Advantages of revolvers over semi autos

The barrel/slide WILL be moving backwards at some velocity (wrt the ground) when the bullet exits the barrel, and it will have already moved a (very) short distance backward.
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Not shown in a number of high speed videos. The bullet is clearly out of the barrel and the slide is still locked in place.

Here's a video at 1 million frames per second. The gun is clearly a semi-auto, the bullet is clear of the barrel, and the slide has not moved.

Bullet Exiting Barrel

There are a number of other high speed videos available on YouTube and that refute your assertion that the slide is moving backwards when the bullet exits the barrel.

If your assertion is that the entire gun is moving backward due to recoil - it's the same for a revolver.
 
If your assertion is that the entire gun is moving backward due to recoil - it's the same for a revolver.
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It's similar ... the barrel has to have a non-zero aft velocity when the bullet leaves the barrel in both cases. How much aft velocity is determined by the muzzle velocity of the bullet, multiplied by the ratio of the mass of the bullet vs the mass of THE PART OF THE GUN THAT IS MOVING AFT. In the case of the revolver, that latter mass is the entire gun. In the case of the semi-auto, the barrel and slide (together) initially start to move aft, with little initial aft motion by the frame, because the frame feels the recoil momentum caused by the bullet's momentum ONLY via the recoil spring. As the slide moves aft more than the frame does, the recoil spring gets more compressed, and increases the aft force on the frame. By the time the slide reaches its rear-most position, the frame and slide are no longer moving with respect to one another. Also, as the recoil increases as the bullet gets farther down the barrel (and is speeding up), the mass of the shooter's arms start to get a share of some of the recoil momentum of the gun ... that happens for both semi-autos and for revolvers, although it starts to happen sooner for the revolver, because the grip of the revolver is rigidly attached to the barrel (instead of being connected via a recoil spring). The firmness of the shooter's grip, and the rigidity versus flexing of his joints, also influences when the shooter's mass starts to participate in the recoil momentum.
 
45_auto - awesome post. Thank you very much for sharing! And for proving, regardless of whether it effects performance, that a slide does move before the bullet exits.

Sharkbite - by your ability to ignore facts or their application to real life I'm guessing you are a Trump supporter? (No offense intended to other Trump supporters, I'm a fellow Republican, but I couldn't resist some well-intentioned ribbing.) :)

Dahermit - I completely agree.

buckhorn_cortez - really? After the video I posted at 1,000,000 frames per second showing the slide and barrel moving backwards locked together before the bullet exited and also after 45_auto's physics proof validating physical observations? I guess we should both sit next to each other and I'll call the sky blue while you call it green. BTW, the earth is round, not flat.
 
Sharkbite - by your ability to ignore facts or their application to real life I'm guessing you are a Trump supporter? (No offense intended to other Trump supporters, I'm a fellow Republican, but I couldn't resist some well-intentioned ribbing.)
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Im not willing to get into political viewpoints, but i would suggest taking off the pocket protector and looking at "the real world".

If the slide movement cost 5fps, id be amazed. And you will get more then 5fps variation from shot to shot, based on ammo variations.

So, if your loss is hidden in the normal variation...i still contend that it does not matter in any REAL terms. Certainly not in the context of the OP's queation. Rev vs. Auto
 
I'm late to the party and I haven't taken the time to read the entire thread, but here is my 2 cents:

There are a number of good reasons to choose a revolver over an autoloader. First, they have a very simple manual of arms. In other words, they are simple to use. There is no magazine to lose or become damaged. As a handloader, I appreciate not having to chase brass. There is no "power band" issues regarding proper cycling of the action as the motive force for the action is entirely manual. What that means is that I can have a single revolver chambered in, say, .357 Magnum and be able to shoot everything from full strength magnum blasters down to minimum power "bunny fart" .38 Special wadcutters and have no problem with underpowered rounds not being able to properly work the action. There is no feed ramp, thus there won't be any problems with bullet shape and proper feeding unless you are trying to use speedloaders. With many revolvers, there is a wide variety of grip options available that can accommodate a wide variety of hand sizes. Most of the very heaviest hitting handgun rounds are chambered in revolvers, and thus they are commonly used for protection against dangerous animals and hunting. In many autoloaders, the sights are not fixed to the barrel and frame unlike revolvers that are almost always so fixed -- this gives you an inherent advantage in accuracy (not saying that there aren't accurate autoloaders, because there are). And last but not least, you don't have to rack the slide because there isn't a slide, and you don't have to load magazines because there aren't any magazines. And there are no issues with limp wristing. These are important if you have physical strength and/or dexterity issues like my wife who has RA. She simply can't "work" an autoloader. But she has no problem at all using her S&W K Frame revolver, especially since I am able to handload "bunny fart" practice rounds for her.
 
6" .44 AMP and 6.5" .44Mag


8" .44AMP


Just a couple of examples to remind everyone that all semi autos aren't "service class".

autos006.jpg


LAR Grizzly .45WinMag

DSCF0557.jpg


Wildey .45 Win Mag


Desert Eagle .44 Mag

Here's a point I didn't see mentioned, probably because so few people ever experience it. The difference in the feel of the recoil between a revolver and a semi auto when shooting .44magnum class loads.

