An unknown gun?Pls check it.

I think gun lovers in the forum will pay me a price.
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You are correct that guns can not be sold on Ebay. As far as selling it on the forum, I should warn you that selling a gun outside of your own country can be very difficult to do because of legal restrictions, and probably the process would be very expensive.

If you can find a buyer in your country that would probably be much better. I have no idea what the gun laws are like in your country, but you should check them before advertising it.
 
TO arcticap

I know what your say.But why the gift is gun.I don't like firearm,I hate the war,hate everything have realationship with war.I don't want to pass it down,though it's a gift from my grandfather.

Peace for ever!!!!
 
I know what your say.But why the gift is gun.I don't like firearm,I hate the war,hate everything have realationship with war.I don't want to pass it down,though it's a gift from my grandfather.
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The gun is not the only gift, it is only a symbol of the real gift. The more you hold it the better, and then after a while you will understand how it changed your life and then you can get rid of it.
The gun is just a material thing, but the gift lasts forever!

Peace!:)
 
My grandfather isn't a hunting man.He never hunted.He told me nothing except it's a officer's old shotgun.

To arcticap

Thank you.You are so kind to let me hold my dream.

One world,One dream.
 
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I used what I could see of the bullet/shot weight and black powder weight. Using FF BP, it seems to be comparable to a HOT 12 gage load. Also, the markings look very much like the Nepalnese markings on the old muskets and rifles being sold now from their armory. It truly fits with a Nepal/Idian/Brit style of 1840's or so. Some of the screw heads look newer and centered, usually hand made screws have the center line off just a little and not as pefectly rounded off as the ones in the pics.

It looks like a Fowling piece for Lords and Officers, although the weight of it totally throws me off, that is close to 38 pounds if you truly mean 16kilo. That sure does seem heavy for a 12 gage no matter how hot the black powder load is or would have been. It does not look that heavy though. There does not seem to be a trindle, trundel or bi-pod attachment. It may have been laid on the shoulder of a hunting assistant and fired that way if it is that heavy. I also notice there are no below the barrel notches or holders for a ram rod.

The rifles and muskets coming out of the Nepal armories, seem to be going for around $600 to $1200 and there are a few shot guns in that mix but nothing that heavy. Those triple circle marks are on some of the muskets, but those muskets are French, Britt and Prussian depending on which Nepal firearm it may be, so it could be an import to Nepal or China mark ?? .

The guy that owns and runs Sportsman Guide in Minnesota is a Nepal firearm nut, maybe he can identify it, he used to have a ton of the firearms for sale. Also Atlantic Cutlery Corp sells the Nepal pieces and maybe they can identify it...http://www.atlantacutlery.com/p-1566-percussion-hunting-fowler-rifle.aspx

No, it cannot be sold on eBay. To sell on any site other than a chinese site would require a export and import permission, not all that hard to get USA BATFE import approval since it is an antique and black powder, but lord knows China wise what would be required.

I would first look into selling it to a Chinese Museum of some sort, rather than trying to sell it to someone outside of China. I believe if you desire to sell it outside of China, the UK would be your best bet.

If it were me, I would get it ID'd, clean it, oil it and hang it in the home somewhere. It is NOT a WAR firearm. It is a sporting firearm of some sorts for sure.

Hope this helps

Regards
Gringo Grande -

P.S. I personally am not for a one world, one dream, I enjoy my country, the USA just the way it is minus the liberals and dems.
 
TO GringoGrande

WOW!!!So cool,What a detailly explaintion you are!Thank you for your advice.I will think it carefully,then make a decision.
Are you sure that it may come out of the Nepal armories?Why?The Nepal's firearm is very famous or something else.I am know nothing about Nepal.


Can you give me some advice in how to maintant firearms?You can see it almost get rusty.How to clean?How to oil?
 
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I wasn't aware of any general restrictions or that BATF approval was needed to import black powder guns into the U.S., only import duties.
Have you heard about any specific restrictions on importing black powder guns into the U.S. simply because it's from China?
Shipping it anywhere overseas would probably be expensive and the British import duties might be even more expensive than in the U.S..
But I do agree that selling it in China would save some money. Perhaps there are antique or specialty shops in Hong Kong that could offer it for sale to a foreign gun collector, local businessman or tourist?
 
