Another point to ponder. If there are any cigar smokers like me, do you remember when it became fashionable with the Hollywood/entertainment crowd? Lots of crap cigars flooding the market, quality names out of stock, does this sound familiar? As soon as the newbies who have no real interest in continuing shooting, lose interest it will get back to normal. Just like I can now find all the cigars I want (except for Fuente Fuente Opus X, if anyone has any throwaways they don't need, let me know).
AMMO SHORTAGE, thoughts, opinions.
- Thread starter trigger treat
- Start date
I guess Im going to let the cat out of the bag and confess, at my preferred store (IL), there isnt much of an ammo shortage. The price is much higher but pistol ammo is on the shelves 2 or 3 boxes high and 2 deep. 50 count boxes of 9mm, 40, 45 and 22 Im not 100% sure about .357 or .38 because I havent shot any in awhile.
But that said, 50 rds of 45 is $29 and the other calibers are slightly less. Im not sure about .223 because I havent needed any in awhile but they had plenty of 7.62x39 not sure about price. So I dont know, maybe our gun store owner is one of the hoarders
But that said, 50 rds of 45 is $29 and the other calibers are slightly less. Im not sure about .223 because I havent needed any in awhile but they had plenty of 7.62x39 not sure about price. So I dont know, maybe our gun store owner is one of the hoarders
Average Joe
New member
I agree, these ammo threads just add fuel to the fire.
inSight-NEO
New member
While I do prefer shotguns and semi-autos, I also like revolvers. Doesnt matter much though, I cant find what Im wanting for any of these weapons...revolvers included.
Personally, I think this ammo gobbling situation is ridiculous and quite inconvenient; not just for myself, but for everyone. However, I understand the various reasons behind the current ammo shortage and therefore, just try to take it in stride. I can whine and complain all day, but it just wont help matters much. Besides, Im much more concerned about various rumors surrounding future ammo restrictions than I am about the current shortage.
Regardless, for now I will just keep searching for what I need and if I find it, great! If not, I will simply keep searching. Besides, there is much more to life than wasting time fretting (too much, anyway) over all of this nonsense.
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christcorp
New member
In the last 4 days, I've received from online vendors, 45acp, 357mag, 38 special, 380, and 32 auto. You just need to know where to look. And if you look hard enough, it isn't an arm and a leg either.
A Different Point Of View On Ammo Supply
Hi Guys,
I worked at a prison a few miles down the road from Ammo To Go. It was boring as heck around the area. I went to see ATG just for something to do and because the guys are really nice to visit with. They warned me three years ago that an ammo bust was coming and I listened very carefully.
When they said that a certain caliber was drying up, I bought some. They told me on each visit that the price of each amount of ammo I purchased was below their current COST! This situation was developing long before anyone considered Obama could be elected. It's not his fault!
I had no interest in hoarding nor did I consider the SHTF paranoia. I am close to retirement and simply wanted enough "stuff" to piddle with after I quit work when I wouldn't have the money to purchase ammo. I bought a little of each caliber so I could continue doing my hobby stuff.
While .22 bricks were plentiful, I bought some of them, as well. Not a mountain of it.....just a bit. I preached to my gun clubs and to my shooting buddies to do the same and they laughed at me.
The problem is a many sided one. We used to buy Turkish Mauser dirty ammo at 4 cents per round. Heck, the value of the raw materials in each round is higher than that now! We lose our US nickle coins because the material in them is worth more than 5 cents! No one is going to let us have that brass, copper and lead cheaply when they can make things out of it and sell us finished products instead!
Once ammo started disappearing, the knee jerk reaction was to buy at any price. The last hurricane in Houston had a similar effect on gasoline sales. The system is set up on a random sales concept. I buy today, you buy tomorrow. During Ike, we ALL wanted fuel RIGHT NOW and you couldn't buy any at @ $10/gallon
These things are true:
Some tried to warn us but most folks slept while the problem developed.
