.357 sig

It's said the 357mag has the potential of causing permanent hearing loss when shot indoors. Probably similar with 357Sig. Too much for sport or defense to many including myself.
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While the 357SIG is a bit louder than say 9mm, at this point, I really dont think its going to make much of a difference what I would shoot indoors, including a .22lr.


One possible minus, the short neck of the 357 Sig cart. may cause neck tension issues when reloaded.
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Reloading for it isnt hard at all, and the neck tension, bullet set back issue, is really not an issue at all, if you use the right load. Ive inadvertently resized .40 cases into 357SIg cases, which shortens the neck even more, and they were still fine.
 
I have two FNH 40 S&W pistols. One is hammer fired the other is striker fired. On a lark (toy) I got a 357 Sig barrel that will work in either.

I found that the 357 sig was a tad more accurate than when I shoot the 40 S&W. The first time I shot it the range I was pleasantly surprised. Just looking to shoot it more, I shot at a tree stump on a hill that is just past the 75 yard berm. I fired at it several times for grins and giggles and hit about a foot away from my aim. I could not do that with my 40 or a 9mm.

It is fun to shoot. Because of penetration I would not use it as a primary bedside weapon, I have a FNX 45 for that. The 357 Sig rides in my truck and of course I can always put the 40 barrel back in.

I doubt I would have purchased a dedicated 357 sig platform. I still like the 40 a tad better. The barrel swap out for about 170 bucks made it a no brainer for another toy. And it does have viable uses.
 
Have a similar setup. Glock 35 AR15COM, with a .357 Sig barrel. I converted it back to regular Glock as for the fancy mag well but it's still a jazzed up Glock!

Paid not quite $500 for it at a pawnshop for that 35.

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And a Glock 17 I got this week for $348 bucks! Could not pass that deal up.

The .357 Sig barrel is made by Storm Lake and at 50 yards it will shoot 5 inch groups (I know cause I've done it several times!) And in 1 minute I can change the barrel back to it's .40 original. And it's the same size as the GI 1911 but a bit lighter.

Deaf
 

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It would probably make a good military round. It duplicates the performance of the .357 magnum which has proven stopping power and good long range characteristics. The bottleneck case should mean it feeds well.
 
kozak6 said:
One plus of the .357 Sig is that police trades in this caliber tend to be super cheap because no one wants them.
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Another plus is that AFAIK nearly every commonplace .357 Sig pistol uses the same magazine and recoil spring as the corresponding .40 S&W model, allowing super-easy caliber conversion with only a barrel swap.

(Other posters have hinted at this but stopped just short of stating it outright. :))
 
Personally I like the round. It has excellent ballistics and is fun to shoot. I hate to hear people whine about recoil on this round because even though it is snappy, it does not kick as bad as a .40 cal, and its easier to control and regain your target. Plus it makes me laugh when I read grown men online pouting about the recoil from the .357 Sig, because the only gun my mother owns and carries is a Glock 33 and she has no problem at all with the recoil and she is a little, skinny, 53 year old woman and she shoots it like a champ with no complaints. She can smooth outshoot me with a pistol while using that gun.
I also have shot it extensively in her subcompact Glock 33 with no problem with recoil. But a .40 cal is unpleasant for me to shoot even in a full size model compared to her tiny subcompact G33.
Now it is louder than sin I will say that, and it does have some decent muzzle flash. But I really could care less about that. And ammo is kind of expensive but online you can find good bulk deals. And ammo isn't super common locally compared to other calibers, but I can find it at any time at at least one of the LGS in town.
So to sum it up it is the caliber I trust my mothers life with.
 
"The 9mm is a 35,000 psi, +P is 38,500 psi and +P+ is 40,000 psi. The 357 SIG is a 40,000 psi. Bullets of the same weight will approximate the same velocities in SIG and +P+."
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I would very seriously and very geniuinely ask specifically -WHO- at Speer would give such an answer?

Admittedly, I myself do not know if those listed pressure spec's are true, but if they are true -- they simply don't add up.

If you run 40k PSI in a 9x19 piece of brass with a 124gr slug
and...
You run 40k PSI in a .357 Sig piece of brass with a 124gr slug
...there is simply going to be more propellent and more gas volume in the larger case. Same pressure but with more propellent will not return the "same" result.
 
Here's the whole reply......

