.380 use on real gunfight

TexasSeaRay said:
Had an AUSA hit a big, leather-clad biker...died
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What kind of bike? Nice Harley? Fair price?

It was a .380 ACP, heh? But I've been reading here that a teeny little caliber like that is simply not enough gun...
 
What kind of bike? Nice Harley? Fair price?

It was a .380 ACP, heh? But I've been reading here that a teeny little caliber like that is simply not enough gun...
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The guy was a Bandito wannabe. This was back in the 80's during the Bandito federal trials in Texas. Jacked up methhead took it upon himself to stalk one of the AUSA's who was prosecuting. The wannabe followed prosecutor to a take-out restaurant and then accosted him with a knife. AUSA happened to be a former Marine who carried a PPK. A few seconds later, the AUSA was fine and short three Glasers. The Banditos were now short one wannabe and facing the wrath of the prosecutorial team.

Don't remember what kinda Harley this loser was riding. One of the U.S. Marshals seized it. I looked it over, but I honestly don't know one Harley from another.

Calibre wars/arguements amuse the hell out of me. Those who can always put their bullet wherever they want whenever don't really care what round they have so long as the weapon firing the round can be trusted.

A .38 Revolver round holds a lot more powder than a .380 auto round.
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It can, but it doesn't always.

I load 3.4 grains of AA#2 in my 380ACP rounds, but only 2.7 grains of Bullseye in my 38 Spcl WC rounds.

Jeff
 
TexasSeaRay said:
Calibre wars/arguements amuse the hell out of me. Those who can always put their bullet wherever they want whenever don't really care
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I agree. However I think the guys who shot IPSC have a leg up on the rest of us idiots.

The concept of "hurrying slowly" has always focused me on doing the basics (half breath, front sight, smooth take-up) while the rest of the world was banging and clanging around.

While my eyesight has always been good, Terry convinced me to use those great big Millett red/white sights, and it did help me focus on the front sight. Yikes, how could you miss it!

Tussey.jpg


However, I'm comfortable with quality, reliable functioning .380 ACPs. I've even thought about installing some form of brightly colored Novak or Millett sights suitable for the smaller CZ 83.

You've got to hit it to win it, and I do just fine with my little pistols.
 
Sadly the last officer to get killed in the line of duty here was shot with a .380 The bullet missed his vest. He was a nice young man by all accounts. There is no guarantee one way or the other with gunshot wounds.

I carried a .380 PPK/S for years & liked it alot. Never worried about the round. I was younger then. The PPK was easy to carry & I liked the controls. Not as many competing guns when I got it though. I bought used from my high school teacher after I graduated.

The only bad thing is the safety is opposite of some pistols, if you switch back & forth it can mess with you. I assume the Bersa is the same.
 
@Silvanus -- does it mean, that folks who settle for bersa are considered 2nd class citizen?

.380 recieved alot of under estimates..i even heard comments like better than a stick. would you feel undergun if what you got is a tiny 380 like bersa, where as others are bulging with their well-decorated 1911?
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What the...:confused:

Second class citizen?

I'm just stating a fact. I wanted to clarify some misconceptions a few people got about European police. A lot of Americans believe that "we" think of 7.65mm and 9mm kurz as "big calibers". That's just not true.

Did I make fun of police forces who have to rely on old, obsolete pistols in marginal calibers? No. I'm just saying that those who use guns like that, use them because they can't afford new equipment. That's a fact and has nothing to do with what I think of a certain caliber or not.

I recently read an article in a firearms magazine about a Portuguese "Swat" team. They received training from an American/Portuguese Security company. They had a lot 7.65 Berettas and some old German SMGs. They certainly didn't use those because they are good guns. The Berettas jammed constantly. They are slowly upgrading to Glocks and MP5s now.

And just for the record, I personally am a big fan of the 9mm Luger. My HD gun is a Glock 17 loaded with 9mm FMJs. A lot of people think a 9mm is not enough and only the most expensive hollow point will do the job. I don't care about that. I know what I can do with that gun and ammo and that is more than enough. And I would definitely not feel "undergunned" with a .380 Bersa. I think for self defence a 9mm short is good enough. But I can't carry anyway and there are many compact 9mms, so I don't see the point of owning one.
 
I do not know about wound ability but my Bersa has had over 700 rounds of different types/brands and never had a hiccup. A good, accurate and reliable handgun.
 
I have both a Bersa .380 and a Walther PPK/S. Minimum jamming problems with all types of ammo. Bersa is more fun to shoot. It seems I usually grab my S & W Model 442 J Frame in 38 Special. It has ALWAYS been 100 %.
 
Lawyer Daggit said:
I am sure a perpetrator would not walk two blocks if both lungs were perforated.
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I also believe that. I also am a believer that shot placement trumps just about every aspect of cartridge debates.

And just as small caliber weapons are responsible for most of the fatalities recorded, just where do you draw the line?

When do you decide on a .32 rather than a .25, or a .38 SPL over a .380 ACP?
 
I also believe that. I also am a believer that shot placement trumps just about every aspect of cartridge debates.
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Of course. That's not even an issue. I could kill a man with a safety pin if I could place it right where I wanted to. Shot placement is hands down the most important thing, but it's also hands down the thing that we have the least control over in a gunfight. So to debate shot placement vs. anything else is meaningless.

I just switched from JHP in my guns to FMJ in all of them. For the past couple of years I've firmly believed that 380 and below should use FMJ, and 38 spl and above could use JHP (38 being kind of on the edge).

However, I've since switched to FMJ for legal reasons. I think they do an adequate job and I'm more worried about post-shooting prosecution than I am about getting shot. From my legal studies I've realized that if a DA decides to charge you and you used JHP, it will look very bad. And if a perp sues you after the fact, you can bet his lawyer will play the JHP card.
 
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