I personally saw a WALL of 7.62X54R dwindle to a couple of cases at ATG. They aren't holding it back. They can't get it at all.
The ammo problem was years in the making and it will be years in the solution.
The raw materials are going so high that we will never see 4 cent Mauser ammo again even if it was crap. Get used to paying more for ammo because China wants the brass and copper and will pay a high price for it. We are in a world market and must stand in line to get the material just like the rest. If someone else wants it more than you do and can pay the market price, you won't get any. China is doing the best job of metal casting of any country in the world. Virtually any product made of cast metal is coming from China. If you have to do without something so they can prosper, welcome to the new world market.
The president, whether you like him or not, was not responsible for this shortage.
The panic buying will subside and the market will return again to random purchase discipline just as fuel availability did in Houston.
Yes, there is a war taking place on several fronts and it uses up a lot of material.
Flash
Hi Guys,
I worked at a prison a few miles down the road from Ammo To Go. It was boring as heck around the area. I went to see ATG just for something to do and because the guys are really nice to visit with. They warned me three years ago that an ammo bust was coming and I listened very carefully.
When they said that a certain caliber was drying up, I bought some. They told me on each visit that the price of each amount of ammo I purchased was below their current COST! This situation was developing long before anyone considered Obama could be elected. It's not his fault!
I had no interest in hoarding nor did I consider the SHTF paranoia. I am close to retirement and simply wanted enough "stuff" to piddle with after I quit work when I wouldn't have the money to purchase ammo. I bought a little of each caliber so I could continue doing my hobby stuff.
While .22 bricks were plentiful, I bought some of them, as well. Not a mountain of it.....just a bit. I preached to my gun clubs and to my shooting buddies to do the same and they laughed at me.
The problem is a many sided one. We used to buy Turkish Mauser dirty ammo at 4 cents per round. Heck, the value of the raw materials in each round is higher than that now! We lose our US nickle coins because the material in them is worth more than 5 cents! No one is going to let us have that brass, copper and lead cheaply when they can make things out of it and sell us finished products instead!
Once ammo started disappearing, the knee jerk reaction was to buy at any price. The last hurricane in Houston had a similar effect on gasoline sales. The system is set up on a random sales concept. I buy today, you buy tomorrow. During Ike, we ALL wanted fuel RIGHT NOW and you couldn't buy any at @ $10/gallon
These things are true:
Some tried to warn us but most folks slept while the problem developed.
I personally saw a WALL of 7.62X54R dwindle to a couple of cases at ATG. They aren't holding it back. They can't get it at all.
The ammo problem was years in the making and it will be years in the solution.
The raw materials are going so high that we will never see 4 cent Mauser ammo again even if it was crap. Get used to paying more for ammo because China wants the brass and copper and will pay a high price for it. We are in a world market and must stand in line to get the material just like the rest. If someone else wants it more than you do and can pay the market price, you won't get any. China is doing the best job of metal casting of any country in the world. Virtually any product made of cast metal is coming from China. If you have to do without something so they can prosper, welcome to the new world market.
The president, whether you like him or not, was not responsible for this shortage.
The panic buying will subside and the market will return again to random purchase discipline just as fuel availability did in Houston.
Yes, there is a war taking place on several fronts and it uses up a lot of material.
Flash
UtahHunting
New member
Roger ^^^^^^^
I respectfully disagree with your post. The raw cost of materials have come down lately......ALOT as matter of fact. They have not gone up, unless they are casting ammo out of gold.
I respectfully disagree with your post. The raw cost of materials have come down lately......ALOT as matter of fact. They have not gone up, unless they are casting ammo out of gold.
One More Time.........
Sure, the price of metal is going to fluctuate as it always has. Most of the scrap yards POST the current prices they will pay as a result of the nature of the market. The fact remains that certain developing countries are sucking up materials at dizzy rate and when that happens, our reloading benches are going to get hit hard.