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Not so much a restriction as it is a certification by BATF, then what ever state department rules and conditions apply.

I am not sure what cleaning products you have in china so:

FIRST and FOREMOST: determine if it is loaded: Use any king of wood rod and place down the barrels, mark the wood rod where the tip of the front f the barrel is (muzzel). Then take the rod out and lay next to the barrel, even or flush with the breech or where the back of the barrels end on the outside. if the mark is below where the muzzel is, it is loaded, if it is even with the muzzel, then it is unloaded: IF IT IS LOADED DO NOT DO ANYTHING TO IT: TAKE IT TO A GUN SMITH IF THEY ARE AVAILABLE THERE OR SOMEONE WHO KNOWs BLACK POWDER GUNS AND KNOWS HOW TO REMOVE THE BULLET VIA A SCREW TIP ROD OR AIR HOSE ON THE NIPPLES. Old black powder is stabil as it does not have any nitro, tolulene or glycerine in it. After it is unloaded, rinse out with HOT water and measure again with the marked stick until you get it even with the back of the barrel to the mark on the stick.

For over all cleaning the rust off, automotive automatic transmission fluid with a soft paint brush and then rinse with kerosene or white gas until the rust is down to metal. Then coat the metal with NEW plain auto motive engine oil inside and out.

If you do not have automotive or gun oils there, just use straight mineral oil aka clear baby oil. DO NOT USE animal fats or animal oils as this will corrode the metal even further.

The stock I would just clean with a good furniture cleaner if avail and if not, use oil soap like a Murphys and if that is not avail a pine based floor cleaner or floor cleaner used on wood. Then allow it to dry, then use almost any kind of furniture wax on it.

To be honest though, I would NOT clean it until you truly find out what it is as cleaning it may ruin any collector value it may have. based on the pictures, it does not look as big as has been stated, maybe a picture with a human holding it would help. The thickness of the barrels wall does not match what a normal punt gun barrel wall thickness would be, it looks more standard wall thickness. Plus there is a sling hole for a leather or hemp rope sling that does not look HUGE as it would have to be for a 38 pound, 2 bore punt gun. Something is not adding up here, so a pic with an average sized human would help a lot.

In China, I know there are NO so called Gun Shops as they use Gun Brokers, so using a Gun Broker may help identify the gun and also allow some estimate on actual value.

If it is a Nepal PUNT GUN, it can be worth up to $30,000 in the rusted condition, but I am highly doubting it is a Punt Gun due to being double barreled and the thin wall thickness of the barrels......and am betting it is just a sporting field gun used by lords and officers.

Regards,
Steve
 
The markings are in English, though a very imperfect English. That indicates that the gun was made somewhere that English influence was strong and where it might be passed off as an English product. I think that would not have been true in China; a gun made to sell in China would probably have markings in Chinese, not English.

I hate to keep blaming that sort of work on Darra Pass in Pakistan/Afghanistan, but that gun is like some guns made in that general area. It is not a home made gun in the sense of something put together in a basement. There is an original design and clear evidence of the use of some machinery, yet it is not European or American.

Jim
 
Thank you guys.I learn more gun Knowledge from this topic.Thank you for share.

To GringoGrande
Thank you for your advice.I will listen to you.First clean it,oil it and hang it up in my guestroom.Maybe I counld buy a Deer-head hang it together.When I have some home-party,I will be pound to tell my friends."This is my grandfather's Booty".WOW,what a great gun I have.
 