For me, the different shape of the semi auto grip (along with the weight of the guns) makes .44Mag level loads much more pleasant to shoot than any revolver, DA or SA.

I can run the same .44Mag ammo through a S&W M29, a Ruger SuperBlackhawk, A Desert Eagle, an LAR Grizzly and a T/C Contender. And even with pachmayr grips, the least pleasant to shoot at 1400fps+ is the S&W, and the Contender.

As to the "power band" needed by semis, but not revolvers, the Wildey has an adjustable gas system so it can run on about anything. Sure, you have to twist the nut on the barrel, which you don't have to do on a revolver, but its a small matter, really.

And, speaking of small matters, whether or not the slide & barrel move before the bullet leaves the barrel doesn't matter. And claiming it "robs" velocity from a semi auto round is simply a red herring. ALL that matter is the speed actually delivered. Not what it might have lost on its way down the barrel.

And why even mention that, without the counter argument about revolvers and the barrel/cylinder gap??? Again, what matters is not what is lost, or where, but what is actually delivered.

I like both revolvers and semi autos, especially some uncommon semi autos. Both have their advantages and disadvantages, all that really matters is you or I be happy with them for what they ARE, and are not.
 
buckhorn cortez said:
Here's a video at 1 million frames per second. The gun is clearly a semi-auto, the bullet is clear of the barrel, and the slide has not moved.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otpFNL3yem4
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Do you think the camera was panning in the video you linked? Only way you could believe that the barrel/slide aren't moving.

The slide and barrel are definitely moving to the left in the video frame when the video starts (as you can see the gases escaping ahead of the bullet), well before you can even see the bullet.

If you're really that interested in it, you could assume a nominal bullet velocity of 830 FPS, scale the distance the slide moves versus the distance the bullet moves, and get a rough idea of the slide velocity when the bullet exits the barrel.

Don't be surprised if it's somewhere in the 20-25 FPS range.

Or you can remain a member of the sharkbite club ("The semiauto (locked breach) slide does not begin to move until the bullet is well clear of the muzzle.") and keep disbelieving basic physics. :)
 
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And why even mention that, without the counter argument about revolvers and the barrel/cylinder gap??? Again, what matters is not what is lost, or where, but what is actually delivered.
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I agree. The amount lost in either case isn't relevant to a discussion of the advantages of one over the other. In my humble opinion of course.:D
 
Or you can remain a member of the sharkbite club ("The semiauto (locked breach) slide does not begin to move until the bullet is well clear of the muzzle.") and keep disbelieving basic physics.
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Or you can go back and read post #191. Where i agreed the slide did in fact "move'". What i have continued to assert is that the amount of movement is SO SMALL and the effect on bullet speed is SO SMALL as to not have any practical value.

Even if you had a pistol with a slide locker, so you could prevent ANY movement of the slide (yes they do make such things). You could fire and chrono both with the slide free to move and the slide locked.

I would bet ther would not be any noticable difference in the data. Each round will be different enough from the others to negate the slide movement diference.

So, for the purpose of this topic "Revolver vs Semi" the slide movement is not a factor to consider.
 
44 AMP nice guns. I agree with you (though I'm certain I have less experience than you in this area) that a 44 mag revolver kicks lots harder than a 44 mag out of a Desert Eagle. When I shot the Desert Eagle a few months ago i actually paused to check the gun. Recoil was so light compared to what I was expecting I was a little concerned that I had a squib or something.

I don't find the same to be true for service calibers though. Not sure why. A 9mm and a 38 special +p are roughly the same to me in recoil.
 
I don't find the same to be true for service calibers though. Not sure why.
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I think that a matter of the grip shapes, and the energy delivered by the rounds in the usual weight guns.

Note that the standard "plowhandle" style grip of the single action, which does pretty well for most people up through .45 Colt levels, and begins becoming uncomfortable managing recoil above that. Many recommend the Bisley style grip for better management of heavy recoil.

Personally, I wonder if the people who designed S&W "target" grips had stock in Pachmayr, as the first thing a lot of us do is to replace the wood with rubber. ;)
 
Radny97 said:
a 44 mag revolver kicks lots harder than a 44 mag out of a Desert Eagle.
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Weight of the weapon makes a huge difference in recoil (Mass of Gun x Velocity of Gun = Mass of Bullet x Velocity of Bullet). Since an unloaded Desert Eagle weighs about 70 ounces, and an unloaded revolver like a S&W Model 29 weighs about 45 ounces, the revolver will have about 1.5 times the recoil of the Desert Eagle just due to the weight difference.
 
That is a good point. LOL.

This thread is just going on and on. The silly physics has been debunked.

I beseech ye from the bowels of Elmer Keith and Jeff Cooper to let it die.
 
More than one person WANTS this thread to continue. Generally, I favor a minimalist administrative approach. If I get tired of reading it, I don't read it.
 
Would a revolver be at a disadvantage in the vacuum of outer space because of its cylinder gap?

Would Barney Fife have been much better off with a 1911?

Didn't Sgt. York really use a 1917 S&W rather than the Luger as
portrayed in the Gary Cooper movie?

Will a Hollywood revolver run out of bullets faster than an auto?

Where did the gun belt bullet loops go?

Are Twinkies more dangerous than a revolver or an auto and
by what degrees?
 
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