If China or India will pay 10 cents a pound more for brass than you will........you lose. If our ammo manufacturers pay 20 cents over market for brass, we will be swimming in it.............. But what will the ammo cost the consumer?
Like I wrote in the original post, this is a complex issue. Looking at a single side of the problem will not show the whole picture. It's like the blind men describing an elephant. One rubbed the trunk and stated the elephant was tubular and long. One examined the tail and said an elephant was long and skinny. We know that neither was correct. If you feel more comfortable blaming Obama, then get after it. He's no friend of mine, either. However, he is not responsible for the current ammo shortage.
Flash
Sure, the price of metal is going to fluctuate as it always has. Most of the scrap yards POST the current prices they will pay as a result of the nature of the market. The fact remains that certain developing countries are sucking up materials at dizzy rate and when that happens, our reloading benches are going to get hit hard.
If China or India will pay 10 cents a pound more for brass than you will........you lose. If our ammo manufacturers pay 20 cents over market for brass, we will be swimming in it.............. But what will the ammo cost the consumer?
Like I wrote in the original post, this is a complex issue. Looking at a single side of the problem will not show the whole picture. It's like the blind men describing an elephant. One rubbed the trunk and stated the elephant was tubular and long. One examined the tail and said an elephant was long and skinny. We know that neither was correct. If you feel more comfortable blaming Obama, then get after it. He's no friend of mine, either. However, he is not responsible for the current ammo shortage.
Flash
Prices always go up and rarely do they ever go down, and thats on anything. Even if the demand goes down and the panic buying stops, unfortunately I doubt we'll ever see prices like we use to.
Gas prices are about half of what they were a year ago so I am really hoping for the same for ammo. Hey, one can hope can't they?
Gas prices are about half of what they were a year ago so I am really hoping for the same for ammo. Hey, one can hope can't they?
christcorp
New member
It is a bubble and it has to burst. Why? Simple; eventually all the paranoid people will have the ammo they are wanting. It's been said many times and it's still true. There are different types of people buying ammo. But only a small percentage are buying cases and cases of ammo. The problem currently is that there are MILLIONS of new buyers and those who rarely shoot the gun they have that have gone out BASICALLY ALL AT ONE TIME; and have bought ammunition. Even if these people only bought 5 boxes just to protect themselves with, that's a crap load of ammo. It is estimated that 1 in 5 people own at least 1 gun. That's roughly 70 million people. Of those; more than half basically have a gun for self defense purposes. They rarely if ever go shooting. They don't belong to a range and they've had the gun a long time. Of the other 35 million, probably only about 1/4th (8 million) shoot on a regular basis for fun, sport, hunting, etc... These people buy ammo on a regular basis. They shoot a lot of ammunition. Throw in a few extra (Call it an even 15 million); and that's what the manufacturers and market were probably geared up to produce. This is on top of the requirements by law enforcement and the military; as well as exports.
Now; if because of paranoia, the other 55 million people with guns decide they better buy some ammunition in case it becomes difficult to purchase in the future; a simple 3-5 boxes each could increase the normal supply requirements 400%. Then throw in a small percentage of those buying cases at a time. Throw in the law enforcement agencies who many times start their order in the first of the year because of their budgets; and you are looking at too much of a demand all at the wrong time.
Well, of those additional 55 million gun owners, most of them will be content with their 5-10 boxes once they have them. To them 250-500 is more than they'll ever use. And with the price of ammo, they become content. Law Enforcement and the military will get theirs first. Then the demand will slow down considerably.
You can already see it in the shops. Of our 3 gun shops, 1 walmart, and 1 sports authority; there isn't 1 caliber of ammunition that I can't find. I even bought a box of 380 at walmart a few days ago, Are the prices a little higher than "Normal"? Yes. But those too will come down. But the ammo is available. Matter of fact, between the 3 gun shops, I can get any primers, powder, and bullets I might want. The same couldn't be said a couple months ago.
