.357 for bear
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azredhawk44
Moderator
I suggest you only go bigger if you know of a specific handgun and specific ammunition offering that you can get, with which you have great familiarity and accuracy.
Much better to hit with a .357/180 than to miss with a .44/300.
If you're willing to spend the money on gun/ammo/trigger time to get good at a new platform, then go for it. Otherwise take the .357.
Much better to hit with a .357/180 than to miss with a .44/300.
If you're willing to spend the money on gun/ammo/trigger time to get good at a new platform, then go for it. Otherwise take the .357.
The 180 hard cast is the right ammo to feed a .357 Mag for bear defense, but you've got to factor in just what you are defending yourself against.
Coastal Brownies. Kodiaks, for that matter. They don't come any bigger than that.
If it were me, I wouldn't go with anything smaller than a .44 similarly loaded with hot heavy hardcast. Or, better yet, a shotgun with slugs or something like a .45-70 guide gun.
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Then again, azredhawk44 has a good point. If you are already proficient with the .357 Mag, and it isn't in the cards to upgrade and familiarize yourself with the upgrade, then you are better off with the .357 Mag. Those 180s are still some potent medicine.
Coastal Brownies. Kodiaks, for that matter. They don't come any bigger than that.
If it were me, I wouldn't go with anything smaller than a .44 similarly loaded with hot heavy hardcast. Or, better yet, a shotgun with slugs or something like a .45-70 guide gun.
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Then again, azredhawk44 has a good point. If you are already proficient with the .357 Mag, and it isn't in the cards to upgrade and familiarize yourself with the upgrade, then you are better off with the .357 Mag. Those 180s are still some potent medicine.
I have lived in and traveled to various locales in Alaska, read Alaska resident, hunt bear, see bear every year when out, and still gotta go with bear spray first.
Look at the numbers, zero deaths or serious injury every single time bear spray has been used up here against bear attack/charge since bear spray was introduced. (Reference Anchorage Daily News. I have posted link on TFL before, or search adn.com)
Otherwise I am going to go with the 12 gauge with slugs, I do. I use a 10mm as back up to bear spray and 12 gauge in that order. (Sometimes carry 300 H&H mag hunting rifle.)
I personally do not trust any weapon that I would not hunt the animal with to defend myself against an attack by that same animal.
For non fiction reading concerning Alaska bear attacks, try Larry Kaniut's Alaska Bear Tales.
Look at the numbers, zero deaths or serious injury every single time bear spray has been used up here against bear attack/charge since bear spray was introduced. (Reference Anchorage Daily News. I have posted link on TFL before, or search adn.com)
Otherwise I am going to go with the 12 gauge with slugs, I do. I use a 10mm as back up to bear spray and 12 gauge in that order. (Sometimes carry 300 H&H mag hunting rifle.)
I personally do not trust any weapon that I would not hunt the animal with to defend myself against an attack by that same animal.
For non fiction reading concerning Alaska bear attacks, try Larry Kaniut's Alaska Bear Tales.
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Deterrent? NO!
Defense? possible.
Never heard of a bear who decided not to attack because you had a gun. No deterrent there.
Defense? Possibly. IF you can keep you nerve and make the shot(s). 180 (or even 158/160gr) hardcast would be the preferred bullet.
I would advise something bigger, if practical. But a .357 will do the job, IF you can get it in the right spot. Defensive shooting against a bear is a lot different than hunting. Using the bear spray, or giving the bear your fish, and running away (or backing away rapidly) would seem to be much better ideas.
Defense? possible.
Never heard of a bear who decided not to attack because you had a gun. No deterrent there.
Defense? Possibly. IF you can keep you nerve and make the shot(s). 180 (or even 158/160gr) hardcast would be the preferred bullet.
I would advise something bigger, if practical. But a .357 will do the job, IF you can get it in the right spot. Defensive shooting against a bear is a lot different than hunting. Using the bear spray, or giving the bear your fish, and running away (or backing away rapidly) would seem to be much better ideas.
RainbowBob
New member
That is an interesting piece of information, AZAK. I wouldn't have guessed it.
I wouldn't use a .357 for that purpose. I would use much bigger. I own a BFR 45-70 and the thing shoots like my Ruger Redhawk .44 mag. I love it. I wold take it though as it ai single action and in a charge situation you would not have tine to think about pulling hammer back. I would take either my Ruger or my Colt Anaconda 45 LC. I would use the hard heavy bullets loaded hot.
Having been chased in Montana while fly fishing, I never go out without my .44. I gave the bear my fish and thankfully my van was close and I ran to it and got in and left! Scary, and I had no time to think about anything! Just fight or flight instinct!
Be careful and have fun!
Mel
Having been chased in Montana while fly fishing, I never go out without my .44. I gave the bear my fish and thankfully my van was close and I ran to it and got in and left! Scary, and I had no time to think about anything! Just fight or flight instinct!
Be careful and have fun!
Mel
Back when my brother lived in Fairbanks,he told me,at that time,there was not one recorded incident of a person using a handgun to defend themselves against a Brown/grizzly/kodiak attack...who survived.I cannot document that,don't know if it is true.That was back when the Redhawk just came out and the Freedom Arms .454 was still in process.
A chopped,bubba'd Yugo 8x57,or a Moisin Nagant 7.62x54,maybe an 18 in bbl.ghost ring and tritium shotgun bead,and a sling? A guide gun in 45-70?
