Anyone worry about what cops might think....

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Because there is something to impression management. That's the point, folks don't get. Life and decision making is complex.

It's legit to walk down a TX street with an AR-15 slung, dressed like a mall ninja. Start doing that in front of the Federal building and/or courthouse.
 
Glenn sad to say is right here. I just helped a customer this morning. He was pawning his bond arms 45lc/.410 derringer. As we talked I noticed other large buldges on his person (don't get funny on me guys). Turns out that he was carrying 2 astra terminators (44mag snubbys) and an AMT backup 45 acp LOL. That makes 4 guns and get this on a bicycle. As we talked he told a story of nearly getting arrested. One officer was convinced that he was a trouble maker simply because of the multiple guns. After a supervisor was called and witnesses talked to he was found to have done nothing wrong. I also found myself judging this man based on his weapon choices and quantity. After talking to him for close to thirty minutes he turned out to be a super nice guy just a bit misguided on his gun choices.
 
For whatever it's worth, in Arkansas (I think) 3 guns are the limit you can have. Of course in Texas you are legally allowed to have 20 or 30 guns on you as long as they are concealed, but still perhaps 3 guns isn't that many.

I typically don't carry more than one on my person going around. In the car around town I carry two (one on me one on the glove compartment) when I am traveling I load up the Highway Patrolman for more punch on the highway and wilderness (making 3 guns). I don't like having guns around me loaded unless they have a specific purpose behind it. Since I just got an AR 15 at the gunshow this past Saturday :) I might replace the Highway Patrolman with an AR 15 under the back seat.

I seem to remember a TFLner Private Messaging me once saying that he had a primary, a backup and a shotgun in the car, told a cop who pulled him over and the cop didn't even blink. They just concluded their discussion and went on about each other's business.

But no matter how many guns on you, no matter what the policeman may or may not think (I agree with those of you who said "it's none of their business") the fact is that they can't arrest you without cause.

But conducting yourself as a gentleman would likely defuse suspicions he may have about you.
 
But no matter how many guns on you, no matter what the policeman may or may not think (I agree with those of you who said "it's none of their business") the fact is that they can't arrest you without cause.
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Quite naive. If any officer wants to bring you in for some reason, there will be a reason. You can claim later in your defense that you were not in violation.

If one really studies police behavior, you know that it is complex and not just based on this legalistic, absolutist view of the 2nd Amend and what YOU think is the law.

Evidence abounds - look at troubles folks having traveling across places like NY even with guns clearly in carry mode by Federal statute. They get busted at airports or driving. HR 218 hasn't always been seen as protecting folks covered by it when they move through such states.

Also, I've gone to the American Society for Criminology meetings a few times and listened to presentations on police behavior by police officers. While most officers clearly are good guys, they report on departments who consistently and deliberately engage in tactics that are suspect to make arrests or clear cases. This small group doesn't care what you say is legal. If they decide to arrest you, you take the ride.

If you futz around with your guns, you make the dread furtive movement and you are toast - may be arrested or shot.

Impression management is important when you get to the ambiguous stop or officer that isn't Officer 2ndA.

So stop being so damn naive. If you drive around looking like a ninja - it may not be to your benefit with some. When you protest loudly about the Constitution - you may look nuts.
 
newerguy,

I was carrying three guns the day before yesterday. Why do you think it was too many? Do you have any idea why I was carrying three? Why are you badmouthing me when you don't know what you are talking about?

I suggest that you learn a little more about carrying, or just carry for a while and think while you're doing it. Then you may come up with the answers by yourself. Unfortunately, I do not have the time right now to explain to you and defend my explanation, nor am I inclined to do so for someone who starts off by calling me names.

520
 
Quite naive. If any officer wants to bring you in for some reason, there will be a reason. You can claim later in your defense that you were not in violation.

If one really studies police behavior, you know that it is complex and not just based on this legalistic, absolutist view of the 2nd Amend and what YOU think is the law.

Evidence abounds - look at troubles folks having traveling across places like NY even with guns clearly in carry mode by Federal statute. They get busted at airports or driving. HR 218 hasn't always been seen as protecting folks covered by it when they move through such states.