I say that in a few month; NLT 1 September; the "Non-Regular" shooters will have their fill of ammunition. They will have bought any new guns and ammo they needed/wanted. That will cut the demand in half. The uber paranoid who are buying/holding cases of ammo (Aren't regular shooters); will also slow down in their purchases. If for no other reason than economics. (Then they'll be trying to figure out how they're going to sell some of it). And the regular shooter (Those who shoot at least one weekend a month and usually have numerous/multiple guns); either reload or have always had enough ammo, and had online sources. It's the walmarts and the superstores like sportsman's warehouse, sports authority, cabelas, etc... that are the normal go-to places that are really out of stock. If you look at the mom and pops and the smaller online sources, you'll find what you're looking for.
Now; if because of paranoia, the other 55 million people with guns decide they better buy some ammunition in case it becomes difficult to purchase in the future; a simple 3-5 boxes each could increase the normal supply requirements 400%. Then throw in a small percentage of those buying cases at a time. Throw in the law enforcement agencies who many times start their order in the first of the year because of their budgets; and you are looking at too much of a demand all at the wrong time.
Well, of those additional 55 million gun owners, most of them will be content with their 5-10 boxes once they have them. To them 250-500 is more than they'll ever use. And with the price of ammo, they become content. Law Enforcement and the military will get theirs first. Then the demand will slow down considerably.
You can already see it in the shops. Of our 3 gun shops, 1 walmart, and 1 sports authority; there isn't 1 caliber of ammunition that I can't find. I even bought a box of 380 at walmart a few days ago, Are the prices a little higher than "Normal"? Yes. But those too will come down. But the ammo is available. Matter of fact, between the 3 gun shops, I can get any primers, powder, and bullets I might want. The same couldn't be said a couple months ago.
I say that in a few month; NLT 1 September; the "Non-Regular" shooters will have their fill of ammunition. They will have bought any new guns and ammo they needed/wanted. That will cut the demand in half. The uber paranoid who are buying/holding cases of ammo (Aren't regular shooters); will also slow down in their purchases. If for no other reason than economics. (Then they'll be trying to figure out how they're going to sell some of it). And the regular shooter (Those who shoot at least one weekend a month and usually have numerous/multiple guns); either reload or have always had enough ammo, and had online sources. It's the walmarts and the superstores like sportsman's warehouse, sports authority, cabelas, etc... that are the normal go-to places that are really out of stock. If you look at the mom and pops and the smaller online sources, you'll find what you're looking for.
Is it really that bad???
I went to one gun shop Saturday May 16th that is a little out of the way (35 mins vs. 15) and they had anythin I wanted 10 boxes to a case for 'reasonable' prices. I went to another that was right in the thick of things here that was hurting, badly.
At the first I could get any popular handgun or rifle caliber, certainly all the NATO stuff for probably 30-50% more than I would have paid a year ago. Not ideal, but not worth all of this fuss.
Are you guys all seeing more like what I saw in the second shop? If so, you might want to try some place out of the way - call ahead and if you build a relationship they'll likely hold ammo for you.
In Columbus, OH I would love to see Vance's go bankrupt. I know they are 'out of the way' but they are really the only game in town. You might want to call out around Stubenville or down into Vance county.
Anyway, you've got all the nice bucks even if you have to shoot them with a bow. I'll drive out some ammo if you put me on a pope and young!!!
I went to one gun shop Saturday May 16th that is a little out of the way (35 mins vs. 15) and they had anythin I wanted 10 boxes to a case for 'reasonable' prices. I went to another that was right in the thick of things here that was hurting, badly.
At the first I could get any popular handgun or rifle caliber, certainly all the NATO stuff for probably 30-50% more than I would have paid a year ago. Not ideal, but not worth all of this fuss.
Are you guys all seeing more like what I saw in the second shop? If so, you might want to try some place out of the way - call ahead and if you build a relationship they'll likely hold ammo for you.
In Columbus, OH I would love to see Vance's go bankrupt. I know they are 'out of the way' but they are really the only game in town. You might want to call out around Stubenville or down into Vance county.
