A Good Dilemma: Sphinx SDP Compact or CZ P-01 with CGW Parts

Can some of you owners of the compact model convince be I should buy one instead of waiting for a standard model, especially since I own a DW Guardian I've finally figured out how to shoot?
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They are very different guns. The Sphinx is is much more like a P series Sig or the CZs.The trigger is fantastic for a DA/SA gun but it is not a 1911 trigger.

What are you going to use the gun for? Is it a gun games pistol or a target gun? Is it a going to be a carry gun? Those answers would help make a recommendation.

Worc is right. The Alpaha has a polymer grip riding on a aluminum rail lower. All of the Alpha guns have polymer grips. The Compact has inter-changeable backstraps but the Sub compact does not.

The Standard will be an Alpha gun with the polymer grip.

The colored guns like the Sand, Black, and the Krypton all have aluminum lower and grip. These tend to be about $150 to $200 more depending on the the vendor.

The Duo Tone and the Stainless both have steel upper and lower. This makes them much heavier. Like a steel commander 1911. These are more than the colored guns by about $100.

The Alpha weights as much as most Alloy guns like the P01 or a Sig P228. It does not feel like a polymer. If you are looking for an all around gun I would get the Compact. It is a lot like the P228 IMHO. You can use it as a range gun, conceal carry it and with a little tweaking it can gun as a gun games gun.
 
Worc said:
The Alpha has the polymer lower frame and all the colors have the aluminum lower frame.
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As noted, The Black, Krypton and Sand models have aluminum upper and lower frames. The Duo-Tone model has a steel slide and (apparently) a stainless upper and lower frame, while the Stainless Model is all stainless.

(I had a 2000 series Sphinx Compact, which had a black slide and stainless frame, but that frame was hi-gloss, and it seemed to invite scratches and small blemishes. Mine became a safe queen because of it. This more-matte finish is a big improvement and should be easily "touched up" if you get a minor blemish or scratch.

http://www.sphinxarms.com/index.php/sdp-compact-line

I would expect the STANDARD model to be eventually be available in more than just the single configuration now shown on the Sphinx Arms site, which is steel slide, alloy upper and poly lower.

As to the original question -- I suspect a well-refined CZ from CZ Custom or CGW will be very nice, but will cost nearly as much. If you already have one, that's the way to go. If you don't, I'd argue that the SDP will retain more of it's purchase price over time -- or even appreciate, as the 2000 series guns have seem to have done...

.
 
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I hate to be a contrarian here (well not really!). This CZ Custom Shop Compact SDP is a better choice for not a whole lot more $;
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I disagree you still have a CZ barrel and CZ slide to frame barrel to slide fit. On top of that you still have a CZ sear which has been polished but cleaned up but it is still a CZ part.

For that money I could send my Sphinx SDP to David at CGW and come out with a better pistol from top to bottom. Better parts better fit and with a trigger that will be just as good if not better. IMHO.

CZ customs builds a nice gun but at the end of the day it is still a CZ.
 
I disagree you still have a CZ barrel and CZ slide to frame barrel to slide fit. On top of that you still have a CZ sear which has been polished but cleaned up but it is still a CZ part.

For that money I could send my Sphinx SDP to David at CGW and come out with a better pistol from top to bottom. Better parts better fit and with a trigger that will be just as good if not better. IMHO.

CZ customs builds a nice gun but at the end of the day it is still a CZ.
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This is still an EDC gun; that CZ Custom Compact SDP has "IMO" a better sight system with the Heinie Slant Pro Tritiums, how much is CGW charging you to install those on a Sphinx? And this one has a better DA trigger pull. Two factors that are critical for a holster piece.

At the end of the day the Sphinx is nice, but for that kind of money I have to try it before I buy it. There are 2 stocking Sphinx dealers within 50 miles of where I'm at and these are both LGS only, so I can't demo it. With the CZ Custom Shop Compact SDP I know that one is going to work as a SUPERB carry gun!
 