Also, I've gone to the American Society for Criminology meetings a few times and listened to presentations on police behavior by police officers. While most officers clearly are good guys, they report on departments who consistently and deliberately engage in tactics that are suspect to make arrests or clear cases. This small group doesn't care what you say is legal. If they decide to arrest you, you take the ride.

If you futz around with your guns, you make the dread furtive movement and you are toast - may be arrested or shot.

Impression management is important when you get to the ambiguous stop or officer that isn't Officer 2ndA.

So stop being so damn naive. If you drive around looking like a ninja - it may not be to your benefit with some. When you protest loudly about the Constitution - you may look nuts.
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I am not advocating "driving around looking like a ninja." You apparently have the wrong image of me. I opened this post saying simply that I carry a maximum of 3 loaded guns in the car on or about my person. I didn't say I dress in a ninja outfit or camoflauge pants and shirt or any other meaningless G.I. Joe macho image that you see in gun shops and gun ranges from time to time. I don't dress or go around that way. I don't shout at people (cops or otherwise) about the Constitution like some wild eyed paranoid nut either.
I am not naive either.
Yes there are jerk cops out there that will hassel you but that is all they can legally do is give you a hard time during the stop maybe even seize your arms (temporarily) even if it is just to give you trouble. If they make an arrest and I have broken no law, then they have crossed the line from legal to illegal.
If they arrest you without cause then I WILL SUE THEM FOR FALSE ARREST. I will do everything in my power to bring his supervisor, the court and even the media if need be down on him. You are not helpless in the longrun. Yes it may cost you to take him to court but it is worth it for you and for everyone else in the community.
Nobody can be searched or siezed (arrested) without cause or a warrant. Any cop who isn't taught that at the police acadamy (to say nothing of third grade history) should be doing something else for a living apart from LAW Enforcement.

As far as them hasseling you though, that goes back to the original post. Do you worry about whether cops will hassel you because you carry more than one gun on or about your person? Most other people in here seem to believe (some of them even LEOs I think) that it shouldn't be a problem as long as you are within the law.
Even your latest post indicates that it is a minority of police that are likely to give you trouble.
 
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520,

I'm not calling you names. I didn't mean to address any comments to you. If I did, I'm sorry, it was unintentional. I'll rephrase what I said. If I'm on the jury in a case where a civilian with three guns shot somebody, that factor alone is enough that I'm going to give him a second look and wonder whether I believed he could have considered every option other than lethal force. If he's got three guns on him because he's moving, coming back from the range, hunting (like I said, with a .22 plinker, a revolver and a hunting rifle), or he's got another explanation, than it explains all the weaponry, and all's well in my mind. If he's a cop or private security with a sidearm, backup and long gun (or spare pistol in his coat pocket, etc) then, again, it's a different story in my mind.

That said, you tell me you had no choice but to shoot someone, and you were carrying three handguns, yeah, I'm going to wonder if you really had no choice. It doesn't mean that's my final thought, it doesn't mean you can't 100% justify it, but it's a red flag.

Since I think cops are more suspicious than me, I expect multiple guns to be a flag to cops as well. Therefore, I'd worry about what cops might think, and I'd worry about whether having more than one gun will tip the scales against me when a cop is debating arresting me, ticketing me, or otherwise ruining my day.

This doesn't mean you don't have the right to carry three guns, and it certainly doesn't mean that there is no good reason for having more than three guns in your possession at once. To the range, hunting trip, moving, camping, buying and selling, work related, etc. If you just want three at once, then if it's legal, fine. I see it as being a red flag that could get you a second look. It doesn't make it wrong, it just invites a second look.

Doug,

If someone's out to get you, then a long gun and two handguns might make sense. If your not in witness protection, carrying diamonds, a secret agent, a cop whose worried about people he's locked up, or in the business of being sent into harms way (military, cop, some types of security), then why do you think you need two revolvers and an AR15 at all times, and what makes you think you'd survive a situation where you needed that much firepower?
 
Doug - good luck in the lawsuits. Who's paying the lawyers by the way? Have any experience with this?

You ask questions which usually are focused on a touch of exaggerated gun behavior and then you get incensed when folks suggest caution.