Anyway, you've got all the nice bucks even if you have to shoot them with a bow. I'll drive out some ammo if you put me on a pope and young!!!
I have been reading all the "ammo shortage" threads with interest. Sophijo's post that this shortage is similar phenomenon with post 911 and YK2 shortages. Is this true? I have been shooting on a weekly basis only for a few years, before that it was once or twice a year and I really paid no attention to prices. So I wasn't aware of shortages post 911 or y2k. So my question to you guys that have been active shooters during those times, is the current shortage similar to what happened in the past? If so how long did they last?
I've been shooting since the '50s and I've never seen anything even remotely similar to this shortage.
By pure coincidence, I finally decided on what I wanted and bought a $1000 Kimber Stainless Gold Match a day or two before Y2K and distinctly remember buying 6 different brands of ammo to try. The place was packed shoulder to shoulder and one guy actually asked me why I was buying so much ammo - I figure he was buying his first gun since he had an entry-level gun and just one box of ammo. The sales guy told me my total bill and the guy's eyes got real big. Anyway, I've never seen an ammo shortage like this.
John
By pure coincidence, I finally decided on what I wanted and bought a $1000 Kimber Stainless Gold Match a day or two before Y2K and distinctly remember buying 6 different brands of ammo to try. The place was packed shoulder to shoulder and one guy actually asked me why I was buying so much ammo - I figure he was buying his first gun since he had an entry-level gun and just one box of ammo. The sales guy told me my total bill and the guy's eyes got real big. Anyway, I've never seen an ammo shortage like this.
John
christcorp
New member
Only those who shoot guns for sport or plinking need a lot of ammo. All others are simply paranoid. In real life, they wouldn't be able to shoot 100 rounds let alone thousands. LE agencies would know if you're shooting a thousand rounds. But if you want it to plink with, there's merit in that argument.
Ammo Shortage
Forget Ammo, do you have a year's supply of food on hand? Or even one month? How about water? I am not trying to start a grocery shortage, but those who don't prepare are assuming everything will always be the same. I hope it will be but the start of an emergency or a disaster is not the time to prepare for it.
Don't ever count on the Government for anything, especially anything widespread or major.
I have ammo but there again I shoot 5000 to 10000 rounds a year, I should take up something less expensive like Race Car Driving, Flying or Sailing. Do I have enough ammo, who knows?
Forget Ammo, do you have a year's supply of food on hand? Or even one month? How about water? I am not trying to start a grocery shortage, but those who don't prepare are assuming everything will always be the same. I hope it will be but the start of an emergency or a disaster is not the time to prepare for it.
Don't ever count on the Government for anything, especially anything widespread or major.
I have ammo but there again I shoot 5000 to 10000 rounds a year, I should take up something less expensive like Race Car Driving, Flying or Sailing. Do I have enough ammo, who knows?
jimmythejug
Inactive
Well....
....I'm just dang frustrated because I have a groovy new Sig P226 and the 200 rounds I've been able to accumulate over the past 5 weeks won't last that long at the range. I've managed only one trip to the range and am down to 150 rounds.
I have 50 9mm hollow points, which is way more than a lifetime's worth of personal protection, so I'm covered there, excepting a zombie apocalypse. I just want to work on my marksmanship but I'll have to wait until the stupidity ends. Bad timing, I guess.
I'm calling Sig Sauer tomorrow and ordering the 22 conversion kit for my gun.
....I'm just dang frustrated because I have a groovy new Sig P226 and the 200 rounds I've been able to accumulate over the past 5 weeks won't last that long at the range. I've managed only one trip to the range and am down to 150 rounds.
I have 50 9mm hollow points, which is way more than a lifetime's worth of personal protection, so I'm covered there, excepting a zombie apocalypse. I just want to work on my marksmanship but I'll have to wait until the stupidity ends. Bad timing, I guess.
I'm calling Sig Sauer tomorrow and ordering the 22 conversion kit for my gun.