5year old shot with dads gun

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The other problem with gun news is it is easy to forget how the child was shot.

Child shoots self in face = parents don’t go to jail or get questioned much.

Child shot by by drug dealer while baby daddy negotiating a better price on crack trying to rent baby momma for sexual favors in barter deal gone wrong = jail time.

Obviously two extremes, but it can be hard to remember just exactly how kid was shot.
 
Child shoots self in face = parents don’t go to jail or get questioned much.

Actually, Florida has a specific criminal consequence of negligently allowing a child to get hold of a firearm. That is something I'm not opposed to.
 
Thank you everyone for the responses. Not much any of us are going to be able to do to cancel this horrible incident from the public memory but I am going to look closer at my own habits.
 
Trying to merge this into an overall death rate is not going to void the responsibly of having caused a death.

Frankly I don't remember how my folks handled the situati9on. I know I never saw a gun in the house when I was under age 13 or so, we had 3 rifles and 3 pistols.

I do know its my responsibility to keep the guns secured and or the ammo separated such that kids can't access them.

Hell is likely kind vs having to live with having been the cause of that kind of death.
 
But again I will ask, how do you all feel about how this reflects on all gun owners in the eye of non gun owners.

Those people who feel without thinking things through will continue to be influenced by the "spin" of the headline. Those who use rational thought will see that it was the individual, not the community at fault.

if the father had left the child in a hot car and the child died, the outrage would be against a bad parent, NOT a bad car owner.
 
These stories bring up good points to ponder. I was still working SWAT/Narcotics when my oldest son was young. I quit carrying off duty. EVERYTHING is a calculated risk. In my calculation, I determined that for those few years, the risk of having a pistol easily accessible outweighed the risk of needing a pistol readily accessible.
 
Those people who feel without thinking things through will continue to be influenced by the "spin" of the headline. Those who use rational thought will see that it was the individual, not the community at fault.

We as a gun community talk a good talk, but we do not abide by our own rhetoric. How many times have you been to a gun store or gun show with the sign "no loaded firearms." Why do we say that the armed citizen is the best way to make us safe, yet the gun dealers do not want citizens armed inside their stores? HYPOCRITES! I actually changed who I deal with over this issue. There is only one gun shop in the area that welcomes loaded firearms inside. They now get my money. They don't keep their long guns behind the counter either. I quit going to gun shows because they are hypocrites.
 
Well how about this, another mass shooting in California and right after a California Senator is calling for more to be done to prevent "Gun Violence". So the anti-gun cries the loudest the "spin headliners" just keep reporting it and reinforcing that same message. Exactly how much more can be done in California before complete confiscation takes effect? How and when do we fight back against that before it is spread nationwide?

Soon just like plastic buckets there will be a warning label on all guns that they could cause injury or death.
 
Exactly how much more can be done in California before complete confiscation takes effect?
The "beauty" of gun-control is that since it doesn't actually reduce crime or stop mass shootings, anti-gunners can always come back in a year or two, or after the next sensational headline news event and make the laws more restrictive because crime still hasn't dropped and mass shootings still happen.

Because the stated goal of the law isn't consistent with the actual effect of the law, anti-gunners can continue to use the stated goal to justify more and more restrictions with the confidence that there's no danger that the restrictions might actually reduce crime so much that no further restrictions would be justified.
 
@JohnKSa....the real “beauty” is that it never takes a gun away. It just relocates them to the wealthy and the criminals.
 
How many times have you been to a gun store or gun show with the sign "no loaded firearms."

Is it hypocrisy when the range goes "cold"?

you can't drink in the liquor store, you can't smoke in the smoke shop, and you can't have sex in the grocery store or 7-11 where you buy condoms.

In the case of gun shows, no loaded guns could be a condition of the facility owner, or a condition of insurance coverage. Simply put, no matter how the show owners may personally feel, no venue, no show. And in many places, no insurance, no venue, no show.
 
The local gun show put up ban signs after an ND. The owner told me he thought the signs were terrible and the wrong message. However, his insurance folks said to and there are too many idiots out there. So he should go out of business for purity. No thanks.
 
Is it hypocrisy when the range goes "cold"?

you can't drink in the liquor store, you can't smoke in the smoke shop, and you can't have sex in the grocery store or 7-11 where you buy condoms.

In the case of gun shows, no loaded guns could be a condition of the facility owner, or a condition of insurance coverage. Simply put, no matter how the show owners may personally feel, no venue, no show. And in many places, no insurance, no venue, no show.
Has anyone made a serious case that liquor or cigarettes make you safer? We contend that we should be allowed to carry in restaurants, public buildings, movie theatres, electronics stores, etc. because a well armed citizen is the best defense against the criminal. Why is the well armed citizen not a good thing in the gun store? Plain and simple hypocrisy.
It is not hypocrisy for the range to go cold. It is hypocrisy for the range to prohibit either concealed or open carry.
 
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The local gun show put up ban signs after an ND. The owner told me he thought the signs were terrible and the wrong message. However, his insurance folks said to and there are too many idiots out there. So he should go out of business for purity. No thanks.
It seems the antigunners and the left are right. The citizenry is not responsible enough to carry arms.
If we are not responsible enough to carry at gun shows and gun shops, why are we responsible enough to carry anywhere ekse? We raise heck about Hilton brands not allowing guns in their hotels yet we don't allow guns to be carried in our gun stores, gun shops, and trade shows. Do you not see a problem with that?
 