********: to some extent you're correct. The 9mm is a 35,000 psi, +P is
38,500 psi and +P+ is 40,000 psi. The 357 SIG is a 40,000 psi. Bullets
of the same weight will approximate the same velocities in SIG and +P+.
The difference is gun construction, all 9mm's will not handle +P+. All
of the 357 SIG's are made to handle the pressures for the caliber.
Shoot Straight!
Coy Getman
CCI/SPEER Technical Service
2299 Snake River Ave.
Lewiston, ID 83501
(800) 627-3640 ext. #5351 (pound key must be used)


If its not something you want to hear because youre a 357SIG guy, I feel your pain. I was really into the round when I sent them an email asking the difference between the two, and if the 357SIG passed a magical velocity barrier giving it better performance. The reason was a discussion not unlike this.

As I said earlier, from what I saw shooting both into things other than paper, they seemed to act about the same and give the same results, so I dont think Speer was off in their response.

...there is simply going to be more propellent and more gas volume in the larger case. Same pressure but with more propellent will not return the "same" result.
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Regardless, of the amount or volume, the velocities are not all that different. That seems to confirm what Speer said.
 
The science doesn't prove this. They are really the same, terminally speaking. You're not going to have a lethal difference when both cartridges are far pass the threshold of energy and sectional density needed to fully perforate a human body.
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By the same logic then, there's little difference between the 9mm +P+ and the 9mm +P. Or for that matter the standard pressure 9mm.

It's like saying a battleship falling on you is more lethal than a brick house falling on you. Is there actually a difference? Does it really matter?
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That would make the .38 Spl 130 gr FMJ, a known "perforator", what....a Buick? a refrigerator?

The .357 Sig was designed to do just one thing. Duplicate the ballistics of the .357 Magnum 125gr from a 4" barrel in an autoloader. This it does.

The reason was the .357 load has a proven track record (in actual shootings) over a long period of time as a highly effective round. The jury is still out on the 9mm +P+

Here's the whole reply......

********: to some extent you're correct. The 9mm is a 35,000 psi, +P is
38,500 psi and +P+ is 40,000 psi. The 357 SIG is a 40,000 psi. Bullets
of the same weight will approximate the same velocities in SIG and +P+.
The difference is gun construction, all 9mm's will not handle +P+. All
of the 357 SIG's are made to handle the pressures for the caliber.
Shoot Straight!
Coy Getman
CCI/SPEER Technical Service
2299 Snake River Ave.
Lewiston, ID 83501
(800) 627-3640 ext. #5351 (pound key must be used)
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This is of course true, but proves little. It does not mean all ammunition companies load everything to the exact SAMMI pressure. That's the standard maximum working pressure. Given the discrepancies in chronograph results between 9mm and .357 Sig, it safe to assume they don't.

Likely they load the 9mm on the light side given all the guns out there that are older and/or of dubious manufacture. The .357 Sig has a much newer installed base, and the guns were all designed and manufactured with modern design knowledge and materials.

Really, I'm a fan of neither.

http://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2013/11/13/9-mm-versus-357-sig/
 
+p+ = .357 Sig?


Hahahahaha..... No.

Get a Glock 31 and Glock 17 (I have both AND two chronographs BTW.)

Chrono both using top loads (yes +p+ Winchester 127 gr, which is what I use in my Glock 26) and you will find the .357 Sig wins hands down.

Deaf
 
Yea, it wins number wise, and that seems to be about it. I just didnt see that there was much difference performance wise, when comparing them. Not that my comparisons were anything scientific. Still, the bullets seemed to perform about the same, and penetration was about the same.

One thing I did notice between the two was how some guns hold up, or dont. I had a 31 and I have a number of 17's. My 31 didnt hold up as well as the 17's, and its slide was taking a pretty good beating, and showed no sign of stopping. I actually had to address the peening with a file, as I scliced my finger on the sharp edges while cleaning.

My one 17 has more +P+ 9mm through it, than the 31 had 357SIG, and shows none of the wear issues. In fact, it recently passed 92,000 rounds, and still shows less wear than the 31, which only had less than 5000 rounds of 357SIG through it.

The 31 was actually a big part of what convinced me to make the switch, as I had something that really allowed apples to apples comparison as far as shooting went. As I said earlier, the only thing I found noticeable, was the 31 was a bit louder.
 
.357 Sig wins hands down.... again.
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Whatever floats your boat man. :D

Ive seen those charts too, and all the SD type ammo pretty much performs to the same standards. Thats been pretty much accepted for awhile now.

