40S&W…Have you seen the deals?
- Thread starter Nathan
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2wheelwander
New member
He ain't lying. Glocks, Sig's and Springfield .40's are marked down. CZ not so much. I love the .40. Watched a video just the other day of a retired SEAL who was around when they used it. Said SOCOM all went with .40 because of the FBI results, he claimed they only went back to 9mm for budgetary reasons. IIRC he said it saved them ~2 million a year they could put towards other things.
I love the .40 I don't carry one anymore, but I have a few. Great round IMHO. Glad its cheap!
I love the .40 I don't carry one anymore, but I have a few. Great round IMHO. Glad its cheap!
dogtown tom
New member
The problem with buying a discount .40 pistol isn't the price of the gun, its the cost of ammunition. .40 is typically eight to ten cents higher per round.
$300 used Glock 22 or 23's aren't new by any means. When the FBI dumped the .40, so did huge number of other federal, state and local LE. That happened in 2015, so the OP just discovering deals on .40 pistols is kinda surprising.
They are deals because they don't sell as well as 9x19. It not a knock on the .40, just a result of the marketplace making a preference.
$300 used Glock 22 or 23's aren't new by any means. When the FBI dumped the .40, so did huge number of other federal, state and local LE. That happened in 2015, so the OP just discovering deals on .40 pistols is kinda surprising.
They are deals because they don't sell as well as 9x19. It not a knock on the .40, just a result of the marketplace making a preference.
Nothing wrong with a good 40. In fact it is more effective with every type of ammo than 9mm in my opinion given similar grade of ammo. FMJ 40 better than FMJ 9, Standard Police HP better in 40 than a Standard JHP. The 9 is a fine round but to say it "beats" the 40 or is better than a 40 is just not reality except for price of the ammo. HST 9 may beat some standard 40 loads but does HST 40 lose to HST 9 on the street statistics?
Virtually every LE agency has moved to 9mm and dumped 40 S&W in the last 10 years. There are used 40 S&W pistols at bargain prices everywhere I go.
Our city PD has used 9mm for 30 years and have never had a failure to stop a bad guy with more than 2 shots. Our County PD and Sheriff's department, GSP, and Game wardens went to 40 caliber pistols in 1994 but all have switched to 9mm. They researched other LE agencies all over the country and found no difference in performance, but about twice the cost to shoot 40's
Ammo prices on the better HP loads aren't that much more expensive for 40 caliber, but FMJ practice ammo, especially when LE agencies buy in bulk is more than double the cost. I can still get 9mm FMJ for $13/50 rounds. FMJ 40 S&W loads are closer to $40/50.
If you don't shoot a lot there are some bargains on some used guns, Especially Glocks. And I'd have zero issues buying a used Glock no matter how rough it looked. Send it back to Glock and they will refurb it and replace any worn parts at no cost for life.
It doesn't cost that much to just buy a 9mm barrel to convert a 40 to 9mm. With Glocks you can even use the same magazines. That lets you practice on the cheap and if you have more confidence in 40 caliber can use the same gun with a 1 minute barrel swap
Our city PD has used 9mm for 30 years and have never had a failure to stop a bad guy with more than 2 shots. Our County PD and Sheriff's department, GSP, and Game wardens went to 40 caliber pistols in 1994 but all have switched to 9mm. They researched other LE agencies all over the country and found no difference in performance, but about twice the cost to shoot 40's
Ammo prices on the better HP loads aren't that much more expensive for 40 caliber, but FMJ practice ammo, especially when LE agencies buy in bulk is more than double the cost. I can still get 9mm FMJ for $13/50 rounds. FMJ 40 S&W loads are closer to $40/50.
If you don't shoot a lot there are some bargains on some used guns, Especially Glocks. And I'd have zero issues buying a used Glock no matter how rough it looked. Send it back to Glock and they will refurb it and replace any worn parts at no cost for life.
It doesn't cost that much to just buy a 9mm barrel to convert a 40 to 9mm. With Glocks you can even use the same magazines. That lets you practice on the cheap and if you have more confidence in 40 caliber can use the same gun with a 1 minute barrel swap
The mags are different. .40 s&w mag is good for .357 sig, but it doesn't work well for 9mm. Everything is the same except the follower.