It seems the antigunners and the left are right. The citizenry is not responsible enough to carry arms.
Rants and sarcasm aside, from a purely practical perspective, a gun shop that has accumulated a number of bullet holes in the lobby is more than entitled to observe accurately that ENOUGH of the people who have come into their shop were not responsible enough to carry loaded weapons and use that as reasonable justification for a policy designed to prevent additional holes from being shot in the walls.

It's their shop after all--their walls, potentially their hides and their customers' hides that might be the next location to develop an unwanted bullet hole. Who are we to tell them that their tolerance for people accidentally shooting in their place of business is much too low and that makes them hypocrites?
If we are not responsible enough to carry at gun shows and gun shops, why are we responsible enough to carry anywhere ekse?
When people are at McDonalds, they aren't tempted to whip out their loaded carry gun and do a little show and tell for the person taking their fries order or for the person at the next table--I know I've never seen anything like that. At the gun shop or gun show, things are different--I know I HAVE seen customers use their carry guns for show and tell in that environment.

People don't typically bring guns to McDonalds for warranty repair, to trade them in, or to have the staff service them and that dramatically cuts down on the potential for someone cranking off a round at McDonalds while they are demonstrating to the manager why their rifle won't shoot right any more. On the other hand, it's pretty common for customers to return firearms to gun shops for service or replacement, and some of those are definitely brought in loaded.

At a gun show, there are hundreds of people handling firearms at any given moment. Over the course of a three day show, literally thousands of people will handle firearms. Over the course of an entire year at all the McDonalds in a large city, the number of people who will be handling a firearm in one of those facilities is tiny. The probability of someone firing a negligent shot at a gun show, even though it's full of mostly responsible people is fairly significant because there are so many people there, all engaging in potentially risky activity (risky from the perspective of negligent discharges). The probability of an ND at a McDonalds is obviously tremendously smaller than the probability of an ND at a gun show even if the percentage of irresponsible people is the same at both locations.

I think that it's important to keep a reasonable perspective. Pretending that an environment like a restaurant, or a Wal-Mart, or a movie theater is identical, from the perspective of the risk of negligent discharges, when compared to gun shows or gun shops is absolutely ridiculous.

I don't like it when gun shops or gun shows restrict carry or loaded guns on the premises. But the bottom line is that after a business owner or gun show organizer has the PROOF in the form of bullet holes and past NDs that the risk of someone popping off a round negligently in that environment is unacceptably high, how can we reasonably complain that they shouldn't try to reduce that risk by implementing no carry policies?
 
I don't like it when gun shops or gun shows restrict carry or loaded guns on the premises. But the bottom line is that after a business owner or gun show organizer has the PROOF in the form of bullet holes and past NDs that the risk of someone popping off a round negligently in that environment is unacceptably high, how can we reasonably complain that they shouldn't try to reduce that risk by implementing no carry policies?
I am not being sarcastic. It appears to me that if the gun industry does not trust the armed citizenry to carry in industry establishments, then the arms industry and lobby should not expect other industries to trust the armed citizen. It seems the industry concedes to the point of the left and the antigunners. We can make excuse after excuse. Granted, there is extreme validity in the excuses. At the end of the day, what's good for the goose is good for the gander.
The arms industry is a lot like my Doctor. He asked me if I had a flu shot. I said no. He said I needed one. I asked him if he had taken one. He said "Uh huh, no. I had a reaction to one a long time back."
 
They aren't excuses, they are facts. The more you use a thing, the more you handle it, the more likely you are to have a problem, even a tragic problem. Ergo, the more miles you put on your car, the more likely you are to have a crash. The more guns and people you put together in a room, the more likely you are to have a ND.

In my years of going to gun shows and gun stores, I have seen people sweep me with the muzzle of a gun more times than I care to count so I simply ignore the problem even though it sends a chill up and down my spine. When I pick up a gun to look at it, the biggest problem is to decide where to point the muzzle just to look through the sights. Upper corner of the ceiling is about all there is and even then....

--Wag--
 
Facts used as excuses. It is raining outside my house is a fact. I could choose whether to or whether not to use it as an excuse not to work. If hotels, restaurants, theaters, etc ban guns, then they also reduce their chance of a N.D. The exact reasoning you are using to defend prohibiting carry in a gun store is the same reasoning the anti gunners use to propose anti carry everywhere.
 
I think that it's important to keep a reasonable perspective. Pretending that an environment like a restaurant, or a Wal-Mart, or a movie theater is identical, from the perspective of the risk of negligent discharges, when compared to gun shows or gun shops is absolutely ridiculous.

A couple of years ago, I was at a gun show where a negligent discharge took place. Keep in mind, the police check guns at the door to make sure they are not loaded and then strap the action making it inactive. The entire building, full of at least 1,000 people went dead silent. Fortunately, no one was hurt. Whenever lots of people will be handling guns, there does need to be strict rules in place. Because out of 1,000 functional people, 140 of them will have IQ's between 70-85.
 
This whole topic started as a transport incident as a gun was left in a car. Now last night I had another incident that gave me concern.

My brother whom I shoot with and is a CC holder came by last night to show us his new car. On the way home he struck a deer running into the road. He was not hurt but did call 911 for the police and then called us. So now I have 2 questions, both related. What happens if he were injured and unconscious and carrying? Next what if he was unconscious and also had a range bag in the car full of guns? How do the police handle this situation and what happen if they tow the vehicle not knowing there is a bag full of guns in the back? Again I have never been in this situation so I truly do not know.
 
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