Does anyone worry about what cops might think of those who have more than one gun on or about their person?

I frequently travel in my car with a mid sized revolver on my person, a 6 inch N-frame .357 in between my seat (a horsepistol of a sort ) and a little snub nose in my glove compartment for backup. All of them are loaded and I would be required to tell a policeman about them. What would he think about a guy with more than one gun on him?
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So the answer is that there is a risk from some. Some might think you are a touch off. Many might not. That might lead to some more likelihood of arrest. I already told you that a study found that if you had an assault rifle in your car as compared to a shotgun, the officer might treat you more harshly in a minor matter.

That answers your question as a possible risk. Your response is to say what you are doing is legal and you will sue. Fine.

Don't like the answer - don't ask the question. You probably wanted to hear that it was fine and the officer would probably congratulate on being an upstanding defender of law and order. A champion of the 2nd amendment.
 
Doug,

If someone's out to get you, then a long gun and two handguns might make sense. If your not in witness protection, carrying diamonds, a secret agent, a cop whose worried about people he's locked up, or in the business of being sent into harms way (military, cop, some types of security), then why do you think you need two revolvers and an AR15 at all times, and what makes you think you'd survive a situation where you needed that much firepower?
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newerguy,

I haven't even started carrying an AR15 yet, and probably won't do it very often. A lot of people carry rifles and shotguns in their cars.

As far as the other two guns go, many people in here and several gun writers would agree that carrying a backup (the glove comp gun) is a healthy thing. The .357 Highway Patrolman in between the seat is only carried when I am on the highway or in the country as it is a more powerful round that can 1) intimidate just by the site of it (end a gunfight before it starts), 2) penetrates auto bodies better and 3) can handle vicious animals (should I ever happen to encounter one....or if I should hit a deer and have to put him out of his misery :D ). So anyway, each gun has a purpose for being there.
I know I won't need all these guns at all times....in fact when you consider it furthur I won't need ANY gun and any time in all likelyhood, none of us will. Even the average policeman doesn't have to pull his gun except at the range. But they are there in case the "what if" ever happens. Well prepared.



Glenn Meyer,

Sounds like you are the one who is incensed.
 
Carry whatever makes you feel comfortable. Be extra nice to LE if you are pulled over and you will be fine. Trade in those tired wheel guns for a reliable 20th century fightin gun like the Glock. You won't need to carry two guns anymore.
 
newerguy,

Sorry if I misread your intention. So far, it appears that I do not fit your definition of having a reason. However, your concern that I might appear in front of a jury without being able to articulate a reason for three guns is, in my opinion, intelligent forethought. My reason, even though all of the guns I carry are more reliable than Glocks under the anticipated conditions, is access to a gun under the anticipated conditions. I consider it prudent to have at least one gun available to the right hand and at least one gun available to the left hand, and there should be a gun available whether I am seated or standing. There are a number of ways of achieving this, depending on choice of clothing, physical condition and other factors. An upside-down shoulder holster would probably do it with one gun, as would some cross-draw holsters. Neither of these fit my normal mode of dress. Without dragging this out further, the desired availability usually requires two or three guns.

How do YOU access your gun quickly when you are belted into your car?

How do YOU access your gun when you are carrying something else, or when someone grabs your right wrist firmly?
 
what cops think

About two weeks ago I was involved in a civil legal action where I KNEW the PD would be involved. I was assisting in the removal of property from a business (partners splitting up) where the other partner had called 911 on several other occasions. The lawyers were involved and sure enough the 911 call said it was a robbery with "8 guys w/guns & masks". I ALWAYS carry but this time I left my artillery locked in my vehicle. When the cops showed it was just like "COPS" (as I expected). They did a tactical approach-and-apprehend with show your hands-walk towards me-drop to your knees-cuff and search. When they had us secure they checked my wallet and found my CCW and drivers license. "Where is your gun"!!! When I explained that I expected the 911 call and didn't want them "nervous" their attitude got MUCH better. I'm 52 and short haired w/ a neat beard and a white guy. If I had raised my shirt (as instructed) and they saw my 1911 (carried for years) or my FiveseveN (current carry) the tension level would have gone to warp factor 9. One cop said later (about the 911 caller) "What the hell is wrong with them-someone could end up shot over a BS call." They were especially worried about the FN. "What do you need that for,we don't like those pistols." Was I legal ? YES. Could I carry? YES. Was it smart not to? You decide. When they asked why I carry I gave my usual reply-Because I can & I'll never be an easy victim. That was something they understood.
 
