Accidentially reengaging my 1911 safety

scroadkill

New member
20 years ago I used to shoot my para p14.45 a good bit - God only knows what I did with my thumbs. probably tucked them down on top of each other.
Recently Ive been shooting my CZ SP01 in 9mm a good bit, and figured out the whole thumbs forward thing and Ive been a thumbs forward and just keeping them out of the way floating out in space.

And today I was shooting my old trusty Para. I would draw from cocked and locked on the clock, drop the safety as I bring the gun up, and push my thumbs forward like Ive been doing.. and 6 times out of 30 draws I went to shoot and I had reengaged the safety.

Anyone have similar issues? Should I try to ride the safety with a thumb?
 
Thumbs forward is fine, so long as you ride the safety. Heck I ride the safety on guns where there isn't any.

tipoc
 
Anyone have similar issues? Should I try to ride the safety with a thumb?

Yup that why I only carry striker fired handguns.
 
Once you bring the gun up and take the safety off (both should happen simultaneously) why would you want to ride the safety? It doesn't suddenly decide to engage itself, at least not on my guns.

Jim
 
The "thumbs forward thing" assumes thumb riding safety.
If you have small hands, there are safeties with the lever mounted low.
 
My thumb is always giving the safety a red or green light.
While it may be generally pointed toward the target,its not my "pointer".My trigger finger is.
 
My thumbs are forward and up and they ride the slide. Have never had an issue and I can shoot very fast and accurately this way. With all pistols.
 
I shot IPSC in the mid 80's. my instructor was a first line descendant of Jeff Cooper and Gunsite. My thumb always rode the safety. Holding a 1911 any other way felt funny.

I had to give up my Wilson Master Grade 1911 for a Glock as a duty gun. For years my thumb would sweep down an imaginary safety.

Retired, got a new job. Back to carrying a 1911. All is right in the world again.
 
The "thumbs up/thumbs forward" style is currently favored by the top speed shooters. It's a fine thing, for them. For me, not so much. Works fine with some kinds of guns, for others, not so much.

I, and many others who learned our shooting grips in a much earlier age, almost universally shoot with thumbs DOWN. Some shoot with their thumb ON the safety, many with their thumb just below, after sweeping it off.

Was very, very rare to hear of anyone accidentally putting the safety ON before the thumbs forward grip became popular.

Some of my guns, if you shoot them with thumbs up, you are begging for an injury!!

Not all the things competitors do that give them advantages ARE advantages when you get off the range and into the real world.

Tis quite simple, really, different guns allow for different grip styles, and some styles that work with gun A are not right for gun B.

If you are bumping the safety ON 1 in 5 times, you clearly need to do something different with your grip.
 
Like others said...its a grip issue ..and thumb position issue. ( maybe you are rolling your grip on gun a little ...did you change position of your holster...did you change the cant on your holster..all that little stuff ! ).

You just have to figure out what works for you / personally I don't ride the safety - but my thumbs point to the target vs up or down like some --- but there is no "one way" to do this.

I have a buddy who has started to trip safety back on - as he reloads a new mag - in a speed reload ( same thing, he has to watch the position of his thumbs ). All of a sudden he's getting sloppy with his fundamentals - even though he has shot 1911's for over 40 yrs...

Maybe try some - draw and dry fire - in front of a mirror / to figure out your thumb position that works best for you. Once you get it ...dry fire like that in and out of a holster...20 or 30 times in one sessions 3 or 4 days a week - until you get the muscle memory back on track.
 
thanks for all the intel guys. Ill try to give it a ride next range session.
It bothers me that things become so natural I forget what I just did - when things go wrong that is.

did I mention i also get fail to lock back on last round with my g42? .. I starting to think I have to train my thumbs to go somewhere intentional.
 
Sounds like your tripping the slide release on the Glock. Grab your pistol right now and do some dry fire practice with your thumbs up and forward. See how you like it as far as just dry practice goes.
 
