."
"While I am certain your guard is willing to lay down his life for eight bucks an hour, he's inside, and unarmed. If I carry a lot of money into or out of your bank, crooks outside know I am unarmed, and am an easy target. Besides- they know I left my gun in the car, and can come and steal it."
"So... Your only problem with our bank is that you can't carry a gun in there."
"Yes."
"You're serious?"
"As a heart attack."
" Yeah... O.K.... I'll put your complaint in."
I recently stopped attending several motorcycle events in Arizona that have posted "no Firearms" or "no weapons allowed" on their registration forms.
Although I explained the training involved in obtaining a state CCW permit and a persons desire to obey the rules set forth by Arizona DPS and that I'm a retired state LEO, all I receive from the event organizers was a dumb look and a feeble "sorry, no guns allowed" answer.
Although I explained the training involved in obtaining a state CCW permit and a persons desire to obey the rules set forth by Arizona DPS and that I'm a retired state LEO, all I receive from the event organizers was a dumb look and a feeble "sorry, no guns allowed" answer.