Being less into shiny collector-type custom guns and more into functional carry pieces that are usually black and dull looking I would personally go with the P-01. If for nothing else the market presence and availability of parts (if that's still an issue for Sphinx in the states). CZ makes a very good, reliable, and accurate firearm. Keep in mind that any improvements are going to be mostly aesthetic and marginal (subjective, I know).

That isn't to say that I don't eventually want a Sphinx or appreciate what they are. Hell, if I think about it another 20 minutes I might change my mind. Three cheers for me being no help at all haha.
 
This is still an EDC gun; that CZ Custom Compact SDP has "IMO" a better sight system with the Heinie Slant Pro Tritiums, how much is CGW charging you to install those on a Sphinx? And this one has a better DA trigger pull. Two factors that are critical for a holster piece.

At the end of the day the Sphinx is nice, but for that kind of money I have to try it before I buy it. There are 2 stocking Sphinx dealers within 50 miles of where I'm at and these are both LGS only, so I can't demo it. With the CZ Custom Shop Compact SDP I know that one is going to work as a SUPERB carry gun!
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I can understand that line of thought but I do not think that if you have not shot a Sphinx you can make the statement you are making. There are a lot of people who have shot CGW guns and CZ custom guns chopping at the bit for the new Sphinx guns because of the quality of the foundation for the $$$. It is funny people complain about the high price point but the reality is that it is an incredible value at that price point. The amount of hand fitting going into these pistols for a production guns equals what many people get out of a custom gun.

As for sights that is a personal preference sort of thing. I personally love the sights on the Sphinx. I also am one to believe that night sights are over rated. They are really only an advantage in a small light window, which is low light, not no light no lots of light. People overstate their value. IMHO but I wanted them I could get a set of Henies they run about $115 IIRC. A CGW action work starts at about $125 so if I wanted new sights and trigger work I would imagine I would get out around $350-$400 with shipping. So ad that to the $844 I am already in my gun for and I am still under or just a little bit over the CZ SDP at $1225 and I started with a better foundation.

Again not knocking the CZ custom gun. It is a stellar pistol I just think the Sphinx is better with more potential. In the end both would serve someone well.
 
Being less into shiny collector-type custom guns and more into functional carry pieces that are usually black and dull looking I would personally go with the P-01.
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There is nothing collector custom about the Sphinx Alpha IMHO. It is a working gun!



 
I disagree you still have a CZ barrel and CZ slide to frame barrel to slide fit. On top of that you still have a CZ sear which has been polished but cleaned up but it is still a CZ part.
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Hard to discuss a gun I've only seen on a website (CZ SDP...)

  • CGW and maybe the CZ Custom Shop may both use use custom parts (like CGW'S adjustable sear or the custom shop's custom competition hammer) when doing their custom work.
  • Slide to frame fit, which is of questionable value with regard to accuracy (as long as barrel to slide fit is good), can be adjusted.
  • The Sphinx design uses a SIG barrel lockup design (ala CZ-40B, CZ-97B) while the CZ SDP is based on the original CZ barrel lockup with lugs across the top of the barrel. (The P-07 uses a barrel lockup similar to the Sphinx, too.) There MIGHT be a measurable/meaningful difference there.
I suspect the CZ Custom Shop's SDP incorporates some improvements and mods we're not fully aware of, as they're charging an awful lot for their improvements on the compact CZ -- and they don't have a reputation for ripping folks off.

That said, I suspect the CZ SDP and the SPHINX SDP might be closer than we think -- but the CZ Custom version of their SDP price is a LOT more expensive than the Sphinx SDP, and for half the difference you can have quite a bit of custom work done to the Sphinx by CGW -- which was one of your points, and an important one! The question of value comes up again -- and it's one that's hard to find an answer for.

Like you, I'm very satisfied with the Sphinx SDP.
 
but the CZ Custom version of their SDP price is a LOT more expensive than the Sphinx SDP, and for half the difference you can have quite a bit of custom work done to the Sphinx by CGW
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Exactly. I'd buy a P-01 and sent it in for work to CZ Custom before I'd but the factory CZ P-01 SDP. A local store actually has one, but they want $1400 for it :eek:! Honestly the trigger was a bit better and I do love the sights and grips, but that's more than twice the price of a base P-01 and I don't see where the money went.
 