Some pistols that have a slide stop closer to the rear, can fail to lock back if you ride the slide stop with your thumb.

I have a few that do it, and had to adjust my grip a bit. I move my rear (right thumb) out a bit away from the frame.
 
I learned to shoot when magnum revolvers were the standard. That meant firm shooting grip with even firmer secondary grip "locking down" the shooting hand's fingertips and thumb.

To this day I still shoot thumb down with the off-hand thumb locking it down. I've never had a problem with any semiautomatic - 1911 especially, engaging the safety during firing...the gun simply doesn't kick that hard if one is holding is properly.
Especially with the 1911, if one places the shooting thumb down, with the support thumb on top, shooting grips "relaxed," yet support grips firm, the 1911 can be fired extremely fast with amazing accuracy.

The "thumbs forward" grip....I can see ZERO rationale behind it other than some expert somewhere who shoots attenuated loads through weakly sprung guns. The standard 1911 thumb safety does NOT lend itself to a thumb laying all on top of it, but of course the myriad of aftermarket, giganto-size thumb safeties DO, but such a hold does NOT provide a truly solid hold for a pistol IN A GUNFIGHT! You wouldn't grip a hammer with your thumb alongside the handle (unless you wanted it to come loose) and you don't grip a pistol you may have to use as a bludgeon with your thumb out of position to RETAIN the gun in your hand against being knocked aside, or having to resort to using it to beat someone across the face and head as fast as possible. Sorry if that seems a bit indelicate, but it's the reality of real-life combat with another person trying to kill you after you pumped half-a-dozen rounds into him!
The human hand is designed to CLOSE AROUND an object in order to exert maximum gripping force, and this is the "natural tendency" of the hand. Deliberately training to grip in such a way as to create significant distance between the thumb and index finger is deliberately setting the hand up with a WEAK grip which means easy, and early loss of control of whatever is held in the hand.

Besides I have found zero "improvement" to be had from laying the shooting thumb atop the support thumb other than a goofy, "loose hold" that does nothing positive to improve accuracy.

Granted there is a "YHUGE" difference in how an experienced pistolero can grasp any variety of handguns versus the novice simply because the pistolero already knows the handling and recoil characteristics and has confidence of control. Unfortunately too many novices are being taught range techniques that do not apply to the real world, not I might add, do they follow the natural "fight or flight" response which should be the cornerstone of ALL martial training, including and especially firearms training.
 
Whether I am shooting a 1911 one handed or two,at the draw,web of my hand goes up under the spur/beavertail.
It belongs nowhere else.
Trigger finger,pointed straight down the slide,outside the holster,extended.
It belongs nowhere else.(works perfect with a SERPA)
I use the GI size thumb safety.The landmark for where my thumb belongs is under the safety,making sure it is engaged.IMO,it belongs nowhere else.
That IS my grip for the draw.Every time.
My thumb is educated to manage the safety.I don't have to think about it.
Left hand? Fingers point down about 45 deg,cocking the wrist.Aids in muzzle control.

See the open space on the left grip panel? The heel of your hand goes there.
Curl the left hand fingers around the right hand and squeeze.
If you do it right,you left thumb will generally be pointed at the target,but I put no focus or effort into pointing my left thumb at anything.That would be a distraction.

My "safety thumb" is almost at rest ,no real muscle going on,a "firm rest" either holding the safety engaged,or off.
And unless I'm pressing the trigger,finger is pointing down the slide.
 
The "thumbs forward" grip....I can see ZERO rationale behind it other than some expert somewhere

Go to any major shooting competition, or even minor ones, and every single shooter, expert or not, is using the thumbs forward grip.
All the cops and soldiers at those events are holding their guns the same way.
Questioning it today, thirty years later, is where I find a lack of rationale?

Someone who engages in "gun wrestling", fighting over the gun as well as fighting with the gun, might want to choose a compromise(d) grip to help with gun retention, but the jury is long out on how to best put rounds quickly on target.
 
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