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The gun is marked "Xinhua", and a Google search of Xinhua lists:

1. The city of Xinhua, Taiwan. The area was controlled by the Dutch East India Trading Company by 1636 until 1662. The Dutch started hunting Taiwan's sitka deer and it eventually became extinct, so there's a tradition of hunting on the island.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xinhua,_Tainan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tainan_County

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiwan

2. Xinhua is also the name of the official Chinese news agency.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xinhua_News_Agency

3. A company named Xinhua China Ltd.

http://www.hoovers.com/xinhua-china/--ID__120003--/free-co-factsheet.xhtml

According to the official county website:

The name Sinhua was given in 1920 by the Japanese when the Sinhua Prefecture of Tainan State was established.

http://web1.tainan.gov.tw/english/CP/11813/Sinhua-1.aspx
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Map (See letter W):

http://web1.tainan.gov.tw/english/CP/11813/index.aspx

It makes sense that this gun could somehow be connected to Taiwan, but that would mean that it might not have been made until after 1920 with some Japanese influence a possibility.
Does the name Xinhua have any other meaning, like as a family name?
Maybe a Japanese gun collector would be interested in buying it? :rolleyes:

See "Japanese Rule":

Imperial Japan had sought to control Taiwan since 1592....

The Japanese were instrumental in the industrialization of the island...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiwan
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Thank you.arcticap,You suggestion is very very important.

I think the first suggestion is possibly.Holand used English and they came to Taiwan in 1622.In their occupation period they created a lot of weapons.They have killed a large number of deer for the deerskin.But "xinhua" in TaiWan is a new name from 1920.It called "TAVOCAN" in early period.Is it a gun made in 1900's?I think it's much more early.
 
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The name "Xinhua" may have been in common use by the Japanese much earlier than the official name change. Maybe it even has a meaning in Japanese, but for sure this is an important city with a long history.
I just can't see the name "Xinhua" not having some significance especially in those early days when it was not in common usage like it is today.
I understand that there are many language dialects and words and names may have different meanings.
But in the end "Xinhua" must mean something in some language besides being just a trade name.
The Japanese were fighting wars there.
I find it difficult to understand why the word "Xinhua" is used in China today and given to a such a large & important news agency. I like the name but where does it come from? I guess that it has become just a name, now just another Chinese name. But back then it was only the name of a city.
And for some reason the English writing was added to make the gun more salable to English speaking people who had a presence in China at the time.
In this time period, I think that many exotic & tropical birds were still being shot for their colorful feathers to decorate hats, even military hats. :)

http://www.geocities.com/felicitax/Hats.htm

Fortunes were paid by rich individuals for exotic feathered hats. Gorgeous feathered hats could command as much as £100 in the early Edwardian era. The Edwardians were masters in the art of excess and the flamboyant hats of the era are a clear example of this.
At one point whole stuffed birds were used to decorate hats, but as the new more enlightened century emerged, protests were voiced. In America the Audubon society expressed concern and in England the RSPB (Royal Society for the Protection of Birds) campaigned for ecological understanding.

http://www.fashion-era.com/hats-hair/hats_hair_1_wearing_hats_fashion_history.htm#Plumassiers
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"Maybe it even has a meaning in Japanese"

Nope. There are no syllables in Japanese equivalent to Xin/Hsin + Hua. Closest would be しんふあ　 -- shinfua -- but there's no such word in Japanese.
 
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Interesting piece.

I think the gun was made either in Pakistan or somewhere in China. The Chinese were known to copy guns and mark them as if they were made elsewhere. Copies ranged from good to primitive. The engraving on the depicted gun has been crudely executed. The bordering rings were all stamped and not engraved.

If a sliver of wood falls out, a university may be able to determine the tree it came from and if that's done, the national origin of the gun.
 
Today when I take the lift,I find the sign of three circle.It's the Company of ThyssenKrupp Elevator.It's Germany lift company.The sign is Similar to this gun.Is there something Associated?
 
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No, that's more of a corporation logo or commercial trademark. Here's another compnay logo with 3 rings:

beer_mat2.jpg


If you click on the PDF below and go to page 22, you will see a Spanish proof mark with 3 circles. Every country's proof house has their own markings.

That's why I thought that the 3 circles on your resembles a proof mark.

On page 10 it shows that Belgium uses a single circle as a proof mark for some devices.

That could mean that your gun has a proofmark or that the maker wanted it to look like a proofmark. Because the mark was used twice, it looks like it was meant to look like each barrel was individually proofed.

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/hearings/20061004/imco/genco_en.pdf
 
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