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This is still an EDC gun; that CZ Custom Compact SDP has "IMO" a better sight system with the Heinie Slant Pro Tritiums, how much is CGW charging you to install those on a Sphinx? And this one has a better DA trigger pull. Two factors that are critical for a holster piece.

At the end of the day the Sphinx is nice, but for that kind of money I have to try it before I buy it. There are 2 stocking Sphinx dealers within 50 miles of where I'm at and these are both LGS only, so I can't demo it. With the CZ Custom Shop Compact SDP I know that one is going to work as a SUPERB carry gun!
I can understand that line of thought but I do not think that if you have not shot a Sphinx you can make the statement you are making. There are a lot of people who have shot CGW guns and CZ custom guns chopping at the bit for the new Sphinx guns because of the quality of the foundation for the $$$. It is funny people complain about the high price point but the reality is that it is an incredible value at that price point. The amount of hand fitting going into these pistols for a production guns equals what many people get out of a custom gun.

As for sights that is a personal preference sort of thing. I personally love the sights on the Sphinx. I also am one to believe that night sights are over rated. They are really only an advantage in a small light window, which is low light, not no light no lots of light. People overstate their value. IMHO but I wanted them I could get a set of Henies they run about $115 IIRC. A CGW action work starts at about $125 so if I wanted new sights and trigger work I would imagine I would get out around $350-$400 with shipping. So ad that to the $844 I am already in my gun for and I am still under or just a little bit over the CZ SDP at $1225 and I started with a better foundation.

Again not knocking the CZ custom gun. It is a stellar pistol I just think the Sphinx is better with more potential. In the end both would serve someone well.
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I'm trying to be fair & reasonable. I have a wider assortment of range & EDC guns than most people I know, so I have no problem accepting a "new" gun. But I have to shoot it first, and I haven't shot one of these but I like to have an informed opinion about what I'm talking about so I went to the Sphinx website and I searched on "Authorized Dealers and Range Program Participants" within 100 miles and I came up with "NADA". This could be a really great EDC gun, but IMHO the Sphinx will continue to have a very small fan base at its price points if they don't increase the dealer network, and if they don't get the guns into the LGR's for rentals and demos. KRISS USA, the Sphinx importer, offers a replacement "halo" tritium / fiber optic front sight for the Sphinx, and it's actually a cool setup. They should offer this as an option! With my middle aged eyes, I can't shoot an EDC with a white dot front sight, and a blind-blade rear sight very well. My experience tells me I would need that halo front sight to work with the existing blind sight on the Sphinx. If you do a lot of outdoor practice shooting, you may be different and then you are fortunate! I happen to practice mostly indoors, in low lighting. And I have a question, what are you using for a dedicated holster (OWB /IWB) with this Sphinx? Hey, thanks a lot for letting me voice my opinion here!
 
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Has ANYONE involved in this discussion actually shot the CZ Custom (compact) SDP? There seems to be a lot of fan claims -- on both sides of the discussion, but the only folks with hands-on experience seem to be the Sphinx owners.

I've shot two CZ Custom-tuned guns and they were impressive. I've heard nothing but good about them or about the guns tuned by David Milam (at CGW) -- and David does Sphinx work, too.

I've had several Sphinx pistols over the years, and now have a Sphinx SDP. I've had a bunch of CZs (in stock and improved formats), have a CZ 85 Combat, and a semi-custom AT-84s (which I think is as good as any of them.) Note: the AT-84s was built by ITM, a firm that eventually became part of Sphinx; the AT-84 they built a licensed CZ, while the AT-84s was based on Tanfoglio components, tuned by the ITM Swiss craftsmen.

The CZ Custom SDP sells for $1300-$1400, or $500 to $600 more than the Sphinx SDP. You can do a lot of things to the Sphinx (or any gun) for $500 -- but you'd probably find yourself spending a good bit less. The CZ Custom shop takes a basic CZ compact $550 (+/-) and spends an extra $800 to get it in its final form.

We aren't comparing apples to oranges, here.
 