Thats another reason I went back to 9mm. Compared to the others, its cheap, I can practice a lot more, its easier to shoot with in most platforms, and it normally has the largest capacity.

And I ain't worried about gun wear after 50 k rounds.
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I was worried at less than 1000.

50,000 aint all that much either. ;)
 
By the same logic then, there's little difference between the 9mm +P+ and the 9mm +P. Or for that matter the standard pressure 9mm.
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Exactly. Now you're getting it. They all pass the sectional density and energy requirements to do exactly the SAME THING.

Look at the tract wounds of various types of handgun rounds.

https://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Se...ense_Ammo_FAQ/

.357 Sig wins hands down.... again.
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Once again people post things that don't matter. Wound tracks and all that stuff is non sense and is not what ballistics gel was ever designed for. Ballistics gel was designed to measure penetration depth and wound profiles, not how much "damage" a projectile does.

Gel is homogeneous. The human body is heterogeneous with air space, different densities of tissue, and different geometries of structures. The variables involved are simply too great to use ballistics gel as a medium to measure "damage".
 
A .357 Sig is, if you use top ammo, a true .357 Magnum of 1930s vintage.
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Possibly, if fired from a 4" barrel and restricted to only the 125gr (or lighter) bullets.

The .357 Sig was created to do one thing, replicate the .357 Magnum 125gr load fired in a 4" barrel revolver, in a 9mm size semi auto.

That .357 load was touted as the "king" of street stops, and having that level of performance in a 9mm size semi was felt to be a good thing.

The .357 Sig does not, and CANNOT match the .357 Magnum in any other load, bullet weight or barrel length.

Do not blindly accept statements about the .357 Sig being the equal of the .357 Mag in general. And don't get too hung up on a handful of FPS, either.

Statements of how they are similar bullet weights at similar speed are meaningless unless you have a definition of "similar" specifically spelled out.

Variations of as much as 100fps are not unheard of, in similar guns with similar barrel lengths, firing the same ammunition. Usually the variation is much less, but there is variation.

Also I am curious, since I don't buy any, but just how "cheap" is that 9mm+P+ ammo???

I have several 9mm autos, none of them rated for +p, let alone +p+, so I don't buy it. When I want more than a standard 9mm, I go to a larger round.

I'm pretty confident my Contender will handle 9mm+P+, but that's not an auto pistol.:rolleyes:
 
Didn't say in 'general'... if you can read my post. And didn't say 4 inch barrels.. if you can read my post.

But a 125gr bullet at 1600 fps is TRUE .357 Magnum performance, in the 800+ ft/lb area. And the .357 Sig was made for combat.. not as a field weapon (as was the .357 Magnum) so using heavier ammo is no real consideration.

As for the tract wounds, again work by Massad Ayoob and others do show the 125 gr .357 Magnum load as being one of the best stoppers and you will find the .357 Sig, in the 125 gr loads, even more powerful if top loads by such as Double Tap are used.

And yes the tracts photoed by the .357 Magnum look a lot like the .357 Sig loads and NOT like the 9mm loads in +p or +p+.

As for +p+ rated firearms in 9mm Glock 'suggest' the use of SAAMI spec ammo but only 'suggest'. There is no prohibition from using +p+. They say it 'may shorten the component life' of the firearm.

Oh, and since both the .40 and .357 Sig versions of the Glocks go 50k rounds at least, I see no worries of the guns wearing out. One can easily just get a 9mm Lone Wolf barrel and use sedate 9mm ammo for practice most of the time, that is if one worries their gun will wear out after 50k rounds.

Deaf
 
Also I am curious, since I don't buy any, but just how "cheap" is that 9mm+P+ ammo???
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Ive always paid about $26 or so a box of 50 online. Most of the "premium" type ammo, regardless of caliber, is in that range.

Oh, and since both the .40 and .357 Sig versions of the Glocks go 50k rounds at least, I see no worries of the guns wearing out.
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It is curious though, that Glocks in both calibers, seem to be the only ones that exhibit slide peening. My 31 was a lot worse than the couple of .40's I saw that had it, and was showing no sign of letting up, as I was told it would. It was also quite apparent from the git go.

What I do find interesting is though, the 17's, shooting +P+ (Winchester shows their 127 gran Ranger T's at 42,000 psi, same range as the 357SIG and .40), dont show the same wear, and in fact, really nothing other than some minor finish wear.
 
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