Or,even a BFR in .450 Marlin?
One really good suggestion was reading Kanut's book,Bear Tales.Non-fiction.
It will help you more than most advice
A chopped,bubba'd Yugo 8x57,or a Moisin Nagant 7.62x54,maybe an 18 in bbl.ghost ring and tritium shotgun bead,and a sling? A guide gun in 45-70?
Or,even a BFR in .450 Marlin?
One really good suggestion was reading Kanut's book,Bear Tales.Non-fiction.
It will help you more than most advice
Actually, bears know what gunshots are!
My family took a dream vacation to Alaska when I was about 12. We were dropped off at a lake by floatplane...dad had a bolt-gun 30-06 that I'm now pretty sure was a sporterized Springfield. Being former Brit army and trained on Enfields, a boltgun made sense.
Anyways. We came out of the cabin one morning to find the absolute cutest little pair of GRIZ CUBS!!! playing on the porch. Oops.
Pop handled it right. He herded us hoomans inside, fired a couple rounds into the lake, slammed and bolted the door and crouched in mid-room quietly reloading...while telling all of us to shut up.
Sure enough, mama grabbed the babies and headed out of there pronto.
Because she knew what gunshots meant, and her fear of same would have been transmitted to the cubs in that instant.
So yeah, IF I spotted a bear at long enough range charging in that I couldn't yet take the headshot, and I had a 357, I'd consider a warning shot.
The other key thing is, you have to know how a bear's skull is laid out. The "forehead" is a lump of bone that anchors the jaw muscles, and can deflect a .44Mag or stronger. In some cases bears have been knocked out with a rifle shot to the forehead and then woke up and killed somebody. A bear's brain is low and rearward, you get to it through the eye sockets, cheekbones or snout, or upper portion of the open mouth. Basically aim dead on his nose, and be accurate to the next 3" or so either side or 2" top or bottom on a big one, a 6" by 4" oval more or less, and you can indeed kill him with a 357.
The problem is, if you miss by more than that, esp. windage, you will NOT screw up his shoulder the way a semi-miss with very hot hardcast 44Mag+P (Garrett or Buffalo Bore, with 45-70 or a slug-gun preferred!) on up can. That's the thing you're lacking with the 357: not killing power exactly, but the ability to knock him around with a semi-miss to help you stall for a better killing shot.
If it's a 200 to 300lb black bear, then the hottest 357 hardcasts DO have the ability to "knock him around" that way.
The best advice I can give you is get a can of bear spray. I live in Kodiak, I hunt and fish and hike and camp and all the wonderful outdoor advenures here. I carry bear spray along with my Glock 20 in 10mm. I carry DoubleTap WFNGC 200 or 230gr bullets.
I don't care what any of these guys on here that live 5,000 miles away from Kodiak tell you, you will not carry your 12ga or 45-70 fishing with you. You might try it once, get fed up with the hassle of trying to fish with it in the way (not to mention that some fo the places to fish are kinda hard to get to) and you'll leave it at home. That's where mine is. If you're a real good shot with your .357 then bring it with the hottest, heaviest loads you can find/handload. If you're just okay, bring it anyway and give me a call when you get up here.
The best defense against bears is to pay very close attention to what's goiing on around you. I've probably pulled my 10mm about 2 dozen times while fishing. Almost every time, about five seconds after I drew my weapon, a bear stuck his/her head out of the bushes. You back away slowly, never taking your eyes off him/her. This is also another reason you want to travel light; you want to be able to leave without having to worry about coming back to gather your gear. There's plenty of fish in the rivers, and they belong to the bears more so than they belong to us. And there ain't any fish worth getting killed or going to jail over. (Unjustified bear killings WILL see you sent to prison.)
Get some bear spray, and carry the gun that you're the most comfortable with. Honestly nothing short of a .375H&H will likely make that much of a difference if you're up against an angry sow with cubs nearby. Never fish alone and make sure your buddy has a gun too...
Good luck and let me know if you have any more questions about Kodiak.
Haha...
I don't care what any of these guys on here that live 5,000 miles away from Kodiak tell you, you will not carry your 12ga or 45-70 fishing with you. You might try it once, get fed up with the hassle of trying to fish with it in the way (not to mention that some fo the places to fish are kinda hard to get to) and you'll leave it at home. That's where mine is. If you're a real good shot with your .357 then bring it with the hottest, heaviest loads you can find/handload. If you're just okay, bring it anyway and give me a call when you get up here.
The best defense against bears is to pay very close attention to what's goiing on around you. I've probably pulled my 10mm about 2 dozen times while fishing. Almost every time, about five seconds after I drew my weapon, a bear stuck his/her head out of the bushes. You back away slowly, never taking your eyes off him/her. This is also another reason you want to travel light; you want to be able to leave without having to worry about coming back to gather your gear. There's plenty of fish in the rivers, and they belong to the bears more so than they belong to us. And there ain't any fish worth getting killed or going to jail over. (Unjustified bear killings WILL see you sent to prison.)
Get some bear spray, and carry the gun that you're the most comfortable with. Honestly nothing short of a .375H&H will likely make that much of a difference if you're up against an angry sow with cubs nearby. Never fish alone and make sure your buddy has a gun too...
Good luck and let me know if you have any more questions about Kodiak.
Haha...
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Kreyzhorse
New member
That's good stuff.......
Anyway, I'd certainly look at a 44 mag as I think the .357 is a bit light for a bear charge / attack.