I bought my first pistol in 1997. It was a Beretta 92F in 9mm. I wanted the same thing our military had. I was laughed at. It is a pea shooter, same as the .223 in M16. A real man shot .45acp no less, or at the least the .40 cal. Now the table has turned. To me they are all good if the price is right.
BTW it was the beginning of buying guns on Internet. eBay used to sell guns if you can believe that. I bought the Beretta from an outfit in Oregon. Before I placed the order I checked with the gun counter of a major sporting store in town. They were willing to do the transfer. But after I placed the order they changed mind, stating that it was undercutting their sales. It was quite a doing to find an FFL who was willing to do the transfer. Those were the days.
-TL
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Mike Irwin
Staff
About 10 years ago I bought a Smith & Wesson 411 in .40. I wasn't looking for a .40 at the time, but for $300 OTD for what was almost a new gun (showed very little evidence of having been shot) I couldn't pass it up.
Friend of mine gave me a bunch of police surplus .40 HP ammo (Winchester and Hornady).
It's now my nightstand gun.
Friend of mine gave me a bunch of police surplus .40 HP ammo (Winchester and Hornady).
It's now my nightstand gun.
I remember when you can buy used guns on Ebay..... man that was fantastic. I also remember the era well when people said AR-15s were nothing but glorified poodle shooters. If you want to survive the coming Y2K collapse and be able to fight off the "Klinton" FEMA Army with Black Helicopters and the Chinese/UN Invasion Force. You needed .45 ACP and .308 Winchester.
I also remember how people said .40 S&W was short and weak and broke wrists and guns at the same time.
wild cat mccane
New member
Truth be told though, a cheap 40 gun now will probably, more than likely, be sold cheaply later.
It's the ammo right now that is the head liner where material costs should be much greater and production is significantly dwarfed by 9mm. And yet, it's a good time in 40 ammo.
The CZ 40, there aren't many and it will always be the case that 40 in "race" guns are about making Major.
The TS2 40 blue is currently 200 less than the TS2 9mm Blue. But the new TS2 Orange is the exact same 9/40.
It's the ammo right now that is the head liner where material costs should be much greater and production is significantly dwarfed by 9mm. And yet, it's a good time in 40 ammo.
The CZ 40, there aren't many and it will always be the case that 40 in "race" guns are about making Major.
The TS2 40 blue is currently 200 less than the TS2 9mm Blue. But the new TS2 Orange is the exact same 9/40.
Now I am older. I start shaking my head when I see everyone put muzzle brake on .223, or even .22rf, guns. Not only the table, but the whole world, has turned. What a bunch of...
-TL
Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
I remember when I bought guns out of the back pages of magazines or from the Sears/Wards/Penny catalog and they were mailed to my house. And bought ammo at the gas station or drug store. That was long before eBay was even a dream.
The Marlin 1895 in .45-70 was introduced in 1972. The current production .44 Magnum chambered 1894 was introduced in 1969.
TruthTellers
New member
I was big into .40 when I started 10 yrs ago, but that interest waned once I got into reloading and found out 10mm Glocks could shoot .40 w/o issue. I won't sell those I have now, but I'm not really into getting anymore. The only ones that I have thought about getting would be the Beretta Px4 for the recoil reducing action and a Kahr MK40 as a small single stack steel frame .40 isn't something I currently have.
Highly unlikely those will ever be sold for a low price just cuz they're in 40.
The most repeated this I see why people say not to buy the cheap .40s is the ammo is significantly more. Well, one, I have seen Aluminum 40 going for $16 a box and the defensive ammo is going to be the same price as 9. Further, if you don't shoot thousands of rounds a year, it's not burning a hole in your pocket.
That's what 5.7 is for.
Highly unlikely those will ever be sold for a low price just cuz they're in 40.
The most repeated this I see why people say not to buy the cheap .40s is the ammo is significantly more. Well, one, I have seen Aluminum 40 going for $16 a box and the defensive ammo is going to be the same price as 9. Further, if you don't shoot thousands of rounds a year, it's not burning a hole in your pocket.
That's what 5.7 is for.