520,

You've got a point. I must say that, while your reason for carrying multiple guns still makes your practice different that what most people do, it's one I can understand. I agree that with most modes of carry, other than a sholder holster, you can't easily draw a gun while wearing a seat belt. Come to think of it, my father used to always stick his between the seat and the seat back. He was a cop, and it didn't matter, technically, if it was visible (in NYS, cops don't need to keep their guns concealed, obviously, and if he got stopped, he woundn't be in any trouble). If I was carrying, I wouldn't be able to keep hold of something in my right hand and draw a gun. I'm not saying that I share your concern, but I can understand it. My bother's a New York City cop, and he doesn't carry a backup gun, but said some guys do, and one reason they carry in an ankle holster is so they can get to it if they are on the ground fighting someone.

Doug,

Not many people carry loaded rifles or shotguns in thier cars in my neck of the woods (technically, that's an Enviornmental Conservation Law violation in New York). I can't speak for other parts of the country. I I've said my bit, I think Glenn's given this more thought than I have, and has problably put his thoughts togeather better than me. Do what you want. I think you're risking the bad kind of attention. Both threegun and jarhead make some other valid points.

Jarhead, sounds like you kept yourself out of trouble by thinking before getting into something. They teach you that at TBS, or did you learn the hardway? (Neither for me, I had more excuses than guts, but I know some real proud Marines.)
 
Again I just want to remind people that stolen guns are used in crimes. Your gun can be used to rob, rape, and kill if someone steals it.
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I'm really not sure I get the logic behind this line of thought. Scotland is now in the process of knife "buy-backs" because of escalating knife inflicted injuries.

Would you hold yourself liable if someone broke into your home, stole a nice long butcher knife from your knife block, and then used it to rob, force a woman to submit to rape, or kill someone?

Philadelphia was a hub of baseball bat related deaths a few years back. Quiet, no waiting periods, and even if someone survived such an assault, they (even if willing) might just well be too vegetive to testify at trial.

Should someone burglarize you and steal a baseball bat, would you hold yourself responsible for any mayhem that followed?

Do you have a super secure knive safe? A secreted paneled baseball bat hidey hole? No? Hmmm...me neither.

I think I'd blame the scumbag(s) who stole my knives, baseball bats, tire irons, axes or kaiser blades from my woodshed, limbs off of one of my trees, or even rocks from my driveway and used them to commit a crime. If you think differently about any of the above, you are being inconsistant.

Why do you draw the line at holding firearms owners responsible for thuggery usage of something stolen from them???

Daid is daid. Raped is raped. Robbed is robbed.
 
newerguy said:
I must say that, while your reason for carrying multiple guns still makes your practice different that what most people do, it's one I can understand.
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You don't know what most people do (nor do I).
 
I seem to be posting in a plethora of these threads tonight... :rolleyes:

When we finally get CCW here in WI, I'll be carrying three (usually): .45 1991 Compact IWB @3:30, Taurus 850 IWB @ 10 (available to either hand), and a Smith 19 .357 in my vest (my "colors"). Should an officer stop me, and I have to disclose, I'll be more than happy to let him know where each is, and allow him to disarm me (if he feels it is necessary). My biggest fear isn't being seens as "extreme", it's unning into an officer who feels the ned to disarm me, but is unfamiliar with the MOA of the weapons in question...
 
I just wanted to say that here in TN we have "Handgun Carry Permits" that cover loaded long guns as well. We're not required to conceal our handgun(s), tho most do. Most everyone I know carries two, one being a NAA .22, sorta like a group thing. It may do the job. At least there is hope. The other in most cases is a Glock, tho I usally carry the S&W 696. Single action is my first pick, but mine are too big to carry around, & my tied down holster wouldn't look to good in the mall:rolleyes:
 
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