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Has ANYONE involved in this discussion actually shot the CZ Custom (compact) SDP?
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Not that specific gun; I have owned several CZ pistols and still own one but it's a range gun not an EDC. I think CZ offers the best value in a service pistol. I have carried and still own Sigs, HK's, Glocks, a BHP, 1911's, and revolvers, so I own and understand good guns. I have tried out a CZ-P01 with Meprolight night sights and a short reset trigger system. Frankly, I don't think the P-01 needs anything more than NS and that SRTS to be an excellent EDC! Based on that I think the CZ Custom Shop gun is a little pricey but pretty good!
 
The CZ Custom shop takes a basic CZ compact $550 (+/-) and spends an extra $800 to get it in its final form.
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But obviously there is markup in that. You could buy a factory CZ Compact and have the same trigger work done from CZ Custom for significantly less money than the price of the SDP. You also have to factor in the grips and sights, though as we've seen here preferences vary. The CZ SDP is a package of a number of options whereas I personally would rather go a la carte. As I'm seeing it even that package might still be more money than all those individual items a la carte. But you neither have to do it yourself nor have to send it off and wait or order a new pistol with the trigger options and wait. It's right there for all the instant gratification needs.

I went back to the store yesterday and handled the SPHINX SDP next to the CZ SDP. In my opinion, and that's all it is, the stock SPHINX SDP trigger had a shorter reset and a crisper break thant the CZ. It's downside next to the CZ was the heavier trigger pull, which can be remedied with springs as we mentioned. There was also no getting around the fact that the machining on the SPINX is just nicer done. That's not to say the CZ is terrible, but it's a notable difference and a difference hard to make up unless you replaced all the parts in the CZ.

Sadly the store won't let me take what for them is $2300 worth of guns and shoot them for testing purposes.
 
One of the things I noticed on my Sphinx SDP was how short and crisp the reset and SA trigger were. My Compact D has had a CGW SRS-2, a hand fitted disconnector and the pre b 75 trigger. The pre B trigger has some extra material on the rear of the trigger were it stops on the frame. Think of it as an 85C trigger with overtravel screw that you can't adjust. It now has an extremely short reset and crisp SA break, but I think the Sphinx is still shorter and better.

I am a very DIY type of person so I would (and did) buy a stock P01 and upgrade it myself to get it close to a CZ Custom SDP for less money. I can also pick and choose the best bang for the buck options to keep the cost lower if I so choose. Both CGW and CZC have back logs of work that needs to be done so I would assume they can't spend hours and hours polishing up every little surface. A law of diminishing returns seems to apply as they could take a lot of time smoothing/polishing parts. The extra labor costs involved for very marginal gains in performance wouldn't be cost effective for a business.

The one thing that has kept me as a CZ fan boy is CZ Custom and CGW. Both make absolutely top quality parts and members of both places freely offer free advice and tips on tuning/trouble shooting CZ's to extract their highest potential performance. I read somewhere else that CGW is going to be the "official" Sphinx custom shop. So I think in the future we might see more products coming out for them.
 
@bigmatt

I really appreciate hearing from someone that's done both, thanks!

Is it relatively straightforward to change the firing pin spring, firing pin block spring, and hammer spring on the Sphinx? On HKs it's just a matter of drifting out a roll pin.
 
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Has ANYONE involved in this discussion actually shot the CZ Custom (compact) SDP? There seems to be a lot of fan claims -- on both sides of the discussion, but the only folks with hands-on experience seem to be the Sphinx owners.
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I have not shot their SDP but I have shot other CZ custom and CGW guns with their full house packages. I believe I have a good feel for what they both can do with a pistol.

I also own a Sphinx compact. I am also taking David at his word when I asked him which route I should go a CGW, which I believe is comparable to CZ Customs guns, or a Sphinx. He said in all honesty it is hard to beat the value in a Sphinx. There is a reason his action jobs start at $125 for the Sphinx it is because there is simple not a lot to correct and you are just cleaning it up a bit.

JDBerg I do not mean to be harsh but you are recommending one pistol you have never shot over another pistol you have never shot. Seems like you are going strictly by reputation and not on actual trigger time. :eek:
 
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