TruthTellers
New member
I don't think it's hate for the caliber itself as it is effective for defense, but more to do with ammo cost compared to 9mm. Since 9mm is a decent caliber itself and costs less and holds more rounds most people are going to figure that whatever extra the .40 has over the 9mm isn't worth it to them.
Just because a caliber has lost popularity doesn't mean it's going to lose all demand, what I believe is going to happen is as 10mm gains in popularity in the future and people come to understand .40 is able to be shot in them and is generally more commonly found, .40 will be the practice ammo of choice while the defense ammo carried will be in 10mm.
40 still has an advantage over 10mm in 9mm sized guns. It is the Goldilocks caliber. Not too much kick and power like 10 mm and with better stopping power than either 9mm or 45. Reasonably big magazine capacity and able to fit in compact guns that are easier to carry. In truth 40 beats up small framed guns like Kahrs and is only marginally more effective than 9 but costs a lot more for training. The agencies that are rushing back to 9 are doing so because of current ammo costs with the argument it is as good as the 40 and holds more round but we all know there are trade offs for the smaller 9 that even with the 147 grain loads is just not putting out the juice of the 180 grain 40 and no way a 115 or 124grain 9, has the same stopping power as a full house 155 grain or 165 grain 40 when you look at energy dump. "As good as 40" is relative. I'm sure there was a difference in proficiency scores for small officers too who had never shot a gun before the academy just like the FBI found when downloading the 10mm.
The crazy deals on .40 S&W are what got me into the cartridge in the first place and it has since become my favorite.
I got my first way back in 2019 when I was pretty much broke but in need of a new carry gun that was powerful enough to work in a pinch against hogs. I found a Smith & Wesson Sigma SW40VE in a gunshop I frequented at the time LNiB for $199, so I put it on layaway, payed it off within a couple weeks once I got paid, then began carrying it. Up until then I had more or less completely ignored .40 S&W, viewing is as a goofy intermediate cartridge with more cons than pros, but once I had actually shot one I found that I really enjoyed it.
Now I own a total of four pistols chambered in .40 S&W, the SW40VE, a 4006TSW, Performance Center M&P40 Shield, and an M&P40c. All of which cost me less than $400, with the most recent addition being a police trade-in M&P40c with Trijicon night sights, 3 magazines, and a hard case for $269.
In many ways, I feel like the FBI dropping .40 S&W worked wonders for its popularity on the civilian market because the high availability and low prices made them extremely attractive, then once they were actually in peoples hands folks quickly discovered that a lot of the supposed drawbacks of the cartridge such as snappy recoil, slow follow up shots, poor accuracy, and especially the catastrophic failures were grossly exaggerated.
I honestly think that eventually, — once the deals have dried up — the cartridge will make a comeback in a similar fashion to 10mm due to demand generated by all the folks who sing its praises, leaving newcomers to want to experience the mighty cartridge which was too hot for the FBI to handle.
I got my first way back in 2019 when I was pretty much broke but in need of a new carry gun that was powerful enough to work in a pinch against hogs. I found a Smith & Wesson Sigma SW40VE in a gunshop I frequented at the time LNiB for $199, so I put it on layaway, payed it off within a couple weeks once I got paid, then began carrying it. Up until then I had more or less completely ignored .40 S&W, viewing is as a goofy intermediate cartridge with more cons than pros, but once I had actually shot one I found that I really enjoyed it.
Now I own a total of four pistols chambered in .40 S&W, the SW40VE, a 4006TSW, Performance Center M&P40 Shield, and an M&P40c. All of which cost me less than $400, with the most recent addition being a police trade-in M&P40c with Trijicon night sights, 3 magazines, and a hard case for $269.
In many ways, I feel like the FBI dropping .40 S&W worked wonders for its popularity on the civilian market because the high availability and low prices made them extremely attractive, then once they were actually in peoples hands folks quickly discovered that a lot of the supposed drawbacks of the cartridge such as snappy recoil, slow follow up shots, poor accuracy, and especially the catastrophic failures were grossly exaggerated.
I honestly think that eventually, — once the deals have dried up — the cartridge will make a comeback in a similar fashion to 10mm due to demand generated by all the folks who sing its praises, leaving newcomers to want to experience the mighty cartridge which was too hot for the FBI to handle.